how to become a domestic installer

[fozzer]

Hi I am looking to become a domestic installer can someone recommend what course or courses I need to do to be able to do this. also can you tell me what the job entails. I have found the basic information and also how much they earn. thanks

 

[MDJ]

Come on Mike, thats the sort of attitude which has led to this thing happening in the first place, we need to make a stand and try and resolve this quick fix issue.

I know mate, but it not only is happening it has happened and it is still happening, so unless something changes which the powers that be decide needs changing the only thing really is to limit the short course takers to domestic only, I am not saying I like it fella, just that we are where we are and damage limitation must be the way for now, I hope you understand where I am coming from.

 

[MDJ]

Come on Mike, thats the sort of attitude which has led to this thing happening in the first place, we need to make a stand and try and resolve this quick fix issue.

I know mate, but it not only is happening it has happened and it is still happening, so unless something changes which the powers that be decide needs changing the only thing really is to limit the short course takers to domestic only, I am not saying I like it fella, just that we are where we are and damage limitation must be the way for now, I hope you understand where I am coming from.

No, don't give them a card, that will only encourage them. I can imagine them now turning up at a callout and holding up the card with a puffed out chest. "It's OK madam, Joe Bloggs, domestic installer, what seems to be the problem ?"

It wouldn't be my choice to deal out cards, I am suggesting it is a way of stopping the short course domestic guys getting into the commercial and industrial side of things, currently when you are on some sites all types of people turn up with a card which has never normally been seen before saying they are qualified, they last a day on site and go away with their tail between their legs. IMO they should never walk onto the site, but if they have a card which says they are not allowed to work on anything non domestic then this is a start. Obviously I am not happy with that either but it is a way under the current situation to stop the mass of unskilled short coursers getting onto construction sites, just saying

 

[Andy78]

I know mate, but it not only is happening it has happened and it is still happening, so unless something changes which the powers that be decide needs changing the only thing really is to limit the short course takers to domestic only, I am not saying I like it fella, just that we are where we are and damage limitation must be the way for now, I hope you understand where I am coming from.

It wouldn't be my choice to deal out cards, I am suggesting it is a way of stopping the short course domestic guys getting into the commercial and industrial side of things, currently when you are on some sites all types of people turn up with a card which has never normally been seen before saying they are qualified, they last a day on site and go away with their tail between their legs. IMO they should never walk onto the site, but if they have a card which says they are not allowed to work on anything non domestic then this is a start. Obviously I am not happy with that either but it is a way under the current situation to stop the mass of unskilled short coursers getting onto construction sites, just saying

Surely the current system of them not being able to get an ECS card of any merit works just fine ?

 

[Spoon]

we are where we are

Not getting at you @MDJ but this is one of those sayings that I REALLY dislike. Like "It is what it is"..
Usually used by people who have not taken the advice of others and things have not gone to plan.
I have always wanted to grab their heads and smash it against the table and when they complain just say "It is what it is.... Lets move on.."
Going for a coffee now, whinge over....

 

[MDJ]

Surely the current system of them not being able to get an ECS card of any merit works just fine ?

Does it? I have seen cards that I have never heard of before which some of these guys carry with them, they go on agencies and are sent to sites from the agencies when companies ask for sparks. I have seen them lol, they are just crazy. By time the company has sussed them out they have been on site at least a whole day or even two before they get sent packing and the job has suffered. I have spoken to agencies about why they send these guys to site, they say well they are electricians they have a card lol, perhaps better monitoring or entries to site is the way forward, but on big sites guys can get lost for a day or two before they are discovered.

 

[MDJ]

Not getting at you @MDJ but this is one of those sayings that I REALLY dislike. Like "It is what it is"..
Usually used by people who have not taken the advice of others and things have not gone to plan.
I have always wanted to grab their heads and smash it against the table and when they complain just say "It is what it is.... Lets move on.."
Going for a coffee now, whinge over....

well we are where we are, we have complained for years about short courses, if anything they are more numerous now than ever before, we have not been able to stop them, so rather than punish the people taking them by constantly moking them, they should be limited to only the work the course has trained them for, lol, if they have been trained of course. It is about 6k for some of these courses and they have been exploited and when it is over they think they are qualified, what can be done? we have been discussing and arguing this for years and it is just not stopping, if anything it is growing even bigger lol, now come and smash my hand against the table

 

[Andy78]

Ah right, wasn't aware that spurious cards issued by training providers exist.
That's down to a failing of the agencies and site managers for not checking credentials surely and not a failing of the current card system ?

 

[MDJ]

Ah right, wasn't aware that spurious cards issued by training providers exist.
That's down to a failing of the agencies and site managers for not checking credentials surely and not a failing of the current card system ?

It is criminal really, they spend 6K, get a bit of plastic with Electrician written on it and they are sent into the big wide world and then crucified, and the biggest problem is it is growing as well, more around now than ever before hence a limitation card as a temporary means to limit their work until this mess gets sorted out, if it ever does.

 

[MDJ]

Obviously I wouldn't issue any card myself, but the training companies need to give them something at the end of 5 weeks.

 

[Dillb]

Obviously I wouldn't issue any card myself, but the training companies need to give them something at the end of 5 weeks.

