where are you getting your information from fella?
you see, i'm a bluff old traditionalist and tend to follow the rules that are laid down
and the rules for this are laid down in Part P of the Building Regulations 2000
and the Approved Document to Part P specifically states if a business premises and a domestic dwelling share a common meter, then they both come under the auspices of Part P.
If they are on seperate meters, then the dwelling does, the business doesnt
Its got c@$K all to do with tax returns or energy consumptions!!!!!
and if you dont know something, try looking up the answer instead of making it up as you go along, as you are clearly doing
Well Shakey, Mr bluff old traditionalist get your facts right.
1. I am working to Part P building regs approved doc April 2006 not 2000 as your are!
2. The tax comment I made was a business observation not to do with Part P or the installation, you should read my comments more carefully.
3. Your comment is incorrect that if the dwelling and business are on separate meters then the business does not fall under part P. Incorrect. The meter is purely a measuring instrument and its fixture does not affect or split the two installations.
Part P Approved Document refers to ‘common supply’ NOT ‘common meter’ as you have commented incorrectly. The key word here is common supply not common meter. If there are two meters and two mains cut-outs for dwelling and business but are fed from same ‘common’ supply, ie same service cable then the business still falls under Part P. Why? Because the main earthing connection to the service cable is ‘common’ to both installations so therefore both installations come under Part P. You will not be able to do an earth loop test on the business without disconnecting the earth on the dwelling so will interfering with the dwelling installation so both come under Part P in this case. Only if the dwelling and the business are fed from separate incoming supplies, ie separate service cables including a looped service cable providing separate earthing, will the business not come under Part P.
Mr I am Part P registered have my own electrical contracting company. Previous 27 years with Electricity Board as engineer on power, both distribution and transmission, that’s 240V/415 as it was then to 132kV switching, and commissioning substation earth mats amongst other power related work. Four years spent on metering and tariffs domestic commercial and industrial. So your comments to me
“where are you getting your information from fella? Think what you are typing and have the correct facts yourself first and not just ‘make them up’ as you have accused me of doing. My facts are from experience, Part P approved document (April 2006 page 6) not 2000 like you, BS7671 16th edition regulations, electricity supply regulations, electricity at work act, ECA. Need I go on.!! So Mr I have made nothing up but you may want to take an eye test as you are reading meter when it says supply. It makes a big difference.
Ok Mazdaman,
sorry for the way i 'went at you', bad day and all that
I have no wish to fight, so lets keep this simple, and maybe we can all beneifit from it.
Firstly I have no idea what the 2000 version of the approved document looks like, seeing as it was origianally released in 2005! Additionally, what is the relevance of BS7671, ESQR's or EAWR's (I presume that's what you meant by 'electricity at work act)?
regardless of the requirement to comply with Part P, the installations should comply with BS7671 (and by default, the EAWR's), and as you well know, there is no mention of Part P in these documents.
And the ECA? As in the Electrical Contractors Association? That's like saying 'NICEIC' said so - and you know that neither have any authority.
Ok back to the point in question, I concede that the 2006 Approved Document DOES say 'common supply' not 'common meter'
However, it does not elaborate any further.
Hopefully you will have read the posts, and I can assure you, you are (in my experience) in an extremelly small minority with your point of view (as in a minority of one)
The posts from Access Training were particularly interesting, what is your view of the points made? I cannot see any way that your 'common service cable' view point would be able to work on a practical or legislative level
Now in the abscence of any further evidence on the subject, I would refer you to the 'Electricians Guide to the Building Regulations'
This is authored and published by the IEE (now the IET) who, as you know, author and publish BS7671
I would say that gives them a 'bit of clout'
Anyway:
Page 15 para 1.3.2 Scope of Part P
"Part P applies to electrical installations in buildings or parts of buildings comprising:
(ii) dwellings and business premises that have a common
METERED SUPPLY - for example shops and public houses with a flat above with a
COMMON METER"
The following page Fig 1.3.2 there are anumber of diagrams which helpfully show that is the meter, not the 'service cable' that is the common factor
and in case there is any lingering doubt it states clearly below it
"Part P does
NOT apply to:
(i) business premises in the same building as dwellings with
SEPERATE METERING"
Ok, is there anything further to add?
Dont think so
Like I said, dont wanna fight, but if you have a better counter argument to your lone position, please, I would like to here it, we are all here to learn after all
Note to the Master, Bane
Am I 'un-bitch slapped' now