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Guest123
Seems it's getting harder........
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Phil
nothing to do with luck mate you obviously put the time and effort in and worked hard for everything you deserve, well done and you can feel that bit more proud now
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Phil
nothing to do with luck mate you obviously put the time and effort in and worked hard for everything you deserve, well done and you can feel that bit more proud now
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CRAGS
Cheers Phil to be honest without trying sound bigheaded I found oct paper easier than the paper I sat in June. The past papers I had definitely helped along with alot of revision. The June paper was definitely a eye-opener and gave me the kick up the --- I needed to get my head in the books after failing that one.
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malcolmsanford
I for one hope that C&G do not "cop" out and dummy down the exam as seems to be a vogue now.
I'm also not suprised, in fact I'm more suprised that 32% past. You only have to look at questions asked on here from "qualified " electricians regarding testing, certification filling and PIR's to know that wether your a time served electrician or a 5 day wonder standards are very low.
I will say the comment about containment systems seems to be a reflection on the short courses, I would be interested to know just how much teaching is done regarding trunking, conduit, tray and basket work.
The 2392 was introduced as it was noted to be used as a stepping stone for the 2391-10, do anyone know what the pass rate for that is, and would that reflect on how easy/hard that is?
I'm also not suprised, in fact I'm more suprised that 32% past. You only have to look at questions asked on here from "qualified " electricians regarding testing, certification filling and PIR's to know that wether your a time served electrician or a 5 day wonder standards are very low.
I will say the comment about containment systems seems to be a reflection on the short courses, I would be interested to know just how much teaching is done regarding trunking, conduit, tray and basket work.
The 2392 was introduced as it was noted to be used as a stepping stone for the 2391-10, do anyone know what the pass rate for that is, and would that reflect on how easy/hard that is?
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Lucas123
it is a weird one this !!
sometimes i would swap my NVQ level 3 for 2391 as some jobs only require 17th and 2391
i done 4 year apprenticeship with 2330 levels 2 and 3 and 2356 nvq alongside so had both at the end but unless i have 2391 agencies alone dont seem to want to know
but you could theoretically go into a college / training centre do 17th 2382 and 2391 in the space of a month or so and have more of a chane of getting a job than i do yet you are not deemed "qualified" by jib as an electrcican without 2356 nvq 3
sometimes i would swap my NVQ level 3 for 2391 as some jobs only require 17th and 2391
i done 4 year apprenticeship with 2330 levels 2 and 3 and 2356 nvq alongside so had both at the end but unless i have 2391 agencies alone dont seem to want to know
but you could theoretically go into a college / training centre do 17th 2382 and 2391 in the space of a month or so and have more of a chane of getting a job than i do yet you are not deemed "qualified" by jib as an electrcican without 2356 nvq 3
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JIB are on their way out and clinging on by the skin of their teeth. I think they are a throwback to the 80's if you ask me, back to when we had an electricity board.
The thing with the NVQ is that as an employer I always look at it as "Not Very Qualified" and unfortunately that acronym has stuck over the years. Also the NVQ does not take into account specialist trades and employers know this. Whist the 2356 is 50% health and safety you can do this on a one day course these days.
Back to a 4 year apprenticeship and and time served would be great but highly unrealistic, I did a 4 year apprenticeship and cant get JIB as it's not a recognised apprenticeship in their eyes, incestuous bull poop IMO. Most reasonable employers like myself will look at your work history, but again 2391 is helpful.
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Lucas123
Back to a 4 year apprenticeship and and time served would be great but highly unrealistic, I did a 4 year apprenticeship and cant get JIB as it's not a recognised apprenticeship in their eyes, incestuous bull poop IMO. Most reasonable employers like myself will look at your work history, but again 2391 is helpful.[/QUOTE]
What did you mean by unrealistic ??
My point was most companies/agencies require jib card and in order to obtain one you need nvq
But yet alot of people i speak to who have 2391 would give their right arm for nvq level 3 because like i say the powers that be dont deem you "qualified" imo i put lot my hard work and studying for 2391 than i did 2356
as they are either not in the trade or cant enroll on one or get the funding
What did you mean by unrealistic ??
