solar pv - no spare way

D

dp1000

Hi,
I recently took the City & Guilds PV course. I haven't done an install yet but i've been to take a look at some possible jobs. At one of the jobs i noticed there was no spare way in the main consumer unit. There was however a smaller 2 way consumer unit spurred off the supply tails via a henley block. This smaller unit supplied an electric shower and had one spare way. If i used this spare way for the PV system am I correct in assuming that the only item of equipment that will benefit from the electriciity generated will be the shower and not the circuits fed from the main consumer unit?
Thanks.
 
You would only be using that way for circuit protection,if that was the right way of doing things,it cant backfeed onto the shower circuit.... the PV array has to have its own board and a splitter,inverter,etc,etc....Where did you do the course and how long was it for??
 
blackiel said:
You would only be using that way for circuit protection,if that was the right way of doing things,it cant backfeed onto the shower circuit.... the PV array has to have its own board and a splitter,inverter,etc,etc....Where did you do the course and how long was it for??
Click to expand...
if you get this months pe from eddys theres a good story in there about a company doing it, gives you info on where to get qualified, not cheap at all tho.
 
Hello there, I am interested in pv and was wondering where exactly this article was (pe ? eddys ? ) Ive seen two courses one is the c and g( run in Centre for alternative technolgy amongst others ) and the other is a niceic approved course (run by PPL) . nice to see this new forum.Sorry didnt mean to hijack the thread.
cheers
 
The course at cat i think is about £900 and the one with ppl works out about £700 i think , interested to find out about about the napit one though. Prob quite a few people offering training i reckon at the moment . I imagine the C and G one at CAT is the one to go for
 
Hi

The City and Guild course is numbered 2372. Google this to find a course near you, as someone said, I think all the various providers are thinking of doing it. Haven't done it myself yet but I am interested. It seems to be about the £800 mark and will last 5 days.

It's my understanding from the Microgeneration Certificate Scheme - The Microgeneration Certification Scheme MCS that if the customer wants to take advantage of the feed-in tariff (obviously) they must use a product and installer who is accredited under MCS.

Accreditation is similar to the arrangements under Part P so the NIC, NAPIT and Elecsa all do this. The City and Guilds course is the necessary qualification to attain accreditation together with site visit / assessment, but the NIC course is good enough for the NIC and presumably any NAPIT course will be good enough for NAPIT. Elecsa don't do a course themselves letting City and Guilds do what they do best !

Pete
 
dp1000 said:
Hi,
I recently took the City & Guilds PV course. I haven't done an install yet but i've been to take a look at some possible jobs. At one of the jobs i noticed there was no spare way in the main consumer unit. There was however a smaller 2 way consumer unit spurred off the supply tails via a henley block. This smaller unit supplied an electric shower and had one spare way. If i used this spare way for the PV system am I correct in assuming that the only item of equipment that will benefit from the electriciity generated will be the shower and not the circuits fed from the main consumer unit?
Thanks.
Click to expand...

No the entire system will benifit not just the shower. It will be going through a generation meter prior to going into the spareway via MCB.
 
blackiel said:
the PV array has to have its own board and a splitter,inverter,etc,etc....Where did you do the course and how long was it for??
Click to expand...

Sorry not strictly true. The array does not have to go into its own board. The inverter (If grid connected) can go back to any spare way on a consumer unit and be marked up accordingly. As for back feeding the MCB is protecting the inverter not offering protection INTO the existing system and so acts just the same as any protection device on any circuit. The protection INTO the property is offered by the Inverter and if grid power is lost the inverter automatically shuts down the PV system.
 
Last edited:
blackiel said:
You would only be using that way for circuit protection,if that was the right way of doing things,it cant backfeed onto the shower circuit.... the PV array has to have its own board and a splitter,inverter,etc,etc....Where did you do the course and how long was it for??
Click to expand...

Since when does the PV Array have to have it's own board! :confused::confused::confused:
 
If anyone is interested in the PV course, have a look at ecoskies! I recently did mine through them and they were quite good.

Cheers!
 
Markc said:
Sorry not strictly true. The array does not have to go into its own board. The inverter (If grid connected) can go back to any spare way on a consumer unit and be marked up accordingly. As for back feeding the MCB is protecting the inverter not offering protection INTO the existing system and so acts just the same as any protection device on any circuit. The protection INTO the property is offered by the Inverter and if grid power is lost the inverter automatically shuts down the PV system.[/QUOTe

Youre right Mark,thanks for putting me right,what i meant to say,was that i would put it on a separate board ,to avoid any grief later in the event of a fault,as then you can eliminate that particular circuit/install from the equation..

Think ive read the original question wrong....if hes got two fuseways in the board and uses the spare to protect the inverter,is he assuming that the shower will be fed off this also??

Be Lucky
Click to expand...
 
blackiel said:
Markc said:
Sorry not strictly true. The array does not have to go into its own board. The inverter (If grid connected) can go back to any spare way on a consumer unit and be marked up accordingly. As for back feeding the MCB is protecting the inverter not offering protection INTO the existing system and so acts just the same as any protection device on any circuit. The protection INTO the property is offered by the Inverter and if grid power is lost the inverter automatically shuts down the PV system.[/QUOTe

Youre right Mark,thanks for putting me right,what i meant to say,was that i would put it on a separate board ,to avoid any grief later in the event of a fault,as then you can eliminate that particular circuit/install from the equation..

Think ive read the original question wrong....if hes got two fuseways in the board and uses the spare to protect the inverter,is he assuming that the shower will be fed off this also??

Be Lucky
Click to expand...

