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Charlie66

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Hello i've recently just had a re wire done on a three bed semi house, Ive noticed a few things im not 100 percent on ive spoken to the firm that carried out the rewire and they don't seem to be concerned to the point ive had to contact the niceic,
http://www.niceic.com/
I just would like to point out am i no way an electrician or pretend to be one so please be gentle if i get things wrong i apologize in advance, the first problem we had was all the sockets and switches where so wonky and so deep in the wall i had to get them back to try to straighten the boxes and switches out. not much could be done with the 25mm boxes three inches deep in the wall so we decided to try to plaster it anyway. On employing the plasterer he said the wall chasing wasn't deep enough for the capping that was installed and the he couldn't cover the capping as it protruded the wall. When i called the electrician he simply said he would come back and rip the capping of the wall and tack the wires to the chases. I asked if the chases he had installed could be chased to the correct depth and capping re used and he told me no and there was no way he would be doing this. Unfortunately this set the tone for the whole experience i have had with them as they then demanded payment there and then for the completed works ( ÂŁ4250 ) even though i had slight concerns at the time with the installation. I expressed some of my concerns and then was promptly threated with being taken to court and interest being added to the bill. I reluctantly paid them as it was 2 weeks before christmas and my wife and children had been staying away while the works was completed and i didnt fancy living in a destroyed house while things took forever to go to court.


When i went to check on the house mid installation i noticed that the cables for the radial circuits upstairs where bigger than the ones downstairs when asked he said that he was installing a 4mm radial for the sockets upstairs and a 2.5 downstairs i asked why and he said it was a favor to us and this was indeed better as we can use more things upstairs, i asked if he could indeed use 2.5 te on all the radials and he said to do this would be another days work and it would be another ÂŁ500 with it being so close to christmas and in the current situation i wasn't able to find the extra money. Does this sound ok to you surely they cables should be the same size? My main concern was running additional spurs and getting the additional wires in the back for the future.

A month on from that initial incident with them i have noticed things that don't seem correct and some that to me seem like blatant vandalism and poor workmanship but i could be wrong. As most of the floorboards haven't been put back very well ive had to re lift them and try to put them back down myself no real issue but its what i have seen that concerns me slightly ive noticed cuts in the outer sheathing on cables and a number or cables that are on top of hot water pipes? Is this dangerous at all? We have noticed termination in the loft on a bathroom light with no sheathing on just sheathing on the actual coloured wires?

One of my biggest concerns is how it has been routed around the house they seem to have cut holes in the kitchen ceiling instead of taking the boards up in the bathroom hence this has resulted in when they have drilled the holes in the joists them being very close to the edge of the joist and on a angle if that makes sense as there isn't enough room to get the 16mm wood drill in there there are three holes used for the runs above the kitchen. This has resulted in the bathroom floor beeing considerably bouncy a coincidence maybe but im not sure and will need further investigation.

On the topic of holes used for runs in joists they seem to have drilled holes all the way across the landing and into the back bedroom they have used the holes up to the last bedroom them left them empty as in not used them so there is about 5 or 6 joists with holes just drilled in them for the sake of it.. not a massive deal but i dont see the point in damaging joists for the sake of it?

one of the latest things ive seen is where the new pendant light fittings have been installed it seems as if they have taken up the bare minimum floor bords from above and then used a 16mm wood drill and and drilled vertically on a slight angle and pushed the lighting circuit cables up like this from what i have been reading could this damage the joists structurally my concern is the size of the hole vertically upwards if this makes sense. is this the correct way to do this?

This is just a few things the whole installation seems a rush job and pretty rough with regard to what you cant see, they have fitted a a 20way rcbo cu and theres about 10 spare ways this seems excessive to me but its better to have more spare than none i guess.
Ive contacted the niceic and been in talks with them for a few weeks they agreed i may need to have a site visit to address some of my concerns with them but with the current situation with covid they have no idea when this could be and suggested i get a third party to inspect it then take the company to the small claims court and it all sounds like a complete headache tbh as they would then close the complaint.

