110V - Worth it for housebashing?

[overskilled]

Looking to make some tool purchases this year...though not decided whether to go for standard 230V or go 110V and transformer.
Leaning towards 230 due to not having to lug a transformer around, however then theres the argument "certain people" put forward that 230 looks "diyer"....
I don't do construction sites (not counting self build / house extensions where the home owner doesn't give 2 monkeys what voltage I use as long as the jobs done right..)

Thoughts?

 

[shanky887614]

Looking to make some tool purchases this year...though not decided whether to go for standard 230V or go 110V and transformer.
Leaning towards 230 due to not having to lug a transformer around, however then theres the argument "certain people" put forward that 230 looks "diyer"....
I don't do construction sites (not counting self build / house extensions where the home owner doesn't give 2 monkeys what voltage I use as long as the jobs done right..)

Thoughts?

Battery powered tools are just more convenient.

 

[overskilled]

Battery powered grinders are as much use as a chocolate oven tho!

Where are the 36V grinders?....You'd think someone would have come up with one by this time...given you get 36V SDS......hmm.....

Don't get me wrong, I love my cordless tools, but stuff like grinders and wallchasers need the ummmph of mains power...

 

[gnuuser]

purchase the tools suitable to your area
getting a step-down transformer to run 110 volt tools would not be practical for you because the space they take up and the requirements you would need to keep them up to date with pat testing and all may not be worth the bother.
you can tell those certain people that it doesn't matter what tools you use its how you use them and are they safer to use.
many of those people don't realise that when you are stepping down the voltage you are stepping up the current.

 

[overskilled]

thing is GNU (apologies if you are already aware), 110 here is actually 2 phase Centre Tapped Earth with 55v per phase. So in theory its safer to use.
I'm pretty much sold on 230v though, have enough to haul around as it is...
I'll try and get that book posted this week, (if the photocopier behaves itself so i can copy my notes out of it that is...)

 

[Geordie Spark]

I think householders - including me- don't like boxes & wires trailing all over the place and they wouldn't see a transformer as being "professional" at all - just another bloody nuisance trip over.

110v is great in factories and shipyards ( anyone remember them?? ) but in a domestic situation ???

Don't waste your money.

 

[thekingiam]

hmm i have to say i use both 230 wall chaser,110 grinder and drill also have a 230 drill but my makita 110 knocks the socks off the 230 bosch.used to carying the transformer now but it is a bit of a ball ache

 

[shanky887614]

hmm i have to say i use both 230 wall chaser,110 grinder and drill also have a 230 drill but my makita 110 knocks the socks off the 230 bosch.used to carying the transformer now but it is a bit of a ball ache

why not buy a smaller transformer then as there a bit lighter

 

[gnuuser]

thing is GNU (apologies if you are already aware), 110 here is actually 2 phase Centre Tapped Earth with 55v per phase. So in theory its safer to use.
I'm pretty much sold on 230v though, have enough to haul around as it is...
I'll try and get that book posted this week, (if the photocopier behaves itself so i can copy my notes out of it that is...)

yeah im aware of it thank you anyway!
part of training here is extensive transformer theory
our systems here use split phase for resi and small commercial and wye and delta 3 phase industrial
sometimes its such a trial dealing with people with very little to no training in electricity as most home owners or production managers tend to be.
many of them think with the pocket book rather than their heads, and will often make dangerous mistakes (makes me want to pull my hair out):mad2:
they don't seem to understand that its not the voltage but the current behind it that packs the wallop.
I imagine you guys have to deal with these types as well

 

[Lucien Nunes]

I think we might be at cross purposes here GNU because it's a silly UK-only issue, apologies if I'm covering old ground...

Although we have no 110V service anywhere in the UK, building site safety rules usually demand that all power tools are 110V. When a building is put up, a 110V temporary system is thrown in to supply the tools and lighting, then when the building is finished that is taken out and the 230V is switched on. Often there is no 230V until that point and the use of 230V tools is forbidden anyway, so 110V tools are essential.

Once the construction work is finished there is only 230V left. Therefore, a UK contractor working in a low hazard environment either has to carry a stepdown transformer to power his stock of 110V tools or invest in a duplicate set of tools, 110V for construction sites and 230V for general work. I have this situation later this week. I will be wiring a rack of 230V electronic equipment, to which there is already 230V power, but I am forbidden to use my everyday 230V soldering iron, I must take a 110V one.

 

[Guest111]

When I started off I bought 110v kit,as it is much safer,plus you never know where you may work next month and you may be required to use it.Local authorities may also insist on it if you do any work in their homes as a contractor,they do up here.yes carrying a transformer may be an extra bit of kit but IMO the benefits outweigh the hassle of carrying it.remember though that it should be plugged into the wall and the extension leads should be on the 110 side,this is something a lot of people forget and negates the safety benefits of using one.

