ELECSA Certification Scheme Elecsa Part P Assessment

[Stormflex]

Hi all,

Just registered with Elecsa today - already bricking it about my assessment and I obviously haven't even got a date yet! I'm happy about the "office" element of the assessment and any Q&A but nervous about the practical/testing bit.

I'm just starting out after passing my EAL Domestic Electrical Installer in October last year. It's all a bit chicken and egg at this stage as you can't do any notifiable work to get the experience, etc. without your Part P. However, I have a CCU replacement job lined up which I will use for the site visit.

The bit I'm worrying about is demonstrating my testing whilst being overlooked by the assessor. I know what tests are required, etc. but like to be able to refer to something like GN3 to be sure of what I'm doing before proceeding. Is this allowed on your assessment or do you have to know it all instinctively? What are they really looking for?

Taking in to account that I am new at this, am I demonstrating a safe approach by doing this - as opposed to just jumping in and making an arse of it all?

Thanks for any advice,

Rich

 

[tonys]

How long does it take get the EAL?

 

[IQ Electrical]

Hi all,

Just registered with Elecsa today - already bricking it about my assessment and I obviously haven't even got a date yet! I'm happy about the "office" element of the assessment and any Q&A but nervous about the practical/testing bit.

I'm just starting out after passing my EAL Domestic Electrical Installer in October last year. It's all a bit chicken and egg at this stage as you can't do any notifiable work to get the experience, etc. without your Part P. However, I have a CCU replacement job lined up which I will use for the site visit.

The bit I'm worrying about is demonstrating my testing whilst being overlooked by the assessor. I know what tests are required, etc. but like to be able to refer to something like GN3 to be sure of what I'm doing before proceeding. Is this allowed on your assessment or do you have to know it all instinctively? What are they really looking for?

Taking in to account that I am new at this, am I demonstrating a safe approach by doing this - as opposed to just jumping in and making an arse of it all?

Thanks for any advice,

Rich

They're looking to see that you can SAFELY test your installation to BS7671:2008.

If you choose to have GN3 open for reference, so be it!

Just be Safe and have safe isolation branded into your brain!

 

[cbw]

EAL Domestic installer...........5 day wonder

 

[malcolmsanford]

EAL Domestic installer...........5 day wonder

Think the use of the words "wonder" and "5 Days" might be an oxymoron.

I've banged on about this but unless the CCU is in your own home, and your learning on that, shouldn't the customer expect the "electrician" they employ to be competant.

I really don't blame the OP as he is obviously trying to got on in life, I blame the courses for selling a flawed dream to not only him/her but to the public.

Rant over good morning CBW have a great day

 

[Stormflex]

Morning all,

Thanks IQ Electrical for taking the time to respond.

As soon as I saw your question tonys I knew where this one was going - so to answer your question...

I took 6 months to complete 2377, 2382 and EAL Domestic Installer. The course provider "allowed" up to 18 months but as malcomsanford rightly states, I want to get on in life so got my head in the books and cracked on with it.

I currently work as a sales manager for a defence company. I've been working in sales for about 16 years now and have basically had enough. This was what I chose as my route out. I appreciate that I haven't followed the time honoured route of an apprenticeship but unfortunately at my age and with the commitments I have that, financially, is just not an option.

Does the fact that I may not be able to perform each and every test instinctively make me incompetent? Is it not better that I double check in a reference book before I proceed and do the job right than try and blag it?

As it happens, I've got about 4 weeks to commit the test procedures to memory so I expect come the day I won't need any books. But it's nice to know I can refer to them if I need to.

Thanks and regards

Rich

 

[pritch]

The tests are fairly straight forward,if you keep going over and over using your own Consumer Unit to perform the tests and following Gn3 you should be fine come the day.You really dont want to be fumbling around with the gn3 on the day.

 

[nickblake]

Had my 3rd assesment last week ,make sure you have your PLI min 2 million , regs , on site guide, memorandum of supply regs , copies on test certs ,Test equipment calibration cert , the guys are realy good and try and help you the best they can they wont be little you by any means just relax , and make sure you got plenty of tea and coffee buiscuits at a push ,if your realy brave a kit kat chunky

 

[SirKit Breaker]

I am 5 or 6 years with Elecsa. You have nothing to fear. If you want GN3, OSG, BRB or even the Daily Sport, or all of them it isn't a problem.

What are they looking for?, well they just want to see someone who can work safely, work to the required standard, and be competent.
You won't get knocked back for minor mistakes, we all make them, myself included. Your assessor whoever he may be is there to help and point out what you may or may not be doing wrong, he is after all an Electrician just like us. They are human and appreciate tea and coffee, and a chat about the weather etc. If your sample job is there or there about, you meet the criteria, paperwork is all OK, and you can demonstrate competence, then you are home and dry.

Good luck

Howard

 

[tonys]

Good luck to you - Rich

I only asked because Ive only just noticed all these courses popping up.

