Electric underfloor heating for a church?

[Pretty Mouth]

What are your thoughts on using electric underfloor heating as a primary heat source in a church?

It's a typical old church building - a couple of hundred years old, very high ceiling, masonry walls, single glazed stained glass windows, no insulation anywhere. You know the sort of thing. Cold, and difficult to heat. The wall heaters aren't very effective, as the heat just rises up away from where it's useful.

The church representative suggested UFH, the idea being that it would produce heat where it's needed most. The church is used sporadically, so it wouldn't be heated all the time, just when needed.

Just wondering what you all think of the idea? Has anyone here done the same, or heated a similar space using UFH? What about warm up times, and efficiency?

 

[Bob Geldoff1234]

A Church I work for had all the old radiators removed and 2 air conditioning units installed that heat in the winter and cool in the summer.They certainly warmed the place up and that had very high ceilings.I cannot see UFH working in such a large area.

 

[littlespark]

The old biddies will think Hell is creeping up to them from underfoot….

Many of the churches I’ve seen are tubular heaters under the seats, and the occasional panel heater in smaller vestry rooms.

 

[nicebutdim]

Tube heaters on the underside of pews are hard to beat for getting heat to where it needs to be.

 

[123]

UFH for a building used sporadically doesn't seem like the best of ideas, by the time the heat starts to come through the building is empty again

 

[DPG]

I'd imagine any electric UFH that would make a significant difference to a big stone building like that would cost a fortune to run.

 

[pc1966]

Having a heat pump and water underfloor heating can work quite well in terms of comfort and running cost (within reason) but it is not a cheap installation.

Was once holidaying in some converted fishing cottages far north with that and amazed that I was not bloody freezing as I expected to be!

Edit: Was here:

Holiday at Shore Cottages No. 2, Berriedale near Wick, Caithness | The Landmark Trust

Book your stay at one of two fisherman’s cottages built in the 1840s. Reached by a footbridge, your front door opens onto the beach.

www.landmarktrust.org.uk

 

[pc1966]

Tube heaters on the underside of pews are hard to beat for getting heat to where it needs to be.

If fancy you could even have pew-sensors so only the occupied ones switch on

 

[Pretty Mouth]

Thanks guys. I should have pointed out that there are no pews there, just plastic chairs.

 

[pc1966]

The IR radiator sort might be good as they offer "instant warmth" before air has to heat up, etc, so if church used only for short periods at a time more economic.

But longer use a heat pump, either for UFH or air-con working in reverse to heat (as suggested above) is going to get more therms per £ than other methods.

 

[snowhead]

Sorted;

Pair each of these, to be returned upon exiting of Church,

 

[Simon47]

Hmm, all electric heating in that sort of building - I can't help thinking it might be just as cost effective as getting a load of fivers from the bank and burning them in a brazier
We have a wet system that's been cobbled together over time - starting with the old cast pipes down both sides, and most recently with some fan coils added. It takes the boiler half an hour just to get the (guestimate) 100 gallons of water in the system up to the point where the pipe stats in the fan coils come on.
As they were installed, the fans were far too noisy, so at the start of the service they'd be switched off. At this point, the water in the pipes isn't hot enough for them to do all that much, and the cold draughts coming down off the windows made everyone cold rather quickly. We've done some experimenting, and by changing the stats for a higher temperature, and fitting resistors to give an extra-slow speed we've just about got it to the point where they can stay on and the place isn't too bad now. But it's still expensive to run (oil - no mains gas) and I'd hate to think how much it would cost to heat by electric.

UFH is definitely the way to go in terms of heating, but direct electric would probably be the last choice for running costs. Mains gas & condensing boiler would probably top the list, followed by a heat pump - both wet systems. Oil or tank gas probably still come higher on the list than direct lecky.
BTW - one advantage of wet system is that they are limited in temperature to the temperature of the water going round. If someone puts a rug or carpet down on part fo the floor then that bit of floor can't overheat. Electric is constant energy - if you insulate part of the floor with carpet or furniture, then that part will get hotter (potentially a lot hotter) unless you have self-regulating elements.

 

[7029 dave]

Thanks guys. I should have pointed out that there are no pews there, just plastic chairs.

Methodists then

 

[nicebutdim]

Methodists then

It was in a Methodist church, as a kid, that I first saw under-pew tube heaters

 

[Timbo]

Overhead radiant heaters.
Infra red black heat.

 

[brianmoooore]

Overhead radiant heaters.
Infra red black heat.

Equals warm heads and freezing feet.
There's no perfect solution at a reasonable cost, but under pew tubular heaters do at least warm the seat, and allow congregation members to tuck their feet back and warm them as well.

 

[Simon47]

Equals warm heads and freezing feet.

Yeah, nothing quite like that "I'm sat under the grill" feeling

 

[Last plumber]

Wet system, pipework and rads sited correctly is the best thing for a church in my opinion.
Maybe a couple of Myson low line fan convectors on a separate zone (drop out prior to service).
Infrared wall heater in transepts or other small rooms/areas that might be used on occasion or for small gatherings etc.

 

[Simon47]

I agree, that's probably about the best option for retrofit. If the opportunity arises, UFH (wet), possibly in combination with rads if needed for total heat output gives the advantage of not leaving the feet as cold.
But whatever goes in, churches are usually a p.i.t.a. (and expensive) to heat.

 

[Pretty Mouth]

Thanks for all your comments on this, I'll pass on the info to the church representative.

This might be a better idea than UFH for a church: I recall seeing these at a Christmas market in Berlin years ago, you paid a euro and got 10 minutes or so in them to warm up. (not my photo, stolen from the web)

 

[Simon47]

Funnily enough, was discussing heating and cold churches with the vicar a while ago - when we were at one of the colder ones locally. A comment was made that one of the vicar's skills is learning where best to stand - i.e. against a radiator

 

[Last plumber]

When I said 'wet' system, I didn't mean UFH. I meant pipework in the right positions as well as rads etc, etc.
Just being a bit clearer.

 

[mainline]

Sorted;

Pair each of these, to be returned upon exiting of Church,

View attachment 96136 View attachment 96137

Work in the winter go to church in the summer

 

[UKMeterman]

This church has a wet underfloor heating system but the building is used 7 days a week. https://www.emporis.com/buildings/211624/nieuwe-kerk-amsterdam-netherlands