Connecting a shaver point to a shower circuit.

[ChrisElectrical88]

Hi. I want to install a shaver point in a bathroom for a fussy landlord, but she only wants it to be used when the shower is on, not sure why. I am going to wire it off the shower circuit and cut down the cores so I can fit them all in 15A connector blocks in the loft. Is this ok? If not what regulation prevents thing?

 

[Zebra Stripe]

Hey Mech.......use a smiley:smilewinkgrin: It encourages friendly debate

 

[mechelec]

Sorry I Can't insert smileys on my generic tablet but believe me I am smiling.

i have been trying to encourage friendly debate and this subject seems to have rattled a few people.

Still waiting for a good reason though lol

 

[MDJ]

Thats the problem not one reply gave a sound answer why it should not be done.
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[mechelec]

Love it, toys out of the pram. Time for a sit on the naughty step I think.

 

[Hawkmoon]

Sorry I Can't insert smileys on my generic tablet but believe me I am smiling.

i have been trying to encourage friendly debate and this subject seems to have rattled a few people.

Still waiting for a good reason though lol

The problem here is what people consider 'bad practice'...

There is no 'bad practice' guide or 'good practice' regulation book so examples of 'bad practise' are based on one's:

Personal experience/opinions.
Something one has heard from a mentor that one respects (often in training/apprenticeship).
Interpretation of a regulation (admittedly not always entirely accurate).

There may be (technically) nothing wrong with what you propose, it just may be 'against the grain' in the opinion of many on this forum.

Bear in mind though - many on this forum (I will not mention names for the fear of swelling heads) are experienced and their view has merit, so when someone says, eg, fit a PIR to control your fan, take it as good advice!

 

[mechelec]

That is what I am challenging hawkmoon, blindly doing what has always been done and hopefully I have thrown some ideas in to weadle out the ones who have an understanding of electrical engineering and principles and those who don't and just do what everyone else does with no understanding why. The reaction of some says a hell of a lot.

Would the pir supply be taken from the shower circuit ? Lol

Thank you for your sensible reply it is much appreciated.

 

[mechelec]

Oh and for the record section 5 and 314 do not preclude the design either MDJ.

Please feel free to check it out. Maybe you could ask on a forum.

This is only leaves blindly following what has been done before.

It is funny when you look into something and push a bit, big holes start to appear in some once respected members knowledge. Spitting their dummies out only helps others to see it.

 

[guest119]

ZZZZZZZ ZZZZZZZZ ZZZZZZZZZZZ ZZZZZZZZZ ZZZZZZZZZ ZZZZZZZZZZ ZZZZ ZZZZZZZZZZ ZZZZZZZ ZZZZZ ZZZZZZ ZZZZZZZ ZZZZ.
Wake me up when it's over.

Boydy

 

[MDJ]

..........................

 

[Zebra Stripe]

I find this really odd that people are taking this personally. I think Mechelec is only asking to debate the technicalities not insinuate that this should be standard practice. Whats wrong with debate? Its how you learn new things

 

[KAS1]

I'd like to wire an outside light off my shower circuit is there a reg stating that I can't, if so which one, or is there a reg stating that I can lol please help .........

 

[mechelec]

..........................

Your most articulate reply yet well done.

What do you have to do to get a ban on here. Personnal attacks clearly don't matter from some. Maybe it is relative to post quantity not quality.

 

[tirfor]

Just seen this, you guys taking the mick out of me again.

On the point of just using a showers power supply to supply another circuit, I don’t think anybody has a definitive answer on why it cant be done.

And before you start taking the p**** I don’t mean another circuit like a socket for a garage or a shaver socket.:laugh3:

If its all done correctly it could probably be done safely, I just think as its not the norm and some people may not do it properly that it should be avoided if possible.

I would still love to get an answer though:8:

Debate is good, its how we better yourself:mellow:

 

[mechelec]

I'd like to wire an outside light off my shower circuit is there a reg stating that I can't, if so which one, or is there a reg stating that I can lol please help .........

Always pleased to help.

I think you will find reg 314.1.i will preclude your design as in the event of a fault in the shower you would lose the outside light thus causing a hazard and inconvenience.

Please feel free to ask any more questions you do not know the answer to we all have to start somewhere and these 5 week courses only touch the surface don't they.

 

[Zebra Stripe]

Clever way to stifle debate and close any exchange of ideas kas1. Hey Im not taking any sides here, but whats wrong debating makes you look in regs whether you think its a silly idea or not.

 

[KAS1]

Always pleased to help.

I think you will find reg 314.1.i will preclude your design as in the event of a fault in the shower you would lose the outside light thus causing a hazard and inconvenience.

Please feel free to ask any more questions you do not know the answer to we all have to start somewhere and these 5 week courses only touch the surface don't they.

Many thanks, can I also wire a bathroom fan from the shower?

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Or even a shaver point?

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Or my pond pump?

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Some people really are stupid IMO

 

[KAS1]

If a customer decided to ask me to uninstall a shower is there anything in the regs preventing me from pulling the 10mm cable up into the loft and terminating it into a massive JB and spurring (like a star figure in T&E 2.5mm ) say a dozen or more 13amp skts from it and say replacing the MCB with a 20amp device proving the Zs readings are all within the limits (no insulation and clipped direct) ?????? please advise as it could save a lot of money for me

 

[KAS1]

Please help Mechelec

 

[tirfor]

Come on nobody would think of connecting a pond pump to the shower. That's silly, but a shower to the fan, maybe as it is equipment being used which is suited to a particular room.:thinking:

 

[KAS1]

Come on nobody would think of connecting a pond pump to the shower. That's silly, but a shower to the fan, maybe as it is equipment being used which is suited to a particular room.:thinking:

What about mood lighting?

