Fault on socket circuit

G

Grant McLaren

I am puzzling over an intermittent fault on a ground floor/kitchen socket circuit. Initially it seemed as soon as the oven switched on the RCD would trip. However, after unplugging the oven, I used a socket tester on other sockets, which would sometimes trip the RCD. It's pretty random, sometimes it will trip as soon as you plug something in, other times not. Zs reading were fine. The ring main has been broken, although the earths are still continuous. From what I saw, the socket circuit has not been done well.

When I left the property yesterday everything was on, but I'm waiting for a call from tenant to say it's tripped again.

Any thoughts on what it could be and why it has suddenly started now?

Regards.
 
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Dillb said:
Hang on you mentioned existing circuits. Not new ones.
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yes, if I do work on an existing circuit, which requires minor works or domestic installation certificate, I will usually (not always) assume the ring is broken and downgrade. If I come to a kitchen circuit, I might do it differently and keep the 32 if the ring is continuous. But this generally speaking, not a hard and fast rule.
 
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Grant McLaren said:
yes, if I do work on an existing circuit, which requires minor works or domestic installation certificate, I will usually (not always) assume the ring is broken and downgrade. If I come to a kitchen circuit, I might do it differently and keep the 32 if the ring is continuous. But this generally speaking, not a hard and fast rule.
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So you could actually be charging your customers unecessary money for materials npt needed? Rather that. Carrying a few simple tests to prove everything is fine?

Whats a "domestic installation certificate"?
 
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what in the ruddy hell is going on here

chooma.jpg
 
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Spoon said:
Maybe the NICEIC have designed themselves a new cert...
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Well I was just wondering Spoon, if Grant has, either given Money to the NICEIC (Thanks for that Dillb) or he is registered, begs some questions how on Earth (judging by some of Grants statement) was this acheived? and was the assessment carried out in the Assessors Vehicle.
 
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Dillb said:
So just like this post your using guess work to carry out jobs. You are a chancer who has no idea what you are doing.
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Please tell me Dillb, how is it that by downgrading a 32amp to 20amp is a bad thing or bad practice. Please explain the logic. Surely, it is more risky to follow your practice and assume, because the RFC is continuous that some cowboy hasn't come along and spur off the ring with no protection.
 
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Grant McLaren said:
Please tell me Dillb, how is it that by downgrading a 32amp to 20amp is a bad thing or bad practice. Please explain the logic. Surely, it is more risky to follow your practice and assume, because the RFC is continuous that some cowboy hasn't come along and spur off the ring with no protection.
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how do you know that someone hasnt done as you say? by testing!
 
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Dillb said:
So just like this post your using guess work to carry out jobs. You are a chancer who has no idea what you are doing.
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Please tell me Dillb, how is it that by downgrading a 32amp to 20amp is a bad thing or bad practice.
Pete999 said:
Well I was just wondering Spoon, if Grant has, either given Money to the NICEIC (Thanks for that Dillb) or he is registered, begs some questions how on Earth (judging by some of Grants statement) was this acheived? and was the assessment carried out in the Assessors Vehicle.
Click to expand...

Please explain the logic. Surely, it is more risky to follow your practice and assume, because the RFC is continuous that some cowboy hasn't come along and spur off the ring with no protection.
 
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Grant McLaren said:
Please tell me Dillb, how is it that by downgrading a 32amp to 20amp is a bad thing or bad practice.


Please explain the logic. Surely, it is more risky to follow your practice and assume, because the RFC is continuous that some cowboy hasn't come along and spur off the ring with no protection.
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You do know how to calculate R1+R2 for a RFC to ensure there are no spurs on it dont you?
 
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Grant McLaren said:
Please tell me Dillb, how is it that by downgrading a 32amp to 20amp is a bad thing or bad practice.


Please explain the logic. Surely, it is more risky to follow your practice and assume, because the RFC is continuous that some cowboy hasn't come along and spur off the ring with no protection.
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If it's just 1 socket being spurred off of a RFC what protection would be required?
 
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Pete999 said:
If it's just 1 socket being spurred off of a RFC what protection would be required?
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Besides, a single double socket has the potential to draw 26amps,
Dillb said:
If r1, r2, rn , R1+R2 reading are all in order then there womt be a break or spur on the circuit
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I don't think that's right. r1,rn,r2 at the CU would only tell the ring is continuous, but it wouldn't tell you if someone had spurred off it. The R1+R2 at the CU, I'm less sure about, but I still don't think it will tell you someone has spurred off the ring. But this is besides the point: is a socket circuit protected by a 20amp safer that a 32amp?
 
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So now, as well as assuming the RFC is broke you are assuming there are multiple spar sockets coming from said broken circuit.....
 
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Grant McLaren said:
Besides, a single double socket has the potential to draw 26amps,

I don't think that's right. r1,rn,r2 at the CU would only tell the ring is continuous, but it wouldn't tell you if someone had spurred off it. The R1+R2 at the CU, I'm less sure about, but I still don't think it will tell you someone has spurred off the ring. But this is besides the point: is a socket circuit protected by a 20amp safer that a 32amp?
Click to expand...
Ring testing isn't solely at the CU. r1+rn and r1+r2 should also be tested at each point, this would identify any spurs and faults etc.
 
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Grant McLaren said:
Besides, a single double socket has the potential to draw 26amps,

I don't think that's right. r1,rn,r2 at the CU would only tell the ring is continuous, but it wouldn't tell you if someone had spurred off it. The R1+R2 at the CU, I'm less sure about, but I still don't think it will tell you someone has spurred off the ring. But this is besides the point: is a socket circuit protected by a 20amp safer that a 32amp?
Click to expand...
Most standard twin sockets are only rated at 20amps if memory serves me correctly, so you had better swap them for singles too then.

You have proven you have a limited knowledge of testing as you should carry out a R1+R2 at every point of connection on a RFC to ensure there are no spurs connected too it.
 
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