My point was most companies/agencies require jib card and in order to obtain one you need nvq
But yet alot of people i speak to who have 2391 would give their right arm for nvq level 3 because like i say the powers that be dont deem you "qualified" imo i put lot my hard work and studying for 2391 than i did 2356
as they are either not in the trade or cant enroll on one or get the funding
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The 2356 is gonna be my stumbling block because im not in the industry ATM or have the funds to pay for it. and with March being the last registration date it's very unlikely that im going to gain the NVQ3 but hopefully by the end of June I will have completed the 2330/17th Edition/2392 and 2391 qualifications So hopefully I can get somewere with those qualifications.
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malcolmsanford
In fact the JIB as caretakers of the ECS card are perhaps in the strongest position they have been in for many a year.
A lot of animosity over the JIB is the fact that unlike the Part P schemes, the JIB still insist in a certain standard and training before they will grade you, and some believe that the grade they offer is beneath them.
I can only say that i've dealt with the JIB now for many years and have been a member for over 30 and I'm glad that they make grading tough and insist that an "Electrician" is in fact a fully qualified one and long may they continue.
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If you honestly believe that somebody who has completed a NVQ 3 is fully qualified then god help us 
I agree with the principle of the JIB but as I stated earlier they are an incestuous institution, their ideas and standard are out dated and do not take into account the many electrical disciplines that exist today.
The point being somebody with a BTEC Electrical Engineering, 19 years experience, 4 year modern apprenticeship, C&G 2382 2391, 2392 cannot get a electricians grade is bull and you know it. So if he wants a card then he has to complete a log book !
I think they have their heads up their own behinds, give it 10 years and there will not be a JIB, mark my words, they are a throwback to the 80's clinging onto power by the skin of their teeth, it's only a matter of time before a more modern dynamic institution comes along and replaces them, which will probably be some European wide grading, that is recognised throughout all member states.
I agree with the principle of the JIB but as I stated earlier they are an incestuous institution, their ideas and standard are out dated and do not take into account the many electrical disciplines that exist today.
The point being somebody with a BTEC Electrical Engineering, 19 years experience, 4 year modern apprenticeship, C&G 2382 2391, 2392 cannot get a electricians grade is bull and you know it. So if he wants a card then he has to complete a log book !
I think they have their heads up their own behinds, give it 10 years and there will not be a JIB, mark my words, they are a throwback to the 80's clinging onto power by the skin of their teeth, it's only a matter of time before a more modern dynamic institution comes along and replaces them, which will probably be some European wide grading, that is recognised throughout all member states.
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malcolmsanford
Not sure where you are coming from. In the 80's there were probably about 5 grades in the JIB and now there are 0ver 40 different gradings from installation electricians through to fire alarms, maintenance, data comms etc etc, in fact I would go the opposite I think there are too many grades.
Though you seem to be well qualified you lack the one thing that an installation electrician is needing (I assume you are trying to get this grade) and that is a level 3 qualification in electrcial installation. The ECA and the IET have now recognised that there is a lack of this type of qualification around and you will be able to do a City & Guilds course to gain this.
I have worked with the JIB for over 30 years as I have stated, and funnily enough I have never had any problems with them. I think that your frustrated in the fact that your qualifications you have can not give you the grade you want, I do sympathise with that but their grading policy is clear.
You may very well be right that in the future they will be abolished or taken over by another authoritive body, but for now they are that body and you need to dance to their tune if you want their grading.
Though you seem to be well qualified you lack the one thing that an installation electrician is needing (I assume you are trying to get this grade) and that is a level 3 qualification in electrcial installation. The ECA and the IET have now recognised that there is a lack of this type of qualification around and you will be able to do a City & Guilds course to gain this.
I have worked with the JIB for over 30 years as I have stated, and funnily enough I have never had any problems with them. I think that your frustrated in the fact that your qualifications you have can not give you the grade you want, I do sympathise with that but their grading policy is clear.
You may very well be right that in the future they will be abolished or taken over by another authoritive body, but for now they are that body and you need to dance to their tune if you want their grading.
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sbrown2
I tend to agree Malcolm. It would be interesting to hear what vocational training schemes/ apprenticeships that the JIB are ignoring and not giving people grades for. I only have experience of the JIB for 1 year but it takes an amount of effort to get your gradings and you have to get the grading applicable to your qualifications/vocational qualifications.
I spoke to the JIB the other day and they are currently at the early stage of creating a domestic electrician grade which requires a grade 3 qualification. So if people are moaning now, god help us when this comes in!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I spoke to the JIB the other day and they are currently at the early stage of creating a domestic electrician grade which requires a grade 3 qualification. So if people are moaning now, god help us when this comes in!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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tonys
ELECTROTECHNICAL CERTIFICATION SCHEME
JIB - ECA - SELECT - SCOTISH JIB - UNITE
JIB-PMES
Untitled Document
JIB-PMES
Untitled Document
Ain't going no where, without a card, people won't be getting on the majority of sites.
