how to jump the fence,

[opm electrical]

to be honest when i started out being a a little spark at college big sparks was where i wanted to end up, power stations etc, only problem was i got offered a job with a domestic sparky who worked for my father in laws building firm which was great while i was at college but i kind of got stuck in domestic light commercial, them he bought a new wife and moved to thailand so i got a job at the council, then went self employed, so i only got qualified for where i need to be, lvl3 17th ed, 2391, i am now sick as a chip constantly sick of chasing money and the fact that the market is saturated with self employed sparks cos there is no jobs at this level, so you put a price that is pretty reasonable just to get undercut, or get looked at like youve just asked for thire daughters virginity.
to cut a long story short how do i get into industrial without experience and with out knowing what other qualifications i need

 

[johnboy6083]

Register with agencies, and tell them that you are happy to do anything. Turn up on site, listen watch and learn. Before you know it, you'll be bending tube like the best of us.

 

[Knobhead]

Depends on what side of industrial you want to get in to, installation or maintenance / breakdown. With your background installation you’ll be OK, forget the other option until you’ve got experience in the field.
Sorry but it’s the truth.

 

[silva.foxx]

I recently saw a recruitment ad, applied and ended in a mire of forms... but looks good and not just in the area stated in the indeed.co.uk ad. May be worth a punt.

Engineer Training Programme - Capenhurst, Ellesmere Port, Near Chester Job - Capenhurst

National Grid - Careers

.

 

[somersetsparks]

Agree with tony, installation is installation, you will pick up the manual skills pretty easily, e.g bending tube, armoured, trunking etc. In my opinion its different to working for yourself/ one man band because you get told what to do do, given a plan (hopefully) and do it.
I haven't had much experience in maintenance fault finding of existing plants really, as I work for a contracting firm, however given a couple more years I hope to move over that way as I enjoy finding and repairing faults.

Cut your teeth on a few big installtions as agency/blue book etc. then see where you are...
best if luck

 

[johnboy6083]

agree with the above. Most sparks will be happy to show you stuff youve not seen before, as long as your polite, and straight after, dont go gobbing off about how good you are. good luck mate.
Also, keep reading this forum, and youll start to pick up on things that you havent heard of or seen before.

 

[vaughant]

Depends on what side of industrial you want to get in to, installation or maintenance / breakdown. With your background installation you’ll be OK, forget the other option until you’ve got experience in the field.
Sorry but it’s the truth.

As usual another spot on description from Tony.

There's a lad with us now from exactly the same background as yourself,albeit less experience and he really struggles with the faultfinding element,he's reasonably enthusiastic as well but I feel sometimes that he gets a little sidelined into installation jobs as obviously he's pretty clued up with it all.

It is a very complex thing to get started on but my best advice is learn how to read an electrical control diagram,it's a very different animal to domestic but actually,when you get into it you'll find faultfinding via control diagrams is a lot easier IMO,this won't start unless this is on because that's not working etc,I personally love it and if there's anyway I can assist you,please just ask.

 

[pmac10]

As usual another spot on description from Tony.

There's a lad with us now from exactly the same background as yourself,albeit less experience and he really struggles with the faultfinding element,he's reasonably enthusiastic as well but I feel sometimes that he gets a little sidelined into installation jobs as obviously he's pretty clued up with it all.

It is a very complex thing to get started on but my best advice is learn how to read an electrical control diagram,it's a very different animal to domestic but actually,when you get into it you'll find faultfinding via control diagrams is a lot easier IMO,this won't start unless this is on because that's not working etc,I personally love it and if there's anyway I can assist you,please just ask.

^^^^^^agree.
that's a pretty good description Vaughant, in reality it becomes a natural train of thought,
assess the situation,
whats not happening that should be?
what causes that to happen?
test?
thats working, what makes that work?
that does. test.
that works, etc..etc
obviously it can get a lot more complicated but if you can think along these lines you're off to a good start.
oh, by the way, factor in, you may be losing £4000 per hour upwards of someone elses money while your making these reasoning processes, and it gets interesting/challenging/stressful.
good luck though pal.

