100a Isolation Switch Cost

[Cbuk2k2]

I feel I should be more open. I am not a member of a relevant professional body and I'm not an electrician. I have a close friend who is but he doesn't live close so can't do the work. He does not condone what I'm doing but he reluctantly agrees to help.

I have a multifuntion tester and know which tests are required and how to conduct them. So if any work I do ends up with an installation that passes all tests specified in the wiring regulations it would be safe. I appreciate that the vast majority of DIYers would not have access to that kit nor how to use it nor would they typically have access to a good electrician friend willing to offer advise. I also believe that the vast majority of DIYers who attempted most notifiable work would probably not complete it to a satisfactory standard because there are so many "gotchas" and ways to go wrong.

My motivation with this is to have an isolator fitted that is agreed by SSE who would presumably re-seal the carrier. Once that is in place my motivation is only to fit a board that can accept RCDs. i.e. something that would make the installation a lot safer than it is currently. I am not interested in having a tick at building control but I am interested in ensuring it meets the wiring regulations. My on site guide is 19th so that will do ( I don't have the full copy so rely on my mate ).

I do hope this thread doesn't seem like "trolling". I am not wishing to annoy any professional electrician and I am certainly grateful and interested in your views. Would you fit a 100a isolator inbetween the meter and the CU and how much for?

I am frustrated however, that an electrician would apparently not be able to do this job without being responsible for every strand of cable downstream of the DNO's fuse. That is what I feared and one reason I started to accumulate the ppe required for the job. In simple terms, I'm told £60 is reasonable and I say I'm willing to pay up to £200 but apparently that isn't enough? I need get ready to pay for a full re-wire? Or perhaps I missunderstood ?

I’ve got plenty of electrical qualifications and experience but have never needed any of the domestic ones. I think a judge or insurance company would have a hard time saying I wasn’t “competent”. But I’d still pay a person on a register scheme if I needed a consumer unit change or a rewire.

Physically fitting your isolator is a doddle, I could get my nan to do it for you. What you’re paying for is the knowledge and experience of the tradesperson who comes to fit it.

First off pay someone to compete an inspection (EICR or whatever it’s called this month). Find out what if anything’s wrong with the electrics in you’re home. You could be sleeping in a house fire waiting to happen. It’ll cost you £2-300.

Your electrician will then tell you what if anything needs modifying to make your home safe.

Changing a consumer unit of fitting tje isolator is a bad plan because you as the home owner are legally responsible if anything goes wrong. If your house burns down your insurers may not pay out and if anyone is injured you may well end up in court.

 

[Wilko]

Hi - thanks for the pic. It looks like your meter is sealed and is not of the type that gives separate access to the outgoing side, so officially this needs the Supplier to open. As others have said an isolating switch can be readily installed if the final connection to the meter is not needed to be changed.

It’s not the job of the Electrician to turn your power off. But they should always review your installation to confirm it’s suitable for the proposed change. This can mean that sometimes planned Job A can’t start till agreement is reached about fixing newly found problem B.

 

[Wilko]

I’m also in Bracknell and am happy to advise further if you’d like to message me.

 

[davesparks]

I have a multifuntion tester and know which tests are required and how to conduct them. So if any work I do ends up with an installation that passes all tests specified in the wiring regulations it would be safe.

Once that is in place my motivation is only to fit a board that can accept RCDs. i.e. something that would make the installation a lot safer than it is currently. I am not interested in having a tick at building control but I am interested in ensuring it meets the wiring regulations. My on site guide is 19th so that will do ( I don't have the full copy so rely on my mate ).


I am frustrated however, that an electrician would apparently not be able to do this job without being responsible for every strand of cable downstream of the DNO's fuse.

Passing all of the tests does not make it safe or fully compliant, it only confirms certain things.
You could have bare copper conductors clipped to joists that would pass all tests but clearly are dangerous and non compliant.
Your work needs to be designed in compliance with bs7671 and pass full first and second fix inspections as well as testing for it to be safe and compliant.

RCDs will only make the installation safer if the installation is already in good condition, it is possible for existing, undetected, faults to prevent RCDs from working. Also RCDs don't provide the primary level of protection, this needs to be ensured also.