I suppose im just looking for some advice really as i have doubts... would a third party confirm that the joists have been damaged to the extent they need replacing or fixing? could they even be fixed or have they ruined my house? ive kind of wrote the 4k off and hopefully the new electrician if i can find one that wants to touch someone else's bodge ill just have to pay for them to sort it out then decide if its worth the headache of small claims.

Its been a stressful time and still is stressful every day as im not sure what direction to take bare in mind they left the house so dirty its taken weeks to get back to any sort of normality and with a baby and child under 4 its not been an easy time for them either. The company we used in fact works for my wifes company doing subcontracted work for landlords with rented property that adds to our frustration and disappointment to the way its been handled.

Thanks,
 
Sorry to hear about your experience.
Have you written a formal letter of complaint to the company, outlining each of the issues, and what you would like done about them? This would be a first step.
Actually maybe the first step might be to get second opinion on the work that was done.
Doing so could either reinforce your complaint, or may perhaps even assuage your fears about the possible damage done.
Having got the second opinion from a trusted company, then you either draw a line under the whole thing for the sake of peace and moving forward, or start the process towards legal action, depending on what is found.
 
Sorry to hear about your experience.
Have you written a formal letter of complaint to the company, outlining each of the issues, and what you would like done about them? This would be a first step.
Actually maybe the first step might be to get second opinion on the work that was done.
Doing so could either reinforce your complaint, or may perhaps even assuage your fears about the possible damage done.
Having got the second opinion from a trusted company, then you either draw a line under the whole thing for the sake of peace and moving forward, or start the process towards legal action, depending on what is found.
Hello thanks for taking the time to respond, i did indeed ask the company for there formal complaints procedure and they then rang me and recorded a conversation we then had im not sure what this was going to achieve. I think i agree we are going to try to find someone to come and have a look and thoroughly go through it all asap.
 
I would agree with comments made above, it also sounds to me like niceic are passing the book a bit, I understand that the current situation does present some issues, however with appropriate guidelines on ppe etc., I see no valued reason why someone couldn't look over the install observing all the H&S.
Did you have a written contract with the company who carried out the work ? What agreements were in place for the install ?
Always difficult to comment on an install without seeing any phyiscal evident, But it does seem on the surface that you certainly have reason to complain.
Obviously the situation with your wife's employers may make it slightly difficult as it could exert pressure on her in the work environment.
I wish you successful outcome to your concerns
 
The niceic will only be interested in the electrical installation. Floorboards and ceilings will not be in there remit.

are you sure they drilled the holes in joist. Maybe these holes where for the old cables that have been removed. Even if he did drill a few more holes than needed not too big a deal.

4 mm radicals are becoming more common. I fit them regulary. I sometimes fit a 2.5mm ring and 4 mm radial in the same installation.

I also quite often go through ceilings as opposed taking floorboards up. Especially in bathrooms as the fitting make it aukward to do.

drilling holes at an angle through joists sometimes is unovoidable.

In short you need to break an egg to make an omelet.


im just playing devils advocate.

Without seeing I cannot give a true opinion. It maybe the they have made a complete hash or it could be a normal good electrical instal.

nothing you have said seems to indicate anything dangerous In the electrical installation.

Do you have any concerns with the actual electrics in the property?
 
It may be that bringing this standard of works to your wife’s employers may make them look at the work this company does for them and more problems could be found.

I do agree with “can’t make an omelette without breaking eggs” and in an older property, with a history of various times floorboards may have been lifted, it can leave the boards looking like firewood.

Cable sizes are determined for each individual circuit, whether a ring or radial, and it’s just more common to find 2.5 as the size used.

The fact he used capping in the first place suggests he wasn’t cutting corners, but to not chase the wall deep enough in the first place was sloppy.
 
