Electrician's Notes

[Devon Sparky]

Hi, I posted a thread a while ago looking for guide to keep in the toolbox. I wanted something that had a decent amount of info but something that was more concise, and less vulnerable to damage, than the OSG. There's not much on the market to fit the bill but the one I did find is really useful. You can see it on you tube at Electrician's Notes by dott solutions - YouTube I've only had mine a week but I think it's a real time saver and something I thought was worth sharing. Cheers.

 

[BigSi]

I keep a complete set of NICEIC pocket guides in the van (normally pick up a set every year at Elex). They are pretty hard wearing, and you can also show them to the customer to clarify a point.

 

[MDJ]

Whats the point? really? keep a few OSGs and GNs and others in the van, by why In the tool box haha

 

[stuartcourt]

ha ha maybe they live close enough to walk to work

 

[BigSi]

The only reason why I keep them in my tool box, is because there is normally room to fit a few books and guides. :willy_nilly:

 

[Devon Sparky]

Interesting to read the last couple of replies and in answer: I tried the NIEIEC pocket notes but to be honest, by the time I'd collected the useful info I wanted to carry around with me, I found them just as bulky and un-user friendly as the OSG. And to answer, what's the point - I like to carry around a bit of info in the end pocket of my toolbox and this has proved useful twice just this week. While working at a customer's house (that was up to date with a Schedule of Test Results!) the customer wanted to change 16 ELV down lighters for LEDs. I know, like most will that the Zs should be less than 6.14 but for the LEDs I'd need a C-rated breaker. The choice was back to the van for a fumble through the OSG and a calculator to work out the 80% figure or just read it from the new book I'd bought that was in the toolbox? Same customer wanted to know why I wouldn't fit her 'bathroom' light she'd bought from a DIY store over her shower. I could show her the zone chart in the Electrician's Notes and she was happy. The booklet won't be everyone's cup of tea but having tried it, I'm quite a fan.

 

[MDJ]

Haha, good reply, looks like my tool box except I have stickle bricks in mine :hurray:

 

[monkeyelectric]

The only reason why I keep them in my tool box, is because there is normally room to fit a few books and guides. :willy_nilly:

View attachment 18277

Ah you got that set too, i got mine on special from elex, wouldn't be without it

 

[monkeyelectric]

Interesting to read the last couple of replies and in answer: I tried the NIEIEC pocket notes but to be honest, by the time I'd collected the useful info I wanted to carry around with me, I found them just as bulky and un-user friendly as the OSG. And to answer, what's the point - I like to carry around a bit of info in the end pocket of my toolbox and this has proved useful twice just this week. While working at a customer's house (that was up to date with a Schedule of Test Results!) the customer wanted to change 16 ELV down lighters for LEDs. I know, like most will that the Zs should be less than 6.14 but for the LEDs I'd need a C-rated breaker. The choice was back to the van for a fumble through the OSG and a calculator to work out the 80% figure or just read it from the new book I'd bought that was in the toolbox? Same customer wanted to know why I wouldn't fit her 'bathroom' light she'd bought from a DIY store over her shower. I could show her the zone chart in the Electrician's Notes and she was happy. The booklet won't be everyone's cup of tea but having tried it, I'm quite a fan.

The osg values are 80% already

 

[BigSi]

The only problem is my nephew keeps trying to pinch them every time he visits. Trouble is, how can you tell him it’s dangerous to play with Tommy tape measure and Sally screwdriver!!!

 

[monkeyelectric]

The only problem is my nephew keeps trying to pinch them every time he visits. Trouble is, how can you tell him it’s dangerous to play with Tommy tape measure and Sally screwdriver!!!

Last time i was on site a stinking plumber tried to borrow Tommy tape so i stabbed him with Sally screwdriver

 

[Adam W]

Can anyone comment on the Amicus guides? I've not used them myself but I hear they're supposed to be worth the money.

 

[rmc86uk]

If I kept a copy of the OSG in my bag I'd get laughed at plus it's also red!

 

[Devon Sparky]

Can anyone comment on the Amicus guides? I've not used them myself but I hear they're supposed to be worth the money.