An electrician is able to do this job without becoming responsible for the entire installation, we are only responsible for our own work. However before starting work we must ensure that certain basic safety requirements are in place, such as bonding, suitability of the supply earth, ADS etc.
We are also free to work above and beyond the regulations and accept or turn down any job we are offered as we see fit.
Just because we can do, or are allowed to do, a particular job, it doesn't mean we have to do it.

 

[Midwest]

My motivation with this is to have an isolator fitted that is agreed by SSE who would presumably re-seal the carrier. Once that is in place my motivation is only to fit a board that can accept RCDs. i.e. something that would make the installation a lot safer than it is currently. I am not interested in having a tick at building control but I am interested in ensuring it meets the wiring regulations. My on site guide is 19th so that will do ( I don't have the full copy so rely on my mate ).

I'd have a think about not notifying any electrical works to your LBC. I retired last year, and have had 3 or 4 requests from old customers for copies of electrical certificates, required for house sales.

I moved house last year, and you are required to complete a legal document asking various questions. One of which is have you had any electrical work carried out (since 2005), and provide certificates & compliance certificates.

I will probably need to relocate my CU in time. I won't have the latest qualifications, so will probably pay some sparks to do it.

 

[Deleted member 112675]

Well some more news on this today. My supplier (not my DNO) has as part of an Ombudsman case (mostly about other things but I added their lack of response to my request in there) agreed to fit an isolator for £79 !

That is perfectly reasonable in my view and when they finally get around to doing it I'll be very happy. Still not sure how this is going to work in practice though and have half a feeling they quoted this to the Ombudsman just to keep her happy. We'll see...

It does beg the question though as to why local electricians would need to see the installation and presumably charge to rectify any issues they saw before fitting the switch. Pics of CU and surrounds not good enough.

The supplier hasn't made this conditional - I simply need to pay the cash and they'll fit it. As I understand it they don't care if my installation was put in by a handyman in the 1920s, has bare wire exposed everywhere incl bathroom and outside, fuse box is so hot its used as a radiator and it sparks & clicks constantly. They'll fit it and don't need any more info (with which to charge me more).

 

[Grant1987]

Well some more news on this today. My supplier (not my DNO) has as part of an Ombudsman case (mostly about other things but I added their lack of response to my request in there) agreed to fit an isolator for £79 !

That is perfectly reasonable in my view and when they finally get around to doing it I'll be very happy. Still not sure how this is going to work in practice though and have half a feeling they quoted this to the Ombudsman just to keep her happy. We'll see...

It does beg the question though as to why local electricians would need to see the installation and presumably charge to rectify any issues they saw before fitting the switch. Pics of CU and surrounds not good enough.

The supplier hasn't made this conditional - I simply need to pay the cash and they'll fit it. As I understand it they don't care if my installation was put in by a handyman in the 1920s, has bare wire exposed everywhere incl bathroom and outside, fuse box is so hot its used as a radiator and it sparks & clicks constantly. They'll fit it and don't need any more info (with which to charge me more).

I’ve also carried work out at the main cut out fuses for most energy companies because I worked on a storage heater contract which involved all the energy companies at first I was told I wasn’t allowed to cut the ties and breaking the law from many companies around Britain, but when I explained the situation that without me isolating and renewing the undersized (in some occasions) detoriorating, melting tails that the property I was working at is at high risk they soon backed down, i then got into conversation with many engineers from the energy supply companies who to be quite frank havnt got a f****ing clue

 

[M4rtyj]

Dno's charges for fitting an isolator vary in price, I know from experience that BG charge around £60 but I had a quote recently from OVO for £160!
There is also a company online who for £68+vat who will come out and pull the fuse and fit an isolator and reseal

 

[DefyG]

My on site guide is 19th so that will do ( I don't have the full copy so rely on my mate ).

I'm still only working to the 18th!

I think you are over complicating the issue by bringing in the CU replacement as well.
If the DNO came to install an isolator they wouldn't give two hoots to your existing CU/installation (unless there was something really obviously dangerous), but may recommend an EICR.

Meter tails look like 16sq to me!

 

[Deleted member 112675]

I'm still only working to the 18th!