Ill be retired by the time all the newbies catch up with me

 

[arjay]

Yes good luck got my second on the 28th of this month same assessor as last time very nice easy going man ready to give a few tips and helpful advice tea and biccies a must tho

 

[Stormflex]

Thanks to all for your feedback and support. Had a call from Elecsa this morning asking if I could make 26 January! Not much notice but I figured what's the point in delaying things. Better get a multipack of Kit Kat Chunky's in

 

[brucelee]

Good luck mate

 

[Clayden]

Good luck to you. Ive just turned 20 and been self employed for about a year. I had my elecsa assesment yesturday. My 'office' was my living room, at my parents house and due to being a sole trader i didnt have any sort of risk assesments, complaints log etc etc. For the assesment i just used there templates. The assesor turned up at 1.30 on time and didnt leave till 4.45 so it did last a long time. It was nothing to worry about, i showed him a 3 bed house i had rewired but had everything basic as you could get. TNC-S system, cealing rose in centre of room 3 or 4 sockets in each room etc etc. He asked to to perform the external loop impedance, cpc continuity on a 16A garage radial socket circuit and RCD test on the ring. Also had a look in some switches to make sure i had labelled correctly with sleaving. He did ask alot of questions and i did think he was trying to catch me out mainly because of my age. But i passed with no problems and he was very complimentive. It was abit of an anti-climax in the end beacuse i had been worrying all over christmas about the exam. Just dont panic and make sure you know what work is notifiable and non notifiable.

 

[Stormflex]

Congratulations mate, hope I'll be joining the ranks of Elecsa soon!

 

[brucelee]

Congratulations matey well done

 

[Stormflex]

Well after spending yesterday with a mate doing a load of testing in my own house I've bottled it. It's a long story but I've decided not to pursue this any further. Therefore, my brand new Fluke 1651B is listed in the "Forsale and Wanted Forum".

 

[IQ Electrical]

That's a shame, I hope you don't regret the decision!

 

[nickblake]

Storm flex i agree with IQ , think you may well regret it , the Elecsa guys are great guys , i wont say its easy its not hard either as long as your well prepaired , its a shame

 

[j.mawer]

Stormflex, given you have already spent lots on courses tools etc why not think on it over the weekend. I guess you made some mistakes yesterday, but that's learning everyone makes mistakes.
You won't get any less for your meter in a couple of weeks time. Why not give elecsa a bell and ask to shift the assessment by a month. If your mate's a spark see if you can do a bit of work with him, test your house a few more times and see how it goes, get some confidence back. Much better to have been through this than not in many respects, at least you now you know your limitations better.

Have a break for a couple of days, talk it over with the mrs or whatever, think about what you would be happy doing (e.g. small jobs) to build up your confidence then make a decision.

Good luck!

 

[Stormflex]

Thanks guys. I may have been a bit hasty this morning. Yesterday was just a nightmare and instead of instilling some confidence I felt it more highlighted my inadequacies. I've always struggled a bit with the testing side of things. I've had some 1st and 2nd fix experience and got on with that no problem but when it comes to testing...

I can never remember the combinations of main switch/RCDs/MCBs on or off, what temporary link goes from where to where, what do I need to remember to disconnect when doing an IR, etc.

I'm an honest guy and I'm thinking, if I can't do this in my own house then why should I expect customers to pay for it!

But, I'll have another go this weekend and see how I get on

 

[tony mc]

City and Guilds do a 2392 which is all about testing and initial verification there is a alot of threads on this forum about it and would be of benifit.

Have a look at the colledges in your area you might find a course near you which I am sure will help.

 

[peterb2428]

Thanks guys. I may have been a bit hasty this morning. Yesterday was just a nightmare and instead of instilling some confidence I felt it more highlighted my inadequacies. I've always struggled a bit with the testing side of things. I've had some 1st and 2nd fix experience and got on with that no problem but when it comes to testing...

I can never remember the combinations of main switch/RCDs/MCBs on or off, what temporary link goes from where to where, what do I need to remember to disconnect when doing an IR, etc.

I'm an honest guy and I'm thinking, if I can't do this in my own house then why should I expect customers to pay for it!



But, I'll have another go this weekend and see how I get on

.

Hi Stormflex,


Please dont give up as the only reason you cant remember is your not doing it day in day out - but as long as you follow the correct procedures you will be fine.

If you have an email address i will happily send you wiring systems and fault finding by b scaddan fourth edition which is a really helpful read.

Good luck and get some practice.

Regards
Peter

 

[cbw]

GOOD!

I think thats a great start!

There is nothing worse than an ignorant arrogant 5 day wonder!

You show that you DO have knowledge and the will to learn, by the very fact you doubt yourself shows you HAVE the knowledge to do well!

If your local to me I would be willing to help, if not just keep practising at home and it will come.

The more you learn the more you realise how little you actually know!!!

 

[Stormflex]

Well I'm pleased to report that after all my worrying I passed my assessment yesterday morning. It wasn't half as bad as I thought it was going to be. The assessor really put me at ease and I would even go as far as saying that I actually enjoyed it!

I managed to answer all the questions and perform the testing asked of me without looking in any books. It's surprising how much you remember!