I have considered that option myself, Putting in a separate board just for the PV system. I can see merits to it and there is no regulation to prevent it. We seem to of been on a run of installs were a spare way was available and for neatness we have utilised it. One of my concerns using this option is one of future works that may or may not be conducted within the property. Having a separate board along side the main one may be missed for isolation when alterations are conducted on the existing electrical system. I agree it will be labelled and warning notices warning of more than one source but it would be reliant on the electrician to act on it. Agree also same to some degree when in the main board if a spare way was utilised. Still not sure but not an issue anyway.

I think he is assuming anything generated would go into the shower as that is the only thing connected to that board. Its a understandable assumption from my experience as many see PV as white man's magic. Even those who fit it!!!!!!!!!

Regards

Mark
Click to expand...
 
got talked through it by gut whon ran a PV company
pannels mounted on ali frames
pos and neg through a DC invertor to an AC isolator
cable down to board, through another AC isolator and meter
into board and into 16A breaker
thats it
 
Just use a 2amp change over switch (if sunny) if usually cloudy (normal) use a 20 ma switch from maplins. Installation is cheap, cable size needs to be no greater than 0.5mm -;) If all goes well it would power your pc, enabling you to find info on soloar power
 
dp1000 said:
Hi,
I recently took the City & Guilds PV course. I haven't done an install yet but i've been to take a look at some possible jobs. At one of the jobs i noticed there was no spare way in the main consumer unit. There was however a smaller 2 way consumer unit spurred off the supply tails via a henley block. This smaller unit supplied an electric shower and had one spare way. If i used this spare way for the PV system am I correct in assuming that the only item of equipment that will benefit from the electriciity generated will be the shower and not the circuits fed from the main consumer unit?


Thanks.
Click to expand...

No, all circuits in the dwelling will benefit,
 
I managed to get my qms pack, mentoring, training and assessment from a company called easy mcs. it is looking like it will cost about £1500 in total but i get a 0% loan as i am in Wales. easy mcs sorted all this out for me it was simple.
 
Treadwarm said:
I managed to get my qms pack, mentoring, training and assessment from a company called easy mcs. it is looking like it will cost about £1500 in total but i get a 0% loan as i am in Wales. easy mcs sorted all this out for me it was simple.
Click to expand...

hi treadwarm
im very interested in this 0% loan and the training/assessment could you pm me with more info?
 
Its Really good Coxy, you can claim around £1700 for two technologies and then you pack it back for around £70 a month, you do have to outlay the money first but once you get you certificate you send a copy to them and you have the money in your account within 3 working days. Its nice to be helped out for a change :-) i managed to get my a full bespoke QMS, the QMS Mentoring, product training and assessment all within the £1700.

Good luck let me know if i can help with anything.
 
Thanks treadwarm
im going to give them a call tomorrow.
just a little clarification if i did you manage to get a 0% interest loan for all the QMS, the QMS Mentoring, training and assessment or did you have to pay the money up front for all of this and then they pay it back to after?
i would would like to move forward with this but i dont have a spare grand or so kicking about! plus dont see the point of the 0% loan if you have the money any way.

have you done the training yet? if so what was it like?

i really appreciate your help and advise
martin
 
Hi Martin,

Yes unfortunately you do have to put the money in yourself first then you get it back within three days of passing your certification.

I was in a similar position myself but i went to the bank and shown them my confirmation letter from the bank and they arranged a small business loan.

I will make one payment towards the loan but should have everything done in around six weeks so will get it paid off as soon as the money hits.

I have not gone on the PV training yet, I am booked on a course in mid Jan so will let you know what it is like. But i am busy reading up on the QMS i bought and have been given some tips to implement that at the moment.

Anything i can help with just ask as i have been through the mcs process a few times with other companies i have worked for and for my own for heat pumps.
 
thats great thanks!
im sure ill be in touch when i get the ball rolling .
did you buy the qms from them?
good luck with every thing!
id be interested in hearing any devlopment!
 
Yeah I use to work with one of the guys who set it up so he did me a good deal :-) they will do all you need on the QMS stuff but give me a shout if you have any questions with regard to the installation side and i will do what I can.
 
lloyd1980 said:
got talked through it by gut whon ran a PV company
pannels mounted on ali frames
pos and neg through a DC invertor to an AC isolator
cable down to board, through another AC isolator and meter
into board and into 16A breaker
thats it
Click to expand...

My understanding was that the cables from the modules need to go to a DC Isolator, before they're fed into the inverter. Is that wrong then? I need to get this right as I'm doing my first install in the next few days! Thanks in advance.
 
GLES said:
My understanding was that the cables from the modules need to go to a DC Isolator, before they're fed into the inverter. Is that wrong then? I need to get this right as I'm doing my first install in the next few days! Thanks in advance.
Click to expand...


Yes that is what Lloyd1980 put

"pos and neg through a DC invertor to an AC isolator"
 
malcolmsanford said:
Yes that is what Lloyd1980 put

"pos and neg through a DC invertor to an AC isolator"
Click to expand...

OK, apologies for me misunderstanding then but I thought a DC isolator is needed, which is then connected to an inverter. Is the inverter the isolator too then? Steep learning curve this isn't it? Haha.
 
No it should be me apologising. I read it as DC isolator where he wrote DC Invertor :o

So from the Array to the DC Isolator and then into you Invertor. Out of the invertor into a AC isolator. Then your AC supply back to the FIT meter.

If the invertor is in the loft, as most are, then from the FIT meter into another AC isolator and then your RCD.
 
malcolmsanford said:
No it should be me apologising. I read it as DC isolator where he wrote DC Invertor :o

So from the Array to the DC Isolator and then into you Invertor. Out of the invertor into a AC isolator. Then your AC supply back to the FIT meter.

If the invertor is in the loft, as most are, then from the FIT meter into another AC isolator and then your RCD.
Click to expand...

Malcolm, you're a gentleman. Thanks for your help there mate.:)
 

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