I think you are over complicating the issue by bringing in the CU replacement as well.
If the DNO came to install an isolator they wouldn't give two hoots to your existing CU/installation (unless there was something really obviously dangerous), but may recommend an EICR.

Meter tails look like 16sq to me!

Yes I would expect that. So why then would most electricians apparently not want to do the job unless they were also in with a good chance of doing the CU too? Or more bonding or whatever else was deemed unsafe ? I suppose they don't want to do it for the same reason the suppliers and DNOs don't want to. Not much cash in it for the risk.

I suppose its completely reasonable that a fully qualified and professional electrician would not want to travel somewhere just for eighty quid or so. I just wish it was more transparent and not masked under safety issues.

Its also interesting that you're working to the 18th. The one electrician I did contact said he would only fit a metal box to house the isolator. Did that rule come in with the 19th ?

P.S. If I do eventually get the isolator fitted by the supplier and if those tails are 16 should I ask before hand about upgrading to 25 or when the guy gets to site? Should they upgrade them as part of the isolator work (i.e. at no more cost)?

P.P.S. I'd love to know the name of the company that does the isolator for £68+vat ?

 

[davesparks]

Yes I would expect that. So why then would most electricians apparently not want to do the job unless they were also in with a good chance of doing the CU too? Or more bonding or whatever else was deemed unsafe ? I suppose they don't want to do it for the same reason the suppliers and DNOs don't want to. Not much cash in it for the risk.

I suppose its completely reasonable that a fully qualified and professional electrician would not want to travel somewhere just for eighty quid or so. I just wish it was more transparent and not masked under safety issues.

Its also interesting that you're working to the 18th. The one electrician I did contact said he would only fit a metal box to house the isolator. Did that rule come in with the 19th ?

P.S. If I do eventually get the isolator fitted by the supplier and if those tails are 16 should I ask before hand about upgrading to 25 or when the guy gets to site? Should they upgrade them as part of the isolator work (i.e. at no more cost)?

P.P.S. I'd love to know the name of the company that does the isolator for £68+vat ?

This doesn't make much sense, you say most electricians won't do the work without doing a load of other work, but then go on to say that you've only contacted one electrician?

The 18th edition is the current one, the 19th edition doesn't exist yet and probably won't be coming out for another 6/7 years (but hopefully longer)

The first question to answer about the tails is what size do they need to be?

 

[Deleted member 112675]

Apologies I didn't mean to say 19th. Said it once then repeated myself.

Just checked the ring binder and it is of course the 18th edition.

 

[Gavin John Hyde]

Call a company called haste they will come fit a isolator and pull fuse, including any required tails for £92 inc vat. Sse will allow you to pull the fuse but its down to your confidence and being safe.

 

[HappyHippyDad]

Then the SSE are wrong as we cannot legally pull main fuses. Only the DNO’s and power supplier companies can do that.

I was about to quote reg 537.1.3 which has a note at the end of it which says you can withdraw the cut out fuse if authorised to do so by the DNO, I would class the email that the OP got as authorisation for the electrician to do just this.

However, for those of you who have the BGB and the BYB you will see that this reg is in there, but checking the BBB it seems that section 537.1 has been reworded and I cannot find it now.

 

[M4rtyj]

I was also referring to company called haste, couldn't remember the name.

 

[HappyHippyDad]

@sparkless2 It's really not a good idea to change the consumer unit yourself. You could easily just see where all the cables went before and just change them over to new consumer unit which has some form of RCD in it. That is just like me copying word for word what a French person says but i have know idea what it means. You may even think you do have a little electrical knowledge, that will be even worse with a consumer unit change as it may give you the (incorrect) confidence to do it.

One of the most important (if not the most important) aspect is having the correct testing equipment (i.e a multi function tester so that you can test the RCD's are tripping correctly amongst many other tests. The testing can sometimes take almost as long as installing the unit itself.

I do admire the fact that you've come clean and admitted what your plans are, you also sound like a fairly sensible chap..... so don't do it!

 

[DefyG]

As an NICEIC Approved Contractor I wouldn't hesitate (and have done) in pulling the main cutout fuses (incl 3phase) where the need arises, to fit an isolator or whatever the need may be. An isolator change is a relatively easy job (I'd allow typically) 30mins (1ph) 45-60mins (3ph) when on site so not going to be mega £££'s.
Funnily enough I have one to fit soon on an agricultural property (3ph) but my time in getting there and back will be far greater than the actual cost of fitting the device (materials excluded).

