Need someone to test and sign off work

[steven9586]

Hi, I am qualified to BS 7671 domestic installer but have not done much for a good few years. I am going to rewire a renovation property and need an electrician that can check, test and sign off my work. Would anyone be willing to do this obviously for payment and keep me right or should I just pay the local building control inspector to do it.

Property is in the Rowlands Gill area of Newcastle

Regards

Steven

 

[telectrix]

check first with LABC. if the project is subject to BC anyway, you'll find that they may accept you certifying the work and giving them a copy. alternatively, pay the LABC fee and let them do the paperwork.

 

[steven9586]

Hi, yes that's an option but because I'm not part P they want £510. was hoping a local sparky would be willing to do it for less than that. Happy for them to check the progress of the install and do it to there spec if that's what they want.

 

[telectrix]

major question is...... is the project subject to building control as a whole?

 

[Octopus]

I'm sure somebody will do it for £499

But seriously I wouldn't sign off anyones work.

 

[richy3333]

I'll do it for £509.99

 

[dan86]

I wouldn't be signing off anyone else's work either. even if they were a good mate

 

[ian.settle1]

Hi, I am qualified to BS 7671 domestic installer

Wht's one of them when there at home?

 

[SPARTYKUS]

I'm sure somebody will do it for £499

But seriously I wouldn't sign off anyones work.

I salute you sir.

 

[ferg]

Purely out of boredom I gave this idea some thought.
First you would have to design the install and put it in writing.
Then you would have to be present to witness some / all of first fix to make sure it met the design.
Inspect first fix.
Inspect second fix before faceplates screwed back on, with some testing.

Etc, etc, etc.

Might as well just do the job in the first place.

For the record I've never signed off anyone else's work and never will.

 

[Guest55]

"i'll never sign off someone elses work .........."

and yet the goverment and local authorities have already implimented a system to allow 3rd party testing ?
your schemes may be dragging their heels in adapting to all this but the legislation is already in place .............

completing a B.C. notification for someone elses work doesnt make you responsible for the installation in its entirety , thats why 3 signiture certs exist.
you all seem uptight about a good earnings oppourtunity if you ask me

 

[ferg]

"i'll never sign off someone elses work .........."

and yet the goverment and local authorities have already implimented a system to allow 3rd party testing ?
your schemes may be dragging their heels in adapting to all this but the legislation is already in place .............

completing a B.C. notification for someone elses work doesnt make you responsible for the installation in its entirety , thats why 3 signiture certs exist.
you all seem uptight about a good earnings oppourtunity if you ask me

Hence my point above.

You can sign the designed by and tested and inspected by sections,

But in order to have done the initial testing and inspection you either need to see the entire first fix after it's done and visible or have witnessed it if it isn't.

So in my tiny little tired brain the 3 signature form and 3rd party sign off will only work in the same way that the EICR/PIR works.

It's either done properly or you can stick your signature on it as you are driving past on the way to your next job.

 

[Richard Burns]

Third party sign off is building control approving an EICR for an initial installation, that is what it says in the AD.
Like it or lump it.

 

[brucelee]

Yep if a 3rd PArty certifier they can only give you a EICR and one to building control not that I have seen any of these 3rd party certifiers and dont think its come into force because of issues around liability for warranty purposes etc etc
which is basically what any legit spark would give you
ITS ALL A LOAD OF PART P TOSH

You could get LABC to send someone to I&T it for you and pay there scam fee

or if you are competent but not registered do the work carry out I&T as you should if competent with calibrated instrument
then issue a EIC with attached schedules, one copy for you, one for customer & one for LABC then they will decide along with your quals whether any further action needed i.e sending a 3rd party to I&T again and what scam fees need to be paid

Or become a member of appropriate scam i.e ELECSA , NIC and pay there scam fee or one of the others get 2 million PLI insurance and calibrated test equipment , relevent electrical literature i.e BS 7671 amongst others take your assessment hopefully pass and notify yourself for another fee lol

all this is in APPROVED PART P DOC 2013 on Government portal Google it and all will become clear

as for signing someone elses work its a NO NO

Or ask a registered competent spark to do the work

 

[odawire]

"i'll never sign off someone elses work .........."

and yet the goverment and local authorities have already implimented a system to allow 3rd party testing ?
your schemes may be dragging their heels in adapting to all this but the legislation is already in place .............

completing a B.C. notification for someone elses work doesnt make you responsible for the installation in its entirety , thats why 3 signiture certs exist.
you all seem uptight about a good earnings oppourtunity if you ask me

Is there any idea when this will become accepted by the schemes? I get calls all the time people asking me to do this.

 

[SPARTYKUS]

You can do things anyway that arent accepted by the schemes. Im in a scheme but I don't pay extra to do EICRS.

In fact you don't need to be in a scheme! Its all cobblers.

 

[Welchyboy1]

I have had this case with 3 different councils in the last 4 months, the person who installed the electrics wasnt registered and couldnt produce a cert for the extension/ loft conversion

i was asked to sign the jobs off and i said i could only give them an eicr and that they would have to check that their LBA would accept this

they all did no problem as long as you were registered by nic ac or napit

basildon, havering and maldon councils all in essex

None of them could really care less as long as they got some form of paperwork to tick the box

 

[SPARTYKUS]

Welchboy1, summed the whole thing up.