If thats the case then the training companies should becoem more responsible and accountable of who they send out with these cards.

 

[Spoon]

If thats the case then the training companies should becoem more responsible and accountable of who they send out with these cards.

haha... They have their money... They are happy...

 

[Pete999]

Obviously I wouldn't issue any card myself, but the training companies need to give them something at the end of 5 weeks.

A refund? now that's dumb

 

[westward10]

Obviously I wouldn't issue any card myself, but the training companies need to give them something at the end of 5 weeks.

Yeah a T-shirt with the logo I am not an electrician.

 

[Adam W]

There is already a suitable card for 'DIs'; it's got 'Ancillary Operative' printed on it.

The sites in question could do their bit by insisting on seeing an ECS card at induction - anyone who turns up with a Micky Mouse card gets sent packing and the agency don't get paid. Things will soon change then.

At my local college the first thing they would do is break you down and let you know who was there to learn and who knew what they were talking about; the fly by night training centres seem to do the opposite and spend the duration of the course pandering to the 'customer' with the aim of having them walking out of the training centre feeling they successfully managed to buy their way around the system.
There's no problem with having semi-skilled operatives having a go under supervision - that's how you learn; the problems come about when semi-skilled operatives insist they don't need supervision.

 

[Gavin John Hyde]

I have long thought that if my legs and various old injuries stop me from working then i would set up one of these training centres... the profit margins are quite impressive and if you cant beat them join them! think about it every week say 6 people coming through the door paying say £3k for the courses that can be done in 18 days..- 6 new starters each week. that is £72k just from the DI courses to join a scheme... then you can throw bricklaying, plastering, kitchen fitting or the new favourite "handyman course packages" in.. as the leaflet stated ... you can register with mybuilder, rated people and other sites and start working on completion earning £20+ per hour... i know this as a friend of mines son got the course paid for as part of his community mental health support from social services and the like to help him get back on his feet after a hard period in his life... he now has work as a labourer for a maintenance firm and seems to be doing alright for himself.
I reckon there are plenty of older and retired tradespeople out there willing to work in a nice warehouse showing people how to pass a course....
I saw recently that Tradeskills4u have opened a place in Leeds now.. they must be raking it in... There seem to be more and more of these places popping up so the demand is there...

 

[Loki]

I have long thought that if my legs and various old injuries stop me from working then i would set up one of these training centres... the profit margins are quite impressive and if you cant beat them join them! think about it every week say 6 people coming through the door paying say £3k for the courses that can be done in 18 days..- 6 new starters each week. that is £72k just from the DI courses to join a scheme... then you can throw bricklaying, plastering, kitchen fitting or the new favourite "handyman course packages" in.. as the leaflet stated ... you can register with mybuilder, rated people and other sites and start working on completion earning £20+ per hour... i know this as a friend of mines son got the course paid for as part of his community mental health support from social services and the like to help him get back on his feet after a hard period in his life... he now has work as a labourer for a maintenance firm and seems to be doing alright for himself.
I reckon there are plenty of older and retired tradespeople out there willing to work in a nice warehouse showing people how to pass a course....
I saw recently that Tradeskills4u have opened a place in Leeds now.. they must be raking it in... There seem to be more and more of these places popping up so the demand is there...

If you could get the businesses / trades to come to your training centre when they need workers like agencies do, you could then do the NVQ3 side also

 

[Rob Stephen]

Got to say I had to do short courses I have 4 kids working long shifts and am now working as an improver having to take the hit in money im on alot less then an electricians mate. £8.67 an hour. I have learned alot more being on site being with a more experienced spark. Honesty I don't rate the courses I have the paperwork and certification upto 2394/2395. Those courses are just a big money maker if I could I would go back and start from school but I didn't. When I was taking my test and inspection exams I was unemployed and volunteered to work for loads of companies for free to learn as much as possible. Testing in a house full of stuff is completely different to testing in a test center. Good luck to which ever way you need to learn and earn a living but don't rush through the experiences.

 

[telectrix]

less then an electricians mate. £8.67 an hour.

that's taking the pi$$. traineee rate is £12+.

 

[Rob Stephen]

But I had no experience and practical knowledge. I have been with the company for a year now. I have come on loads as an electrician. I've done loads of periodic inspections and remedial works working with some great people and also some old timers who just let me test and sit around having an easy day. My advice is if you do the short courses start at the bottom don't go in to companies saying your a qualified spark you will get found out. my plan is to learn as much as possible from this company. Don't make money the most important thing in the early days. I've been told it will come and the better I am the easier money will come.

 

[Aaron177]

Sadly, I'm going to have to do one of these courses. Busted my --- trying to get an apprenticeship but to no avail. Only option I have left really is a domestic installer course and combine it with an electrics course at college.

 

[Rob Stephen]

Good luck but try every company in your area after you have some qualifications I've been given a pay rise and now on £11.67 an hour and doing own jobs but I'm no where near ready to run my own business or go it alone. Just keep trying to learn offer to help a spark on your day's off for free I did this for a bit and if you do all right they might put some cash in your back pocket. The course I did was 0% interest on the learning loan think I paid £140 upfront and the rest paid monthly. You can do all the way to am2 with some courses which I regret not doing as now it's very hard for me to go further without costing me a fortune.