Thanks to all for your previous support.

 

[geordie]

great news that you passed. What sort of things did the assessor ask

 

[solo2771]

Well done mate!!!

 

[Giovanni]

EAL Domestic installer...........5 day wonder

As opposed to?.....There are many time served, '30 years under my belt'..Seen it all...Slapdash, bone idle, corner cutting...Know it alls.
It's irrelevant how the guy got 'qualified' if that's the term we want to use, what is relevant is the standard of work he produces, domestic, commercial or otherwise.....The customers out there do not know how any spark qualified, surely as a trade what should matter to us is whether the individual in conscientious, competent, and safe...That's what gives us all a good name as a trade.
Rant over! Give the guy a break.

 

[peterb2428]

Well I'm pleased to report that after all my worrying I passed my assessment yesterday morning. It wasn't half as bad as I thought it was going to be. The assessor really put me at ease and I would even go as far as saying that I actually enjoyed it!

I managed to answer all the questions and perform the testing asked of me without looking in any books. It's surprising how much you remember!

Thanks to all for your previous support.

Congrats - really pleased for you and good luck

 

[SirKit Breaker]

GOOD!

I think thats a great start!

There is nothing worse than an ignorant arrogant 5 day wonder!

You show that you DO have knowledge and the will to learn, by the very fact you doubt yourself shows you HAVE the knowledge to do well!

If your local to me I would be willing to help, if not just keep practising at home and it will come.

The more you learn the more you realise how little you actually know!!!

I'm with CBW on this, and am also willing to help you if you are in my area. He is spot on, you do get it by doing it day in day out. You can read all the books in the world, and some are excellent, but there is no substitute for being shown and having a supervised go, and learning about what you are testing, why, how, and what your expected results should be.

Cheers........Howard

 

[Engineer54]

These assessments, ...just how many actually fail?? Now that Would be interesting to know!!!

From what i can make of these (in your terms) Scam providers, ...My guess is very few!! This is all good business for them, and as a profit making biased company, they would be potentially losing a 400+ membership fee, ongoing yearly assessment fees, along with god knows what other bit's and pieces that goes with the territory!! ....I'd personally say the chances are Very Slim indeed!!!

 

[robskiing]

Good luck mate the more jobs you do the easier it will get on the testing side Theres hardly a day doesnt go by when i think to myself thats something ive learned today or i find an easier way to do a certain job .

 

[tonys]

Engineer

For part p, the inspectors or assessors or what you want to call them are told not to ask questions and are sent to help applicants through, they want the money and do not want to lose any applicants to other scheme providers.

Its a farce imo, if they assessed applications like the NICEIC do for Approved Status there would be a 90% failure rate.

 

[Giovanni]

NICEIC...Are no better, I have seen in the last two weeks, four jobs carried out by niceic approved that were in no uncertain terms... dangerous, to the point I actually issued a dangerous circumstances note......

 

[tonys]

NICEIC...Are no better, I have seen in the last two weeks, four jobs carried out by niceic approved that were in no uncertain terms... dangerous, to the point I actually issued a dangerous circumstances note......

I know that.

I said the assessment would fail 90% of part p applicants. Ive come across loads of poor work by an NICEIC Approved Contractor. I even reported them and had to report them again for going to one of my jobs putting my tails in the meter when I had left them out because the earthing was inadequate.

None the schemes really want to lose revenue.

 

[Engineer54]

What you really need in the UK is to get rid of these so-called Providers and have a National register of Qualified Electricians like most of the other countries have.

At the very least you will have a route for reporting, dangerous and unsafe work of others ... Can't understand how private profit based companies became ''Qualifying Authorities'', totally ludicrous situation that!!!

 

[Giovanni]

agreed...But in reality is 'anywhere else' any better in all honesty? I doubt it......It's a shame, but that's just how it is, it's all about playing the game.

 

[Engineer54]

Put it this way Giovanni i've never heard the amount of discontent from Electricians of those countries that have National Registers of Qualified Electricians, ...about there National Registers, that i have with the UK Electricians complaining about these private Scheme Providers.

Unfortunately Giovanni, this is in reality your livelihood, so it's not a game. But you are playing a game at the moment, but the odds are all stacked against you... Your paying everyone and his dog, to enable you to not only become an electrician, your also paying to enable you to work, and your getting nothing, zilch, nought in return mate ...and you can't even complain either because you know you'll be wasting your breath!! ...lol!!!

 

[IQ Electrical]

agreed...But in reality is 'anywhere else' any better in all honesty? I doubt it......It's a shame, but that's just how it is, it's all about playing the game.

It's not a game to me, it's a mess, the definition of 'electrician' has been blurred and devalued beyond recognition, my training lasted 7 years from start to HNC and I see adverts everywhere promising that you can become 'an electrician' in a few weeks!!

We stick to our JIB Approved criteria for employees and dream of a license system scheme like the American system, it works there and it can here.

 

[j.mawer]

Well done mate, good job you didn't flog the meter! Hope all goes well