 

[plugsandsparks]

I think it really depends on the type of work you do. When I was refreshing my tools, some of my work , site rules dictated battery only tools, sometimes I was a long way away from any fixed power - in the end I ended up with all my main tools being battery and have an inverter in the car for charging and two 25M 240V extension leads. I am convinced there is productivity savings by not messing around with tranformers and extension leads but you do have to plan your batteries or you end up with an extra tea break whilst they charge up again )

 

[camerabloke]

An extra tea break is always nice
I use 110 when i need corded equipment ie drilling joists on new houses but i also have loads of battery stuff which is usefull for small works etc.
for the sake of a transformer, i would go 110 all the way

 

[Plonker 3]

Got 110v SDS and jigsaw. But have 18v SDS, Drill, Impact driver, Grinder, and multi tool. 22 Minute charge on the Makita range so never really waiting around for the batteries to charge up.

Only use 110v stuff if going to be using it all day for prolonged periods, like putting up unistrut etc so dont really get it off the van but it is there if I need it.

 

[overskilled]

Thanks for the thoughts guys...
Needs some more thought on my part....Most of my stuff is battery powered, lot easier than dragging around leads etc...but there are things that don't work as well cordless..grinders for one...
Would a (3.3Kva intermittent - 1.5Kva Constant) 110 transformer run a 2000W 9" grinder or is it going to trip the thermal cutout all the time?

 

[telectrix]

you need a 3KVA tranny.

 

[Lucien Nunes]

Should be OK with that, IIRC I have used my 9" on a 3.3kVA (int) quite heavily and never had it trip. only hitch is that the grinder ought to have a 32A plug and most 3.3's have 2x16A sockets.

 

[James-]

Just dont wear out expensive cordless gear!!! when you could be using a 110 or 230, I see it all the time, the gears in my 18v combi XLT now sounds like an expensive babies rattle

 

[shanky887614]

Just dont wear out expensive cordless gear!!! when you could be using a 110 or 230, I see it all the time, the gears in my 18v combi XLT now sounds like an expensive babies rattle

Thats a design fault in makita 3 speed models.

There is a reason there new drills are two speed (do you ever use all three anyway)

 

[gnuuser]

you need a 3KVA tranny.

i agree as well but i tend to towards heavy duty gear because of the durability
if you build one mount it on a small hand truck
and install a small cooling fan to ventilate it

 

[overskilled]

Cheers all.
Lucien - figured as much.

Gnu: Hmmm now there could be the project for next winter....

 

[gnuuser]

we had one in our shop for the upper floors of the batch tower
everything was 3 phase up there so we made a portable and put the tranny in an enclosure.
after cutting in the vent slots we installed a cooling fan in it.
(since then we have run conduit and 110 v circuits up there and our boss sold our portable to our sister factory)

 

[Fin170]

230v with a plug in RCD for me, although not working on any big sites with my power tools (minus 18v drill)

Though when I've been putting in temporises I could question how carrying those ~80kg transformers up flights of stairs to see them sit in a dry place getting very hot is 'safer' :lol:

 

[Silly Sausage]

I used to sit my 1.5kVA tranny in a bucket of cold water...

 

[Lucien Nunes]

I agree about heavy duty gear GNU, but most UK tradesmen have a standard type of isolating transformer available at every tool store in the country in ratings of 750VA upwards. They are made to BS3535, encapsulated in a moisture resistant yellow resin case with splashproof EN60309 sockets and CE marked and safety approved for isolation purposes. They are usually good value and I doubt that you could build one for less, and if you did it would lack the necessary approvals.

Ultimately, it's not about which kind of transformer, but the infernal nuisance of being obliged to carry one with you at all. Most other 230V countries don't use them, they use 230V tools and RCDs / GFCIs. To see the British obsession with heavy yellow cubes, compare the results of the following three Google image searches:
110V tool transformer
110V Werkzeugtrafo
transformateur outil 110V

 

[Dcf]

I made the decision 20 year ago to buy 110v stuff.never had a problem.
here is an interesting one though.
the kitchen boys I work with have festool circular saws mostly 240v
i have the same saw in 110v.
the 240v has full wave electronics so it ups the grunt if it's getting pushed hard.
the 110v does not and will stop when carrying out the same hard going task.
We spoke to the festool rep who told us it was because of the electronics being fried in the 110v versions by the usual spider after spider getting plugged into a cooking site tranny of dubious voltage.
i don't see a problem when using your own tranny but site stuff is a mare at times

 

[Lucien Nunes]

Presumably Festool could make the 110V tool as effective and robust as the 230V, just sounds like they made a bad decision about how much to beef up the electronics for the extra current. Voltage drop on the usual rat's nest of site distribution is a problem though I agree. It's exactly the scenario where 230V really wins over 110V for usability.

 

[gnuuser]

for us most of our suppliers usually carry only the most commonly used items or order a speciality item or we have to go to industrial suppliers for anything else. (also usually end up having to pay absurd prices for the stuff too.
so we often build a lot of the equipment needed
its not so bad though its a good learning experience
securing the portable tranny on a hand truck makes it easier to move and more convenient