 

[longboat]

It always bug's me when people say they WONT sign off other's work. What is an EICR?

 

[brucelee]

An Electrical Installation Condition Report

which gives a approved competent persons judgement on the safety of an electrical system through Inspecting and testing with relevent experience, skill and formal training it will have any relevent codes as appropriate for improvement or dangerous conditions that may or may not exist coded 1, 2 or 3

formerly a Periodic Inspection report which had 4 codes

 

[brucelee]

You can do things anyway that arent accepted by the schemes. Im in a scheme but I don't pay extra to do EICRS.

In fact you don't need to be in a scheme! Its all cobblers.

I am thinking the same mate had my renewal letter today of elecsa for £370 + vat meter calibration and the usual annual PLI insurance all at the same time thinking seriously of not bothering as no one else seems to care anyway and just want a job cheap as poss as well as havng no idea of part P tosh that it is

 

[Octopus]

I am thinking the same mate had my renewal letter today of elecsa for £370 + vat meter calibration and the usual annual PLI insurance all at the same time thinking seriously of not bothering as no one else seems to care anyway and just want a job cheap as poss as well as havng no idea of part P tosh that it is

Join Stroma?

 

[longboat]

An Electrical Installation Condition Report

which gives a approved competent persons judgement on the safety of an electrical system through Inspecting and testing with relevent experience, skill and formal training it will have any relevent codes as appropriate for improvement or dangerous conditions that may or may not exist coded 1, 2 or 3

formerly a Periodic Inspection report which had 4 codes

Thanks bruce. Thats a very concise definition, dont agree with the "approved competent person" bit though. That will include all the Electrical Trainee out there.
My point being that every time you do an EICR,then sign your name on the form you are taking responsibility for the installation, bar the notes or codes.
So given the opportunity to inspect and test an installation at both first and second fix, what is the problem in signing an EICR to confirm its function and safety?

 

[SPARTYKUS]

You're only signing you name to it at that point, or moment, in time, in the form of an opinion.

A moment later it is irrelevant(taking it to an extreme I admit).


thats of course why it is fundamentally different to the other form. Which says you DID the work forever!

 

[Des 56]

Quote

an opinion.

then there is

Which says you DID the work

That's about the sum of it all
Do you want to take the responsibility,"Well do you Punk" said Clint in his best electricians brogue

You have to decide whether the councils "couldn't give a damn" attitude and indifference to Part P can be duplicated by yourself

 

[longboat]

I know what your saying, but thats an EIC, which i would never sign to being the designer and installer if i was'nt.
All the mid-big companies work in that way with each individual's signature for his/her part of the process.
Its not an indifference or cavalier attitude to part p that grounds my point, but a requirement to satisfy its need's.

 

[Des 56]

It's very true that an enterprise,being a multi person organisation, does exactly what is requested by the op,it signs for individual sections and it has always been accepted practice by the Niceic to do so

For large works,I have no problem with this necessity, but for domestic work I do
Larger projects will tend to have a competent person involved and/or signing for each section

Domestic work that is being signed for the testing section, may have been constructed by a fool, designed by an idiot but tested by a competent person who may see no evidence of that stupidity

As it stands he has to assume the responsibility for the idiot
When procedures are ironed out by the scams and the government,he may be able to do exactly whats suggested lawfully.ie for the same idiot but this time without the responsibility that now exists were he to do so

 

[longboat]

Why do i keep being logged out every 3 or 4 mins? Just after writing an epic comeback? I dare not write more than a few lines or all is lost. I have't passed a secraterial test.

I think we will have to agree and dissagree on this one:devilish:

 

[Des 56]

Why do i keep being logged out every 3 or 4 mins? Just after writing an epic comeback? I dare not write more than a few lines or all is lost. I have't passed a secraterial test.

I think we will have to agree and dissagree on this one:devilish:

I know your pain,its that oops disease that wrecks this forum,the forum faults kept me away once,although its not as bad as it once was, its on its last chance with me at least,its annoying

 

[brucelee]

The dreaded lost post syndrome has just happened to me

I asked Elecsa and JIb about this 3rd party certifier
And it seemed to me that none of them had a clue and are only interested in your dosh

Elecsa say as part of your membership agreement you are only legally alllowed to sign for work that is carried out by your company then notify that work

You can carry out EICRs and this does not need notification

But signing a EICR for newly carried out work seems will fall under this new Part P tosh 3 party jargon
they said that it wasnt yet being implemented due to the issues around warranty and who provides this and then who is liable when it all goes pear shaped

The JIB didnt have a clue even had ELECSA contacting them and JIB contacting ELECSA
when you apply for your Gold card you get seperate card for Qualified supervisor status For DI which I thought would be on the Gold card and comercial and Industrial is seperate Qs status again ??

its jsut so they can get you to pay a extra annual fee of £8.50 for a stupid useless white card on top of your 3 yearly application for Gold card
to get a QS status of JIB elecsa registered QS needs a certificate of competence in last 3 months But NIC and Napit can have one thats dated in the last 12 months double standards and still did not give me a genuine reason as to why this was jsut this was the agreement made between Elecsa and JIb saying they would carry out 3 monthly checks even though as we all know its 12 months at least

and to top all that of brining new quals for new proposed QS one for domestic and a diploma NVQ for commercial /Industrial QS more money more tosh all they want is your cash for very little in return