Won't affect small fry work, but sadly that is already saturated by people of limited skills.
The requirements of these cards are starting to effect now, being asked for more and more.
I find for the cost of £35.00 for the ECS exam every 3 years and £15.00 to renew my JIB ticket every 3 years is extremely good value, and would be surprised if anyone turned their nosed up at the cost and inconvenience it causes.
More and more little one man band companies what used to have their unqualified mates working with them are losing their small contracts and those people are the ones who appear to be in no mans land looking for work, without much success.
When work was plentyful, the unqualified would get away posing as Electricians, sadly that game is over.
At present I would be knackered without my ticket, its got me some temporary work at £14.50 an hour with an agency.
Won't affect small fry work, but sadly that is already saturated by people of limited skills.
The requirements of these cards are starting to effect now, being asked for more and more.
I find for the cost of £35.00 for the ECS exam every 3 years and £15.00 to renew my JIB ticket every 3 years is extremely good value, and would be surprised if anyone turned their nosed up at the cost and inconvenience it causes.
More and more little one man band companies what used to have their unqualified mates working with them are losing their small contracts and those people are the ones who appear to be in no mans land looking for work, without much success.
When work was plentyful, the unqualified would get away posing as Electricians, sadly that game is over.
At present I would be knackered without my ticket, its got me some temporary work at £14.50 an hour with an agency.
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Lucas123
sbrown2
i have a jib card
the thread divulged into about the nvq 3 and being qualified and what not so my post maybe out of context later down the line
i done a completed apprenticeship where you do nvq level 3 alonside 2330 levels 2 and 3 day release
find out my 2391 written result tomorrow then go for approved grading if ive passed just got installation electrician at present
cheers
i have a jib card
the thread divulged into about the nvq 3 and being qualified and what not so my post maybe out of context later down the line
i done a completed apprenticeship where you do nvq level 3 alonside 2330 levels 2 and 3 day release
find out my 2391 written result tomorrow then go for approved grading if ive passed just got installation electrician at present
cheers
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HUmm, Interesting.
I assume you guys are getting asked for it when your a sub on site to the main contractor?
As a small business within a specialised profession, I used to get asked to supply CSCS cards or ecs cards for all our guys on site, now we never get asked and we have a standard H&S pack that covers competence of our chaps which they all now accept without question. If they ask for anything specific we charge the same as BT do, that focuses the client when the production line or quarry is on stop for it
I have never applied for a JIB card but I was thinking of it, which I believe would mean doing my NVQ which should not take too long. having dealt with the JIB at senior level back in the 90's I still think they have their head up their own bottoms
I assume you guys are getting asked for it when your a sub on site to the main contractor?
As a small business within a specialised profession, I used to get asked to supply CSCS cards or ecs cards for all our guys on site, now we never get asked and we have a standard H&S pack that covers competence of our chaps which they all now accept without question. If they ask for anything specific we charge the same as BT do, that focuses the client when the production line or quarry is on stop for it
I have never applied for a JIB card but I was thinking of it, which I believe would mean doing my NVQ which should not take too long. having dealt with the JIB at senior level back in the 90's I still think they have their head up their own bottoms
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Lucas123
yeah i think you have a point to be fair in as much as its their way or the highway
but like i think malcolm said they govern us to a certain extent and as he quoted we have to dance to their tune at this present moment in time.
One advantage id say would be that its an instant proof to your quals ie for interviews you dont have to bring all your certs and paperwork and what not just your little gold flexible friend !! ha
but like i think malcolm said they govern us to a certain extent and as he quoted we have to dance to their tune at this present moment in time.
One advantage id say would be that its an instant proof to your quals ie for interviews you dont have to bring all your certs and paperwork and what not just your little gold flexible friend !! ha
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malcolmsanford
Surge protection devices are covered under regulation 612.3.2 If the device can not be disconnected then it is acceptable to carry out the test at 250v but must still obtain the 1 Mohm value for a pass.
I was always taught that you test to the LV spec on LV/SELV circuits.
I was always taught that you test to the LV spec on LV/SELV circuits.
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It allows you to inspect and test other electricians installations mate, worth doing but ive been told the pass rate is down to 20%
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