Adding 5 double plug sockets to garage

[Joshw1024]

Hi,

I am looking for some advice on the best way to install 5 double plug sockets into my garage, all of which will be running multiple computers.

My CU is located in the garage.

Would it be best to install the sockets onto their own ring main, or to add them onto the existing garage circuit?

Any advice is appreciated.

Thanks,
Josh.

EDIT: I am only installing the sockets, I will consult an electrician to connect them to the CU if required.

 

[buzzlightyear]

before we can give you the answer, what kind of consumer unit is installed and if so how is the wiring going to be installed.

 

[James]

How many computers? You say 5 twin sockets, each with multiple computers.
the sockets will need to be protected by an rcd and this could be a problem if you are running more than 10 computers.

I think you should get an electrician to come and specify this because of the possibility of large earth leakage currents.
if your house has a single rcd that protects it, you may well be in darkness regularly.

 

[Joshw1024]

before we can give you the answer, what kind of consumer unit is installed and if so how is the wiring going to be installed.

i'm not sure exactly what CU is installed, see attached image.
The sockets will be on the opposite side of the garage from the CU, so was hoping i'd be able to run 2.5 cable in conduit across the garage ceiling to the CU, and wired into one of the empty slots.

 

[Joshw1024]

How many computers? You say 5 twin sockets, each with multiple computers.
the sockets will need to be protected by an rcd and this could be a problem if you are running more than 10 computers.

I think you should get an electrician to come and specify this because of the possibility of large earth leakage currents.
if your house has a single rcd that protects it, you may well be in darkness regularly.

Currently there are 6 computers, on sockets wired into the upstairs circuit ring main and I have no problems.
I'm moving them into the garage for various reasons.

See image in my previous reply for the CU.

 

[catdog1121]

Currently there are 6 computers, on sockets wired into the upstairs circuit ring main and I have no problems.
I'm moving them into the garage for various reasons.

See image in my previous reply for the CU.

There are lots of variables here, what size cable is feeding your garage? What type of cable is the feed to the garage? What size is the circuit breaker? Is there any RCD protection, if so where is that protection?

There are also computers then there are computers, do you know what sort of current draw they have?

A lot of garages are fed by a small supply cable as most people just want to plug in say a lawn mower and have lights in the garage, you may need to increase the size of the supply cable.

Having just 6 computers you should be ok on the earth leakage just about but if you ever want to add more it might be worth thinking about a separate circuit for future expansion. If you do need to increase the supply cable think about also if you would ever want to put a car charger on the garage wall. What about any possible heaters in the garage?

I know it just seems like you add some more sockets but it really depends on the load requirement and what is currently in place, nobody on a forum can really tell you that so you need an electrician.

 

[richy3333]

You're not mining crypto currency are you?!

 

[buzzlightyear]

You're not mining crypto currency are you

do you need a pick & shovel for them.lol.

 

[pc1966]

If you can, I would suggesting running some SWA cable from your house CU to the garage CU and feeding it off a non-RCD MCB at the house. That allows you the option to have 2 or more radial circuits in the garage, each on separate 20A RCBOs if you do encounter problems of high leakage tripping things.

On a hard fault you won't get selectivity, as the "instant" trip of the supply MCB will easily be reached by such a fault before the down-stream MCB/RCBO has any chance to clear it, but that might be an acceptable situation for you. If not it means a slightly more expensive job to have a fused-switch feed the SWA from the supply before the house CU (i.e. independant of the house CU).

Newer computers are not too bad, typically they are only 0.5-1mA or so and 6 double sockets will be passable off one 30mA RCD (recommendation is you design for no more than 10mA leakage on any circuit normally), but start adding UPS and extension blocks for odd extras and the future is murky...

Where you might see it trip is if there are any voltage disturbances so you get a high dV/dt on the supply and all that capacitance pushes things over the edge.

 

[pc1966]

Also to add, you might want to consider lights in the garage with battery back up in case power does go off and you are plunged in to darkness. You can get LED batton lights with that built in for only £40 or so extra.

 

[Strima]

Some might want to reread the original post, the CU is located in the garage.

 

[ruston]

Also to add, you might want to consider lights in the garage with battery back up in case power does go off and you are plunged in to darkness. You can get LED batton lights with that built in for only £40 or so extra.

I used to put non maintained EM lights in garages and workshops that had , or likely to use rotary machines or the like.

 

[pc1966]

Some might want to reread the original post, the CU is located in the garage.

Doh!

In that case are there RCBO available for that CU? If so then putting one or two in the free "non RCD" slots would be my way forward.

 

[telectrix]

and if it's a new circuit it's covered by the BC Gestapo, not that they could tell a new circuit from a new lettuce.

 

[Joshw1024]

Some might want to reread the original post, the CU is located in the garage.

Just to clarify, the garage is attached to the house and the CU is located in the garage.

My apologies if it was worded badly. I will edit the original post to make it more clear

 

[James]

Just to clarify, the garage is attached to the house and the CU is located in the garage.

My apologies if it was worded badly. I will edit the original post to make it more clear

It was clear enough for those that read it properly!!

 

[Joshw1024]

There are lots of variables here, what size cable is feeding your garage? What type of cable is the feed to the garage? What size is the circuit breaker? Is there any RCD protection, if so where is that protection?

There are also computers then there are computers, do you know what sort of current draw they have?