We then notify the DNO (in our case SSE) what we've done and that it needs re-sealing. In reality I doubt that it hardly ever gets done and cant say I've returned to site to check.
Sometimes we might fit our own seals if think tampering might be an issue.

As HHD post above, get a professional sparks to look at changing the CU. Its not a job for a DIYer!

 

[naylorpd]

I had this work done recently...
I needed to upgrade the tails between the meter and the CU from 16mm to 25mm and chose to add an isolation switch at the same time so that I could isolate my house CU and wiring without having to pull the fuse or break any seals in future...

The electricity supplier (not the DNO) needed to do this work, because they had to disconnect/reconnect the tails at the meter, which had the supplier's seal (different to the DNO's seal which is on the main fuse).

My CU had been newly replaced by a forum member, but before the isolator was fitted, due to the 3 week delay. The whole installation was checked thoroughly, not just a rewire of what you see in the cupboard.

No matter what qualifications a sparky has, they are not allowed to do this as they can't re-seal the meter. Tampering with the seals is a criminal offence because the implications are that you are unsealing the meter to steal electricity. Seals are apparently inspected about every 3 years or so - even though you regularly send in your own meter readings, eventually the supplier will insist on the meter being read by one of their guys and this is one of the things he'll be looking for.

Total cost for the job, tails plus isolation switch, was £130. Job took about an hour by a sub-contractor to the elec supplier (ironically, who was studying to be a proper electrician in his spare time).

The downside is that in my case it took at least 3 weeks to get an appointment for the work to be done. Also the electricity supplier will only speak to their customer, so if you own the property but your tenant is the customer, he will need to cooperate for the job to happen.

 

[Midwest]

I’ve replaced meter tails before now, my DNO SSE (as already said) allows Scheme members to pull main fuses.

As far as I’m aware, cutting a seal is not a criminal offence. Illegal abstraction of electricity is; to be found guilty of this offence, would require more of an actus resus, than just cutting a seal.

I’ve revisited various properties, where I’ve followed the correct procedure for cutting a seal etc. Some still had the temporary seals I had installed, some had shiny new Suppliers and or DNO seals. I don’t think there’s an active campaign to inspect seals, especially if the energy supplier is getting its money’s worth in payment for their products.

 

[davesparks]

I had this work done recently...
I needed to upgrade the tails between the meter and the CU from 16mm to 25mm and chose to add an isolation switch at the same time so that I could isolate my house CU and wiring without having to pull the fuse or break any seals in future...

The electricity supplier (not the DNO) needed to do this work, because they had to disconnect/reconnect the tails at the meter, which had the supplier's seal (different to the DNO's seal which is on the main fuse).

My CU had been newly replaced by a forum member, but before the isolator was fitted, due to the 3 week delay. The whole installation was checked thoroughly, not just a rewire of what you see in the cupboard.

No matter what qualifications a sparky has, they are not allowed to do this as they can't re-seal the meter. Tampering with the seals is a criminal offence because the implications are that you are unsealing the meter to steal electricity. Seals are apparently inspected about every 3 years or so - even though you regularly send in your own meter readings, eventually the supplier will insist on the meter being read by one of their guys and this is one of the things he'll be looking for.

Total cost for the job, tails plus isolation switch, was £130. Job took about an hour by a sub-contractor to the elec supplier (ironically, who was studying to be a proper electrician in his spare time).

The downside is that in my case it took at least 3 weeks to get an appointment for the work to be done. Also the electricity supplier will only speak to their customer, so if you own the property but your tenant is the customer, he will need to cooperate for the job to happen.

Your information is incorrect, electricians are permitted by certain DNO's to break the seals.
The DNO can do this work, it doesn't have to be the electricity supplier, there are also independant companies who are authorised to do this. As you say there are subcontractors doing the work.
Cutting seals doesn't equate to prosecution for theft of electricity, they will have to prove the theft for this to happen. If there was a sudden drop in electricity usage that coincided with the seals being cut then they might take an interest.