Wiring 2 lighting circuits using one 6 terminal junction box

[Paul Langham]

Hi there, my name is Paul and I'm currently studying towards a city and guilds level 2 electrical installation, we are currently on lighting circuits for our practical, we have been given a task to wire up 2 lighting circuits using a 6 terminal hager junction box, I'm ok with wiring one circuit from the supply in the box but struggling to get my head around wiring 2 from the JB, please excuse my ignorance with this but the tutor is not great at explaining things, I'm just struggling with where to terminate switch and light wires for 2nd circuit, and advice or even a wiring diagram would be highly appreciated, many thanks,

Paul .

 

[Midwest]

What sort of Hager JB is it? Is it two separate circuits (one ocpd) or one circuit with two sets of switch lights? Doubt if you could achieve with the former.

 

[westward10]

Hello Paul welcome. We have a Trainee section on the forum. Go to the home page and see where you can apply for the Trainee section.

 

[Paul Langham]

What sort of Hager JB is it? Is it two separate circuits (one ocpd) or one circuit with two sets of switch lights? Doubt if you could achieve with the former.

Hi there mate, it is actually 2 seperase circuits ?

 

[davesparks]

Hi there mate, it is actually 2 seperase circuits ?

Then common sense says they should be in two separate junction boxes.
There aren't enough terminals in a 6 terminal joint box to do this, each circuit will have permanent live, switched live, neutral and earth.

 

[Paul Langham]

Hello Paul welcome. We have a Trainee section on the forum. Go to the home page and see where you can apply for the Trainee section.

Hi westward, I can't seem to find it

 

[Paul Langham]

Then common sense says they should be in two separate junction boxes.
There aren't enough terminals in a 6 terminal joint box to do this, each circuit will have permanent live, switched live, neutral and earth.

This is what I was thinking, but the tutor showed us a completed one a pupil had completed in one of the previous classes and it was a mess with wires being connected with connector blocks as well ???

 

[westward10]

Hi westward, I can't seem to find it

Apply to Gain Access to Trainee-Only Forum - https://www.electriciansforums.co.uk/forums/apply-to-gain-access-to-trainee-only-forum.60/

 

[Spoon]

Hi there mate, it is actually 2 seperase circuits ?

This is what I was thinking, but the tutor showed us a completed one a pupil had completed in one of the previous classes and it was a mess with wires being connected with connector blocks as well ???

As has already been mentioned by @davesparks. 2 circuits into 1 junction box is not a good idea. You would have to put a sticker on the junction box stating it's being fed from 2 sources and both sources need isolating before doing any maintenance.

 

[Midwest]

As has already been mentioned by @davesparks. 2 circuits into 1 junction box is not a good idea. You would have to put a sticker on the junction box stating it's being fed from 2 sources and both sources need isolating before doing any maintenance.

I mentioned it first

 

[Midwest]

Hi there mate, it is actually 2 seperase circuits ?

Are you sure you have the brief right?

 

[davesparks]

This is what I was thinking, but the tutor showed us a completed one a pupil had completed in one of the previous classes and it was a mess with wires being connected with connector blocks as well ???

Is this a training centre providing short courses by any chance?

 

[Pete999]

As has already been mentioned by @davesparks. 2 circuits into 1 junction box is not a good idea. You would have to put a sticker on the junction box stating it's being fed from 2 sources and both sources need isolating before doing any maintenance.

Agree not an ideal situation, imagine testing for dead and only isolating one circuit, I know you should check everything, that's why I said it's not an ideal situation, especially if there are two OCPDs involved.

 

[Spoon]

I mentioned it first

You just asked the question mate... @davesparks gets all the credit...

 

[Silly Sausage]

This is what I was thinking, but the tutor showed us a completed one a pupil had completed in one of the previous classes and it was a mess with wires being connected with connector blocks as well ???

I think we'd all like to see a picture of that and a copy of the actual question.

 

[Pete999]

You just asked the question mate... @davesparks gets all the credit...