A lot of garages are fed by a small supply cable as most people just want to plug in say a lawn mower and have lights in the garage, you may need to increase the size of the supply cable.

Having just 6 computers you should be ok on the earth leakage just about but if you ever want to add more it might be worth thinking about a separate circuit for future expansion. If you do need to increase the supply cable think about also if you would ever want to put a car charger on the garage wall. What about any possible heaters in the garage?

I know it just seems like you add some more sockets but it really depends on the load requirement and what is currently in place, nobody on a forum can really tell you that so you need an electrician.

Thanks for your reply.

The CU in the garage is the main CU for the rest of the house, fed directly from the mains.

The image attached of the CU shows 2 RCD's, with a spare 32A on each.

The computers are currently on one of the 32A ring mains labelled "sockets" on the CU and I have no issues currently.

I will definetly look into consulting an electrician for further advice.

 

[Joshw1024]

You're not mining crypto currency are you?!

hahah no not quite.

I have multiple servers for different services, some of which I rent out.

From getting quote's for things in the past it's much easier to refer to them as generic computers.

 

[Joshw1024]

Also to add, you might want to consider lights in the garage with battery back up in case power does go off and you are plunged in to darkness. You can get LED batton lights with that built in for only £40 or so extra.

Thanks, I will definetly look into this!

 

[James]

hahah no not quite.

I have multiple servers for different services, some of which I rent out.

From getting quote's for things in the past it's much easier to refer to them as generic computers.

I think I would be considering a hardwired UPS in the 3000va range.
it should have plenty of outputs to power your servers and will save you hours of fun the first time you have a 5 second power cut.

edit,

tell it like it is on this forum, there is a huge collection of very knowledgeable people.
from component level stuff on circuit boards to multi megawatt distribution, and everything in between
we don’t all know everything but there will be someone who has done something similar.

 

[Joshw1024]

I think I would be considering a hardwired UPS in the 3000va range.
it should have plenty of outputs to power your servers and will save you hours of fun the first time you have a 5 second power cut.

I've thought about a UPS before.
Luckily we don't have very many power outages but it's on my list of things to get!

 

[littlespark]

If you are getting paid for renting out the services, you don’t want to disappoint your users.
have the computers on their own ring, or if possible, a circuit each. Individual rcbo. That minimises any disruption from a fault in the rest of the house disconnecting the computers.

If not bitcoin mining, then good old fashioned pirate dvd copying? (Showing my age!)

 

[DPG]

I'd have thought a UPS would be essential if you are providing paid-for processing power. Do you not have anything in your contracts about availability/redundancy etc?

 

[telectrix]

I'd have thought a UPS would be essential if you are providing paid-for processing power. Do you not have anything in your contracts about availability/redundancy etc?

his customers get a discount for bringing their own hammer.

 

[pirate]

Oi! I may be good and old fashioned, but I have never copied DVDs

 

[pc1966]

I've thought about a UPS before.
Luckily we don't have very many power outages but it's on my list of things to get!

If this is going to be worth any significant money to you then you might be wise to think about a new CU so you have both surge protection at the supply point (normally part of any new install now) and all circuits on RCBOs so less chance of faults on one circuit taking out the others.

UPS are a rather "mixed blessing" in my experience, as often the one time you need them to function they let you down

If you have surge protection and dual-PSU servers then you can save a little by running one PSU off the UPS and the other direct off the mains. You still need to size the UPS for full load, but should it go bang on a self-test (as we have seen with some APC models) then you keep going on the direct path.

 

[pc1966]

Oi! I may be good and old fashioned, but I have never copied DVDs

I have copied my own just to strip off the stupid "prohibited actions" like not skipping advertisement crap.

But these days you, of all people, should be aware of The Pirate Bay!

 

[pirate]

I'll take the 5th...

 

[telectrix]

I'll take the 5th...

5th copy or 5th amendment. ? yanks always in front, BS7671 never has more tha 3 amendments. it's them pigeon heads at IET, can't count past their toes.

 

[Alexking1]

I'm a trainee in my first year and I can see the best way to do this as the CU is already in the garage would be to stick another ring final on. The maximum power for a pc is going to be 250w. You can run 10 of those and several desk lamps and printers without issue.

 

[littlespark]

I'm a trainee in my first year and I can see the best way to do this as the CU is already in the garage would be to stick another ring final on. The maximum power for a pc is going to be 250w. You can run 10 of those and several desk lamps and printers without issue.

It’s not just power you need to think about.

10 pcs, plus 10 monitors, plus a printer, power supplies for peripherals etc all have an inherent earth leakage. Nothing serious on its own, but can soon add up to the 30mA rcd. Considering most trip at about 20mA

 

[telectrix]

10 IT appliances on a RCD protected circuit is considered to be the limit to prevent nuisance tripping

 

[Alexking1]

It’s not just power you need to think about.

10 pcs, plus 10 monitors, plus a printer, power supplies for peripherals etc all have an inherent earth leakage. Nothing serious on its own, but can soon add up to the 30mA rcd. Considering most trip at about 20mA

Why would you need an rcd? Surely he has a main rcd already as part of the CU. Why not just have a type b MCB? As you would A regular ring.

 

[Mikegh]

10 IT appliances on a RCD protected circuit is considered to be the limit to prevent nuisance tripping

Ya used to be 4 but that's probably changed

3.5 ma *4 kept you under 1/2 of 30

 

[Mikegh]

Sorry that was pcs specifically