Mains box to Consumer unit SWA or tails?

[davesparks]

Plastic switch fuse, why not metal?
Or is this not recent?

its not particularly recent, But if I was to do the job today I probably wouldn't change it for metal and would record it as a departure on the EIC.

 

[Ian1981]

its not particularly recent, But if I was to do the job today I probably wouldn't change it for metal and would record it as a departure on the EIC.

Why not metal ? You could gland straight into it
Also explain how it's a departure and not a non compliance?
It's not a consumer unit but I'd put it as a similar switch gear assembly

 

[Leesparkykent]

Personally I feel the KMF is the wrong choice for the job in the above pics due to it having to be installed upside down as the load side is at the top..I would of opted for something different or done the job differently if nothing else would fit in the cab.

 

[davesparks]

Why not metal ? You could gland straight into it
Also explain how it's a departure and not a non compliance?
It's not a consumer unit but I'd put it as a similar switch gear assembly

A departure is a non compliance, if it complied then it wouldn't be a departure.

At the time there was no suitable metal option.
Now I am still not aware of a suitable metal option, bearing in mind it is in a meter box so steel is not suitable because it will rust.
The KMF is made of a Bakelite type plastic which to the best of my knowledge is not readily combustible in the way that the soft plastic used for CUs is.
It is located outside of the building and presents no greater risk than the other plastic equipment installed in there (meter, cutout, Henley block)

 

[Ian1981]

A departure is a non compliance, if it complied then it wouldn't be a departure.

At the time there was no suitable metal option.
Now I am still not aware of a suitable metal option, bearing in mind it is in a meter box so steel is not suitable because it will rust.
The KMF is made of a Bakelite type plastic which to the best of my knowledge is not readily combustible in the way that the soft plastic used for CUs is.
It is located outside of the building and presents no greater risk than the other plastic equipment installed in there (meter, cutout, Henley block)

To depart is to install or use something that is no less safe than full compliance with bs 7671 so if bs7671 calls for non combustible enclosure on a consumer unit or similar switch gear assemblies and you don't adhere to the regulations then it's a non compliance to me and not a departure

 

[davesparks]

Personally I feel the KMF is the wrong choice for the job in the above pics due to it having to be installed upside down as the load side is at the top..I would of opted for something different or done the job differently if nothing else would fit in the cab.

It only had to be installed upside down because I'd made off the cable and fitted the KMF the right way up before I realised my mistake.
Had I paid a bit more attention it would have been done differently the KMF would be the right way up.

 

[westward10]

Why not metal ? You could gland straight into it
Also explain how it's a departure and not a non compliance?
It's not a consumer unit but I'd put it as a similar switch gear assembly

If you decide to record a departure then the level of safety should not be less than obtained by compliance with the Regulations. It can be difficult to prove such things. DSs explanation in #24 does have validity that the enclosure is more likely to char than ignite but whether its level of safety is less could be debated. The only thing I would comment on if I undertook an EICR is that it is upside down

 

[davesparks]

To depart is to install or use something that is no less safe than full compliance with bs 7671 so if bs7671 calls for non combustible enclosure on a consumer unit or similar switch gear assemblies and you don't adhere to the regulations then it's a non compliance to me.

Yes well as the designer I deem this departure to be no less safe than compliance with that particular regulation.

 

[Ian1981]

Yes well as the designer I deem this departure to be no less safe than compliance with that particular regulation.

Touché

 

[davesparks]

If you decide to record a departure then the level of safety should not be less than obtained by compliance with the Regulations. It can be difficult to prove such things. DSs explanation in #24 does have validity that the enclosure is more likely to char than ignite but whether its level of safety is less could be debated. The only thing I would comment on if I undertook an EICR is that it is upside down

I'd question it being upside down too, I wasn't very happy with that when I fitted it but I'd dug myself into a hole and had to get out of it.

This has got me wondering whether GRP would be considered non-combustible

 

[davesparks]

Touché

Thinking about it further I wonder if GRP is non combustible? If so then it could be argued that it does comply.

 

[Ian1981]

Thinking about it further I wonder if GRP is non combustible? If so then it could be argued that it does comply.

It's a fair point.
I wonder if any tests have been carried out.
After all there's electrical equipment installed inside so would it have to have some flame retardant qualities?

 

[suffolkspark]

I've put metal switch fuses in meterboxes before but used the protek ones as there not too big, gland the swa into it then gland it into the metal ccu if possible, if its in a cupboard id just bring the armoured out and go surface into the bottom of the ccu, provide a pot of white paint if the customer doesn't like the look of it

 

[suffolkspark]

.

 

[westward10]

Thinking about it further I wonder if GRP is non combustible? If so then it could be argued that it does comply.

As I said in #27 it is likely to char and not propagate any flame. These materials can have differing make up some of which do have fire resistant properties.

 

[davesparks]

As I said in #27 it is likely to char and not propagate any flame. These materials can have differing make up some of which do have fire resistant properties.

I'm referring to the metre box which is made of GRP (fibreglass)

 

[Ian1981]

It maybe argued that the meter cabinet is outside the scope of bs 7671 so can't be used in the sense of a non combustible enclosure as bs 7671 sees it, then its maybe a departure which goes back round to what dave said but only slightly different reasoning.

Anyone still listening zzzzzzzzzzzz

 

[davesparks]

If I hadn't lost the picture of the one I did before the non combustible rule came in then I wouldn't have posted that one.
Plus the KMF wouldn't have been upside down.

 

[bigspark17]

I think kmf are ok in a surface mount DNO box outside the property but shouldnt be used in a recessed one as its sitting inside the cavety of the house so as electricians must use the best advice giving to us by bs7671.

 

[buzzlightyear]

sorry I think the lads have runner away with this, he only wants to know.
if he can use SWA concentric wiring. and the best way around it