I think the Amicus guides have now gone and been replaced by Unite Guides. They are good but not for the same purpose. The Electrician's Notes are good on site or handy to have when filling in the paperwork. The Unite Guides are more like a revision tool for passing exams or refreshing your regs knowledge.

 

[brman]

Interesting to read the last couple of replies and in answer: I tried the NIEIEC pocket notes but to be honest, by the time I'd collected the useful info I wanted to carry around with me, I found them just as bulky and un-user friendly as the OSG. And to answer, what's the point - I like to carry around a bit of info in the end pocket of my toolbox and this has proved useful twice just this week. While working at a customer's house (that was up to date with a Schedule of Test Results!) the customer wanted to change 16 ELV down lighters for LEDs. I know, like most will that the Zs should be less than 6.14 but for the LEDs I'd need a C-rated breaker. The choice was back to the van for a fumble through the OSG and a calculator to work out the 80% figure or just read it from the new book I'd bought that was in the toolbox? Same customer wanted to know why I wouldn't fit her 'bathroom' light she'd bought from a DIY store over her shower. I could show her the zone chart in the Electrician's Notes and she was happy. The booklet won't be everyone's cup of tea but having tried it, I'm quite a fan.

I can sort of see your point but I have to admit I have never had anyone question me when I quote things like zones to them off the top of my head.
My phone has a calculator so 230/(6*10)*0.8 isn't a difficult sum. Plus doing it on a calculator in front the customer makes them think I know what I am doing.....

 

[Devon Sparky]

True...the equation you put up isn't a difficult sum...but it doesn't give the right answer. I was looking for the 80% figure for a 6amp breaker on a C curve (the breaker that the manufacturers of the LED downlighters I use recommend for circuits with more than 14 fittings). My Electrician's Notes (and the 7671) tell me this is 3.06 - I make your sum to be 4.79. This sort of backs up my liking for a quick reference guide in the toolbox or handy in the van.

 

[brman]

True...the equation you put up isn't a difficult sum...but it doesn't give the right answer. I was looking for the 80% figure for a 6amp breaker on a C curve (the breaker that the manufacturers of the LED downlighters I use recommend for circuits with more than 14 fittings). My Electrician's Notes (and the 7671) tell me this is 3.06 - I make your sum to be 4.79. This sort of backs up my liking for a quick reference guide in the toolbox or handy in the van.

Sorry, I've been on my hols and only just seen your reply.

I think you might have had finger trouble with your calculator

230/(6*10)*0.8=3.0666 according to mine :lol:

I think you might have done 230/(6*10*0.8) which gives 4.79.....

Mind you, that might have just proved your point. I guess a table of numbers is less likely to go wrong that working it out on a calculator all the time

 

[Devon Sparky]

Sorry, I've been on my hols and only just seen your reply.

I think you might have had finger trouble with your calculator

230/(6*10)*0.8=3.0666 according to mine :lol:

I think you might have done 230/(6*10*0.8) which gives 4.79.....

Mind you, that might have just proved your point. I guess a table of numbers is less likely to go wrong that working it out on a calculator all the time

What can I say....I've had several sleeps since my 'A' Level maths! Also in 30 years in the trade I've never used that equation for a breaker so this old dog has learnt something new today!

 

[Devon Sparky]

I think I still prefer my Electrician's Notes but I like your equation. I've had a look through my old course work and can't find any reference to the equation you're using - I'd be interested to know the algebraic equation if you have and if you have the figures for a C rated breaker? Cheers :43:

 

[brman]

The equation is based on the curves for BS breakers. If you look at the curves in the BGB you will see that a type B breaker needs 5 times its rated current for a 0.1 to 5 second break time. A type C needs 10 times the rated current and a type D is 20 times I think (but I don't use them much! )

So, if your breaker rating is I Amps. Nominal voltage (Uo) is 230V and derating for temperature (d) is 0.8 then the equations is:
Max Zs = d * Uo / (I * 5) for type B or
Max Zs = d * Uo / (I * 10) for type C etc

Hence, a type C 6A is 0.8 x 230 / (6 * 10) or 3.066 ohms.

I hope that makes sense!

 

[Devon Sparky]

Thanks for that, it does make sense and seems to ring a bell somewhere from the mists of time!