Vacuum and compressor automation

[Steven88]

I've been asked to design a panel for 2x 3phase comressors and 2x 3phase vacuum pumps.
Non of the motors can start at the same time and between the 2, they have to run alternately. The vacuum pumps need to be wired so that if more vacuum is needed the other will start. Keep in mind that when the system is not being used the pumps will work alternately....
TIA

 

[davesparks]

What are you actually asking us here as I don't see any question in the OP, just a statement about something you are designing.

 

[Steven88]

I'm asking for help on what i need to design this panel. To make them work alrernatly I can use a "flip flop relay". How do I incorporate the vacuum pumps to work alternately as well as standby if one cannot cope with what is required?

 

[Deleted member 26818]

Why would you want a system to run when it’s not in use?

 

[Steven88]

What I meant was after it has been used.... before it is used again. They use the vacuum and pressure for different reasons in the lab. If they start at the same time the current spike is very high.

 

[westward10]

So what you are saying if the compressors are running the vacuum pumps cannot start and visa versa. With the vacuum pumps only one can be started initially but there is a facility for the second to kick in if required.

 

[Steven88]

Yes, but after each cycle the vacuum pumps will start alternatively. So vacuum 1 will start and if required vacuum 2 will start. The next time vacuum is required vacuum 2 will start and if more vacuum is needed then vacuum 1 will start

 

[Deleted member 26818]

I think, knowing the use the vacuum is going to be for could help.
Is the vacuum to be used as fume extract?
Is it to vacuum liquid, will there be a catch tank?
Is it to be distributed?
Is it for a delivery system?
Is it to hold something in place?
Is it to be used for vacuum packaging?

 

[Steven88]

This is what i have come up with and it will work. However, they don't want the timer to be used. Instead, they want me to use 2 pressure switches

 

[Blaspark]

Deleted

 

[ChipFanDave]

Why not get a quote from an automation or panel building company.

 

[Bobster]

How are you going to complying with the CE directive and EN60204-1 to start with?

 

[Blaspark]

Rob - I can see the need for compliance with EN60204-1 but if he built the system, bit of a long shot from what we've seen thus far, with ce marked products is there further requirement for ce certification?

I've never heard of the necessity for logic system built with a plc or a few relays.

 

[Bobster]

Rob - I can see the need for compliance with EN60204-1 but if he built the system, bit of a long shot from what we've seen thus far, with ce marked products is there further requirement for ce certification?

I've never heard of the necessity for logic system built with a plc or a few relays.

Yes anything built like that needs to fill CE requirments.

Not got time into going over it now but take a look at this:

Conformity assessment - Work equipment and machinery - http://www.hse.gov.uk/work-equipment-machinery/conformity.htm

 

[Blaspark]

I'm still surprised because I know that people who custom build control panels have too but you can buy ce marked push button assemblies etc.

I know someone who installs siemens gear, check out there sirius range to see what I'm talking about, and he never mentioned it when we chatted about the technicalities of the subject nor was there any comments on the siemens forums.

I posted a question on there forum so I guess I'll see soon.