Fly leads...or not?

[sythai]

Just wondering, could someone please advise me to what the regulation is regarding the requirments of fly leads.... when installing metal knock out boxes, set in block work using T+E plastic capped system?


Many Thanks,

Sy

 

[rocker]

You don't have to use them if theres at least one lug holding on the backbox, but you really should.

 

[sythai]

Do that mean if there's one fixed lug it's ok?

Do normally use them, but only on light switches...

Thank U, Sy

 

[Guest123]

Agreed, not required if one fixed lug. Good practice though.

 

[rocker]

Yea with one fixed lug it's OK not to use them, but you still should. Especially if this is connected to your other post i.e. assessment

 

[Phil]

i always fit them

 

[nickblake]

yep always get into the habit i feel they should realy to protect us guys once the sockets removed its not earthed and in my eyes it should be

 

[m4tty]

No reg just good practice

 

[kevben]

Agreed - No Reg insisting on it but always have done it and still do.
Only takes a few seconds and whenever i come across installations were they have not been installed , you usually find No Grommets , No Colour Identification .

Then you look further and ..............

 

[Risteard]

I wouldn't say that it's good practice (I'm not for a second suggesting that it's bad practice) - simply that it's unnecessary. Personally my preference is to connect cpc to backbox but there is absolutely no necessity to do so so long as at least one lug is fixed.

If it's unnecessary then I can't see how it can be "good practice".

 

[A-Non-eMouse]

when people say theres 'no reg but its good practice' where does the 'you dont have to use fly lead if the box has one non adjustable lug' statement come from, i do understand it offers a mechanical join between back box and front plate, but where has this reg sounding statement come from. also what benefit does earthing the box have apart from slightly more protection for mr diy taking the socket down live to get wallpaper behind it. when after all we forever have been barked 'working live should be avoided at all costs' from the EAWR.

dont get me wrong i do earth boxes but more out of habit then anything else. also i'm not flaming anyone just interesed in this ongoing argument.

 

[Risteard]

when people say theres 'no reg but its good practice' where does the 'you dont have to use fly lead if the box has one non adjustable lug' statement come from

It's stated in IEE Guidance Note 1.

 

[ringer]

Have not come across flying leads before in this situation (still learning). And not quite sure what you mean by 'one fixed lug'. Would someone please post a pic to demonstrate what you are talking about?

 

[Browny]

Sorry I've not got a picture but on a back box there are two lugs that the socket front (or what ever) screws into. One of these lugs is often can move up and down slightly (to allow it to be horizontal) and the other one does not move. The lug that can move does not provide a good connection, where as the fixed one does. Hope that helps

 

[Lucas]

I always earth backboxes so if someone is say painting and takes the socket plate off to paint there is still a connectionto the backbox

 

[Spudnik]

Just to add fuel to the fire, accessories should not be removed while they are still live.

This (IMHO) negates the need for flyleads.

 

[A-Non-eMouse]

It's stated in IEE Guidance Note 1.

does that mean its in bs7671 then? arent the guidance notes books just that, guidance on interpreting the regs book. ie whatever is in the gn books is referring to specific regs all but written in plainer english.

im not having a go ristead i'd just love to know where this statement comes from as i've used it myself in the past be it a screw missing in a back box or whatever. just nice to have a bit of a back up in black and white. what regs it relating to and what does it say exactly. give us a quote if you can find it '' i've got gn3 not gn1 unfortunately.

cheers

 

[Jason Smith]

I always fix fly leads- its a better job. however, on a recent rewire, i find the metal back boxes are have no connection point to them, .e. the little bras connectors in the corner. On the phone to the niceic help line, and as long as the boxes have a metal screw to the metal back box, then they dont ned to be installed, because the metal screw from the fce plate makes the connection from the cable earthing, to the metal back box. So this saved me 30 odd cutting out and re instaling back boxes (or self tapping screws and crimping etc.) however, thisncouldresult in the screw on the face plate becoming live, in the event of a fault on a susceptible system. quality prevails, and all thse back boxes now have fly leads. Quality work, sleep at night, reputation.three days late for next job.

 

[ringer]

if you wouldn't mind guys - a photo showing how these fly leads are applied would be appreciated

 

[rocker]

... can't do you a photo but basicaly they are the earth wire that connects to the little brass connection block in a steel knock-out box to the earth terminal on the accessory

 

[pennywise]

it's only a bit of 1.5mm green and yellow singles attached to the the earth tag on the box then to the face plate terminal or a bit of T+E bare cpc sleeved.

 

[Risteard]

does that mean its in bs7671 then?

No.

But the IEE's opinion is certainly worthwhile. Only the Regulations are in the Regulations. Guidance Notes don't form part of them.

just nice to have a bit of a back up in black and white. what regs it relating to and what does it say exactly. give us a quote if you can find it '' i've got gn3 not gn1 unfortunately.

Will write it up later for you but it's not specifically in any Regulation other than that they should be earthed, but of course they already are reliably earthed with fixed lug.

 

[petesparks1]

it's only a bit of 1.5mm green and yellow singles attached to the the earth tag on the box then to the face plate terminal or a bit of T+E bare cpc sleeved.

Does it have to be 1.5mm?
Lots of jobs that I have second fixed the main contractor has given me a 50m drum of 0.75mm for the fly lead on ring mains , presumably for cost etc

 

[rodney12]

Can't see anything wrong with using 0.75mm for the fly lead, end of the day it's not a requirement to add a fly lead at all really.

 

[spenny]

same as everyone else , good practice , not regulation