Come on Lads stop acting like spoiled children,

 

[Spoon]

Come on Lads stop acting like spoiled children,

but daaaad.... he started it.....

 

[Pete999]

but daaaad.... he started it.....

Do you want to go to bed with no tea? behave will you, or I'll spank yer bottom. Wrong thing to say to Spoon, just realised.

 

[Octopus]

Could this not be 2 separate lights from 1 circuit using 1 junction box?

 

[Andy78]

This is what I was thinking, but the tutor showed us a completed one a pupil had completed in one of the previous classes and it was a mess with wires being connected with connector blocks as well ???

Connector blocks in a JB ? Are you on a plumbing course by any chance ?

 

[westward10]

Think he has been scared off.

 

[telectrix]

Think he has been scared off.

well.he should not be . we don't bite, except on Fridays. .

 

[Paul Langham]

well.he should not be . we don't bite, except on Fridays. .

Hi there guys, not been scared off just yet lol no im studying towards city and guilds 2365 level 2, no its nothing to do with plumbing, what i will do is actually take a photo of the work, and also the page out of my practical tasks booklet city and guilds specify you have to do and then you can see if you can get your heads round it....im gonna ask the tutor on Thursday to explain what exactly is going on, because he does not make things clear at all and im getting pretty fed up with him because he is not teaching properly at all.

 

[Paul Langham]

Could this not be 2 separate lights from 1 circuit using 1 junction box?

hi mate, it is two seperate lights from 1 circuit but both lights need a seperate switch ?

 

[Octopus]

hi mate, it is two seperate lights from 1 circuit but both lights need a seperate switch ?

That's what I said

 

[Silly Sausage]

hi mate, it is two seperate lights from 1 circuit but both lights need a seperate switch ?

You only need a 3-way terminal block for that, as long as it's big enough.

You've got to get a picture of the attempt you've already seen, please!

 

[Andy78]

Wonder why they are teaching to wire with a junction box method ?

 

[Paul Langham]

That's what I said[/QUO

You only need a 3-way terminal block for that, as long as it's big enough.

You've got to get a picture of the attempt you've already seen, please!

Thanks Archy for your help, so what cables would you actually terminate into the 3 way terminal block ?

 

[westward10]

Need at least five terminals, neutral, line loop, earth and two switch returns.

 

[Paul Langham]

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Hi mate, i have done this, many thanks for your help

 

[Paul Langham]

Need at least five terminals, neutral, line loop, earth and two switch returns.

One switch return is in JB, but there is only room for one in the JB im led to believe ???

 

[Octopus]

Thanks Archy for your help, so what cables would you actually terminate into the 3 way terminal block ?

You need a 6 way junction box...

 

[Paul Langham]

I think we'd all like to see a picture of that and a copy of the actual question.

Ok no worries i will get it on here for you guys, many thanks for your help

 

[westward10]

Hi mate, i have done this, many thanks for your help

Top job Paul.

 

[Paul Langham]

I think we'd all like to see a picture of that and a copy of the actual question.

Ok no worries i will get it on here for you guys, many thanks for your help

You need a 6 way junction box...

Yes it is a 6 way JB, so can you have 2 switch lives going into the JB, because i dont see there being any room ?

 

[Paul Langham]

You need a 6 way junction box...

It is a 6 way JB murdoch

 

[davesparks]

hi mate, it is two seperate lights from 1 circuit but both lights need a seperate switch ?

That makes a lot more sense, this is perfectly possible and acceptable from one 6 terminal JB.

 

[Paul Langham]

That makes a lot more sense, this is perfectly possible and acceptable from one 6 terminal JB.

ok thanks, but would you be able to terminate 2 switch lives into the JB, would there be room ?

 

[westward10]

When you say room do you mean space or enough terminals. You need the loop line, neutral, cpc and two switch return terminals, five required.

 

[Paul Langham]

When you say room do you mean space or enough terminals. You need the loop line, neutral, cpc and two switch return terminals, five required.

Yes there is two switch return terminals in the JB, but can these be used for two different switches ?