 

[Marvo]

Marvo! You've a lot to answer for!

Not sure what I did.....???

That is what I am challenging hawkmoon, blindly doing what has always been done

I don't have a problem with debate but after the last thread was closed by Admin because it was becoming contentious it would be considered poor form if not downright taking the ---- to open an identical thread without seeking permission.

Love it, toys out of the pram. Time for a sit on the naughty step I think.

This is blatent trolling. You were aware of what happened in the last thread before it was closed and this statement basically says to me that it's mission accomplished again second time around and has just earned you a ban.

What do you have to do to get a ban on here.

There's plenty of ways to get a ban, see my comments above.

I find this really odd that people are taking this personally. I think Mechelec is only asking to debate the technicalities not insinuate that this should be standard practice. Whats wrong with debate?

I have no problem with debate but as I explained above this thread looks like it was started with other motives. I'm leaving this thread open so the debate can continue.

This applies to everyone; if you feel you're unable to contribute without swearing, trolling, insulting other members or having emotional outbursts please don't post in it.

 

[KAS1]

May the debate continue ..............many thanks

 

[Plonker 3]

This applies to everyone; if you feel you're unable to contribute without swearing, trolling, insulting other members or having emotional outbursts please don't post in it.

Does this include people trying to get roundthe SWEAR FILTER?

I don't have a problem with debate but after the last thread was closed by Admin because it was becoming contentious it would be considered poor form if not downright taking the ---- to open an identical thread without seeking permission.

 

[ChrisElectrical88]

To be fair it's not identical and it was a genuine question which still nobody has answered :-(

 

[GMES]

Not sure what I did.....???


I don't have a problem with debate but after the last thread was closed by Admin because it was becoming contentious it would be considered poor form if not downright taking the ---- to open an identical thread without seeking permission.


This is blatent trolling. You were aware of what happened in the last thread before it was closed and this statement basically says to me that it's mission accomplished again second time around.

The combination of the above has just earned you a ban.


There's plenty of ways to get a ban, see my comments above.


I have no problem with debate but as I explained above this thread looks like it was started with other motives. I'm leaving this thread open so the debate can continue.

This applies to everyone; if you feel you're unable to contribute without swearing, trolling, insulting other members or having emotional outbursts please don't post in it.

Party pooper what we gonna do now marvo

 

[KAS1]

Shouldn't common sense prevail here, I'd like to see how some people justify their wiring methods, bring back 5 year apprentices

 

[Plonker 3]

Shouldn't common sense prevail here, I'd like to see how some people justify their wiring methods, bring back 5 year apprentices

The problem with that is, not the market is saturated with Electrical Trainee they will just be learning of people who have no idea themselves.

 

[KAS1]

It seems to me if there is not an exact reg number preventing something "it must be OK" instead of tried and tested methods that have evolved over time with knowledge and experience

 

[spark 68]

It seems to me if there is not an exact reg number preventing something "it must be OK" instead of tried and tested methods that have evolved over time with knowledge and experience

Not at all, alternative methods are another tool in the armoury to be applied when needed, and for the record I agreed with the gist of what Mechelec was trying to get across, not the bit about two FCUs though.

 

[KAS1]

Well all I can say is if I called a spark in to wire something in for me and he piggy backed off the shower circuit I'd question his ability as a tradesman lo c'mon if he said " alternative method" I'd show him the door or alternative exist lol

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exit............

 

[spark 68]

Why ?

The forward fusing rules are there for a very good reason, they are a valid set of regs, and very useful in certain circumstances.

I would not necessarily do what was suggested, but there might be circumstances where it would be useful.

 

[7029 dave]

Who in their mind would do this??, must be a wind up?, anyway you can not rationalize a cable to fit end of.

 

[spark 68]

There are none so blind as those that won't see.

I have used this rule to good effect by tapping off the cooker supply point to supply a cooker hood fused down to 3A with an FCU within 3m, wired in 1.5mm, tell me what regs I have broken ?

 

[Geordie Spark]

You stinking rotten bunch of sheep abusers...... go and pick on someone who doesn't have man flu and a half working brain!!!

:ack2:

PAH!! ..... You young kids today just have no staying power.

And to think you call yourself a Roadie!!

Shame on you!

 

[7029 dave]

Why ?

The forward fusing rules are there for a very good reason, they are a valid set of regs, and very useful in certain circumstances.

I would not necessarily do what was suggested, but there might be circumstances where it would be useful.

God help us my mentors would be turning in their graves and old college lectures!!! lol lol

 

[Plonker 3]

There are none so blind as those that won't see.

I have used this rule to good effect by tapping off the cooker supply point to supply a cooker hood fused down to 3A with an FCU within 3m, wired in 1.5mm, tell me what regs I have broken ?

Appendix 15

Fig 15a

(iii) connecting cookers, ovens and hobs with a rated power exceeding 2kW on their own dedicated radial circuit.

 

[spark 68]

I suggest you have a look at 434.2.1

 

[spark 68]

Appendix 15

Fig 15a

(iii) connecting cookers, ovens and hobs with a rated power exceeding 2kW on their own dedicated radial circuit.

That is for the supply side, mainly so as not to overload a single point on a RFC, that is why it is in App15 (15A)

 

[Plonker 3]

yes i know that, but the appendices goes on to mention about power circuits and specifically mentions ovens, but as usual the regs is down to interpretation.

 

[Plonker 3]

My interpretation of 434.2.1, is its more for busbar sytems with local switch fuses, and such like systems.