The building regs. stipulate where and how big holes in joists can be. They can be surprisingly large - up to 2" diameter in a typical 8" joist, as long as it's centred in the middle.
 

The niceic will only be interested in the electrical installation. Floorboards and ceilings will not be in there remit.

are you sure they drilled the holes in joist. Maybe these holes where for the old cables that have been removed. Even if he did drill a few more holes than needed not too big a deal.

4 mm radicals are becoming more common. I fit them regulary. I sometimes fit a 2.5mm ring and 4 mm radial in the same installation.

I also quite often go through ceilings as opposed taking floorboards up. Especially in bathrooms as the fitting make it aukward to do.

drilling holes at an angle through joists sometimes is unovoidable.

In short you need to break an egg to make an omelet.


im just playing devils advocate.

Without seeing I cannot give a true opinion. It maybe the they have made a complete hash or it could be a normal good electrical instal.

nothing you have said seems to indicate anything dangerous In the electrical installation.

Do you have any concerns with the actual electrics in the property?
hello and thanks for taking the time to reply,

My concerns for the drilling of joists is for example the ceiling roses surely floorboards could have been taken up and a smaller hole drilled on a diagonal opposed to wacking a 16mm hole through the side of the joist. I dont know really.

An example would be there was a white junction box above the garage space that had the old red and black rubber running to different places within the property or mainly the garden and outside toilet they removed or ripped of the cover to have a look at the insides but there was a white flex that ran from the junction box that plugged into a single socket this was plugged in and live. Does Not exactly fill me with confidence unfortunately.
 
Cable sizes are determined for each individual circuit, whether a ring or radial, and it’s
The building regs. stipulate where and how big holes in joists can be. They can be surprisingly large - up to 2" diameter in a typical 8" joist, as long as it's centred in the middle.
hello and thanks for taking the time to reply,

the holes range from directly under the joist and straight up and to the side so in theory taking out the side of the joist if that makes sense, to being drilled about 4mm from the bottom on a angle upwards and anything in between.
 
I've just discovered that it is NOT in the building regs. any more. It was, but was removed a couple of years or so ago, and now comes under BS EN 1995-1: 2004, whatever that is.
 
I normally like my cables to fit through a good sized hole. It helps pull the cable without it getting damaged. Sometimes 16mm but normally 20 mm Sometime 32mm. That’s normal.

not sure I quite understood the junction box in the garage part. But if it’s on a plug it’s not part of the electrical installation.

is there any part of the electrical installation you are concerned about?
 
I normally like my cables to fit through a good sized hole. It helps pull the cable without it getting damaged. Sometimes 16mm but normally 20 mm Sometime 32mm. That’s normal
Same here. Rarely under 20mm, and often more, up to a maximum of 32mm. Above that, I drill a second hole along side the first, at least three diameters away.
I didn't understand the j/box in the garage bit, either, but I hope it's gone.
 
But if it’s on a plug it’s not part of the electrical installation.

2.8 Installing fixed electrical equipment is within the scope of Part P, even if the final connection is by a standard 13A plug and socket

Quoted from Part P of the Building Regulations 2013. Just to show that there are instances where equipment that is fed from a standard plug and socket need to be given consideration.
 
With a lot of the negative NICEIC posts on here over the last few months it got me thinking as to who you would complain to if the NICEIC won't respond and investigate a complaint, given that the NICEIC are an accredited organisation according to this UKAS Accreditation - Certsure - http://certsure.com/about-us/ukas-accreditation/ then it looks like the next option is to raise a complaint here Complaints, Feedback and Appeals - UKAS - https://www.ukas.com/customer-area/complaints-feedback-and-appeals/
 
Same here. Rarely under 20mm, and often more, up to a maximum of 32mm. Above that, I drill a second hole along side the first, at least three diameters away.
I didn't understand the j/box in the garage bit, either, but I hope it's gone.
Hello my concern is how they have been drilled close to edges and straight up for lighting cables instead of through the middle really
 

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