 

[Engineer54]

As usual another spot on description from Tony.

There's a lad with us now from exactly the same background as yourself,albeit less experience and he really struggles with the faultfinding element,he's reasonably enthusiastic as well but I feel sometimes that he gets a little sidelined into installation jobs as obviously he's pretty clued up with it all.

It is a very complex thing to get started on but my best advice is learn how to read an electrical control diagram,it's a very different animal to domestic but actually,when you get into it you'll find faultfinding via control diagrams is a lot easier IMO,this won't start unless this is on because that's not working etc,I personally love it and if there's anyway I can assist you,please just ask.

I think it also has a good deal to do with aptitude!! Some just don't have it, no matter how hard they try. If you don't enjoy reading/understanding control drawings as you obviously do, then maintenance fault finding (for want of a better description) is always going to be a real struggle, that never gets mastered.

When i look at control drawings (as maybe you do) i can see in my mind how things happen. Your friend at work can't see that, he has to follow line by line, and that after a while can get boring especially when you don't seem to be getting anywhere fast, so he's more than happy to get back to an area of work, where he is comfortably competent....

I've been in this game now a very long time, but i still thoroughly enjoy what i'm doing, the Buzz if you like, has never wained. ...lol!!!!

 

[pmac10]

I think it also has a good deal to do with aptitude!! Some just don't have it, no matter how hard they try. If you don't enjoy reading/understanding control drawings as you obviously do, then maintenance fault finding (for want of a better description) is always going to be a real struggle, that never gets mastered.

when i did a military apprentishship we got large training notes hand outs to accompany each phase of training, ie electrical principles, hydraulics, electronics etc of perhaps 100 -200 pages of content, the fault diagnosis phase hand out was 2 pages long, with the Seargent instructor explaining this phase can't be taught, you've either got it or you ain't, some of you may be able to develop it,
true words.

 

[Engineer54]

I think it also has a good deal to do with aptitude!! Some just don't have it, no matter how hard they try. If you don't enjoy reading/understanding control drawings as you obviously do, then maintenance fault finding (for want of a better description) is always going to be a real struggle, that never gets mastered.

when i did a military apprentishship we got large training notes hand outs to accompany each phase of training, ie electrical principles, hydraulics, electronics etc of perhaps 100 -200 pages of content, the fault diagnosis phase hand out was 2 pages long, with the Seargent instructor explaining this phase can't be taught, you've either got it or you ain't, some of you may be able to develop it,
true words.

Yep, ...that just about sums it up nicely...lol!!!

 

[Knobhead]

Experience on a plant is vital, I’ve found my self dropped in the deep end numerous times with unfamiliar plants. OK you work out the fault is PX No.123, but where the hell is it! Usually this is where the plant operator comes to your aid.

 

[vaughant]

Experience on a plant is vital, I’ve found my self dropped in the deep end numerous times with unfamiliar plants. OK you work out the fault is PX No.123, but where the hell is it! Usually this is where the plant operator comes to your aid.

Oh yes,very very true!!!
Especially in your game with the sheer size of the place!!!
The problem I'm finding with where I am now is that as it's basically a set of buildings from the 18th and 19th centuries there aren't any really dedicated areas where panels etc are,with the exception of 2 machines.
Can sometimes make life a bit awkward when the motor your attempting to investigate is 300ft away down a hogpit full of pulp and crap!!!
I must say the operators/machinemen are excellent,can't help you enough.
Especially as they know if the machines down for any length of time their in the pit cleaning out pulp!!!

 

[Knobhead]

Great fun when it’s you that’s got to go down in to the pit, NOT!

As to the plant operator helping, a shovel is a good incentive. If the plant’s not running it’s time for them to go play Banjo*

*Banjo = shovel.

Although there can be a down side. I asked an operator to clear a way to a substation door so I could get in. Being helpful he cleared a way all right. He used a front-end loader, to quote the operator “I only caught it a glancing tap”! I’m looking at the now open plan sub station not very impressed.