Discuss 2391-51 practical elements tomorrow top tips gratefully accepted in the Electrical Forum area at ElectriciansForums.net

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The last 17th was yellow , the first 18th is blue . There were three changes in the 17th edition. If my memory serves ; and it is not good now, the other two were red and green. I have the green one on my table now.
 
Try to look on C&G site at the assessors write up on failures. It is mostly people failing because they do not answer the question asked or mis read the question. Also seems there is a lot of confusion on earthing/bonding where people go wrong especially earth electrode testing. You need to know which is P1 and so on! Anyway you will see it on the comments from the assessor on C&G
Do you have a link to the city and guilds report you mention? I've searched their site and cant find any. Is it different now they are centre assessed and marked? Trying to find any info on the photo visual inspection task A part is difficult. Thanks
 
Do you have a link to the city and guilds report you mention? I've searched their site and cant find any. Is it different now they are centre assessed and marked? Trying to find any info on the photo visual inspection task A part is difficult. Thanks
The person who posted this no longer participates on the forum so you are not going to get a response.
 
The person who posted this no longer participates on the forum so you are not going to get a response.
Ah thanks. See if anyone else knows anything about it maybe. I know the pictures are numbered p1-p24 and you get a selection but from what I've seen they are very dated and not easy to interpret against city & guilds marking criteria.
 
Ah thanks. See if anyone else knows anything about it maybe. I know the pictures are numbered p1-p24 and you get a selection but from what I've seen they are very dated and not easy to interpret against city & guilds marking criteria.

Don’t worry about it, it’s easy. You’ll get given a pack containing about 10 photo’s. You then code them accordingly and give your reasons for it. Some may not have any faults to report. Remember to just go on what you see and not what might be happening.

If you’re doing the 2391-52, don’t worry about the 4 short questions part either as that’s straight forward too.

It’s the practical where everyone falls down.
Be safe, don’t do anything bone, leave yourself an hour for the paperwork and you’ll be sound.
 
Don’t worry about it, it’s easy. You’ll get given a pack containing about 10 photo’s. You then code them accordingly and give your reasons for it. Some may not have any faults to report. Remember to just go on what you see and not what might be happening.

If you’re doing the 2391-52, don’t worry about the 4 short questions part either as that’s straight forward too.

It’s the practical where everyone falls down.
Be safe, don’t do anything bone, leave yourself an hour for the paperwork and you’ll be sound.
Cheers for that. It's the 2391-52 I'm doing and have put lots of revision in for all the bits but Task A with the pictures is tricky to find anything to revise with. The Best Practice guide is good and the Napit codebreakers but as I dont get much practical experience doing fault coding anything would help!
 
Cheers for that. It's the 2391-52 I'm doing and have put lots of revision in for all the bits but Task A with the pictures is tricky to find anything to revise with. The Best Practice guide is good and the Napit codebreakers but as I dont get much practical experience doing fault coding anything would help!


Sorry I can’t be more help with the pictures but I really think you’ll be ok with it.

The faults are pretty easy to see, things like incorrect IP rating on top of consumer unit, cables not supported throughout length, broken accessory plates, access to live parts etc... from what I remember
 
Sorry I can’t be more help with the pictures but I really think you’ll be ok with it.

The faults are pretty easy to see, things like incorrect IP rating on top of consumer unit, cables not supported throughout length, broken accessory plates, access to live parts etc... from what I remember
Anything helps. That's a good start so thanks for the hints. Aiming not to sweat the small stuff but when they cost money to resit...
 
Anything helps. That's a good start so thanks for the hints. Aiming not to sweat the small stuff but when they cost money to resit...


Trust me, you won’t fail on the 4 short answers or the pictures...??

The only way it’ll cost you more money is if you balls up the practical or the 2 hour online exam.

Good luck with it all. ??
 
Trust me, you won’t fail on the 4 short answers or the pictures...??

The only way it’ll cost you more money is if you balls up the practical or the 2 hour online exam.

Good luck with it all. ??
Thanks. I'll hopefully know by the end of the week but see how long marking takes to get a result ????
 
Thanks. I'll hopefully know by the end of the week but see how long marking takes to get a result ????

To be fair, you should get your results right away. The last thing you’ll do is the online exam and you should know if you’ve passed everything else by then.
 
Cheers for that. It's the 2391-52 I'm doing and have put lots of revision in for all the bits but Task A with the pictures is tricky to find anything to revise with. The Best Practice guide is good and the Napit codebreakers but as I dont get much practical experience doing fault coding anything would help!

You would be shown a picture, and be expected to find faults; as you mention them, the assessor will keep asking if there are any more, until say you have found four. At that point he will stop and move onto the next photo. There will be around 6-7 obvious ones.

On the next photo it may be that you need to find 2 faults, so there will be around 4-5 faults etc.

And so on - each photo will have a varying number of issues, you will have to find a given number for that photo (it's usually 60-80% of the actual number of faults)

You will be given one photo which may look dodgy, but won't actually have anything strictly wrong with it. You will be expected to find no fault - it's frowned upon if not a fail if you make stuff up just 'cos you don't like what you see.

As long as you are familiar with the general issues, so say an exposed primary insulation - you need to know if that's C1,C2,C3,FI, or so on; when you see it, you would say - primary insulation exposed C? (Don't need the reg number here, but you do for the practical, its a fail if you don't show the correct reg per observation there.)

If you have codebreakers that would help to give an idea of what code per likely issue, if not just work on the idea:
Anything immediately dangerous - C1

Anything where something has to happen for it to be dangerous - C2

Anything that isn't dangerous, but is a significant issue - C3

Anything that isn't dangerous, and isn't significant issue; or isn't part of the 18th - no code, or just a helpful observation.

All the photos are of old installations for obvious reasons, it really wouldn't be a test to see you have the wide range of experience needed if it was all installations to the latest regs!!


To add, don't forget, you have no reference material for the photo aspect.
 
You would be shown a picture, and be expected to find faults; as you mention them, the assessor will keep asking if there are any more, until say you have found four. At that point he will stop and move onto the next photo. There will be around 6-7 obvious ones.

On the next photo it may be that you need to find 2 faults, so there will be around 4-5 faults etc.

And so on - each photo will have a varying number of issues, you will have to find a given number for that photo (it's usually 60-80% of the actual number of faults)

You will be given one photo which may look dodgy, but won't actually have anything strictly wrong with it. You will be expected to find no fault - it's frowned upon if not a fail if you make stuff up just 'cos you don't like what you see.

As long as you are familiar with the general issues, so say an exposed primary insulation - you need to know if that's C1,C2,C3,FI, or so on; when you see it, you would say - primary insulation exposed C? (Don't need the reg number here, but you do for the practical, its a fail if you don't show the correct reg per observation there.)

If you have codebreakers that would help to give an idea of what code per likely issue, if not just work on the idea:
Anything immediately dangerous - C1

Anything where something has to happen for it to be dangerous - C2

Anything that isn't dangerous, but is a significant issue - C3

Anything that isn't dangerous, and isn't significant issue; or isn't part of the 18th - no code, or just a helpful observation.

All the photos are of old installations for obvious reasons, it really wouldn't be a test to see you have the wide range of experience needed if it was all installations to the latest regs!!


To add, don't forget, you have no reference material for the photo aspect.
Thank you for the detailed and thoughtful response. Is that for the city and guilds exam as some places seem to do the EAL one which doesnt cover the same sections as far as I can see. The codebreakers is really useful as you mentioned though appears to take a slightly harder line than other examples in GN3 and the other guide I have but I dont think you have to be 100% in line with them as long as your judgement is on the safe side if I'm right.
 

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