Additional Outside light

[davie a]

Hi All,
Looking to install an additional outside light. Currently I have one standard outside light and a double gang switch in kitchen one switch for internal and one for external light.
But would like to add the light below with PIR and was wondering best way to do it.

Pro Twin Spotlight G9 60W Graphite PIR Floodlight - NoLinkingToThis, Where the Trade Buys

Any helps apperciated.

 

[ezzzekiel]

That will depend how the original s are wired , you will require a neutral which could be at switch or coming from other source (lights, fcu etc)

locate your neutral first then go from there

 

[davie a]

Taken a couple of snaps of switch in kitchen which i beleive shows neutral. Would i need t 3 gang switch if i was to install an additional light ? Hope pics help?

 

[davie a]

Heres the Pics

 

[Deleted member 19807]

Taken a couple of snaps of switch in kitchen which i beleive shows neutral. Would i need t 3 gang switch if i was to install an additional light ? Hope pics help?

That will depend, do you want your pir to control both outside lights? or to have the current lights switched as they are now and only the new one controlled by the pir, as an aside it would be good to add some markers to the switch wires while you have it apart.

 

[davie a]

Id be happy to just leave current lights and switch as is and have the PIR light in Back garden controlled by the PIR. Seems to be best idea as ill only require it to go on when im out there, I dont intend just having it on like a front door light.

Is that doable?

 

[Deleted member 19807]

yes thats doable, you just need to provide a perm live, neutral and earth to the pir from a lighting circuit, i would feed the pir via a 2 pole switch so if you needed to work on it you can isolate it without turning the whole circuit off and also by using a 2 pole switch if the light gets water in and starts tripping the rcd its easy to disconnect both line and neutral.

 

[davie a]

Ok Cheers Hifly, so would this work from one of the lighting circut cables that are heading to a switch in the loft could I put in a junction box and run a 3 core cable to a 2 pole switch which for ease id like to install in the loft since i dont intend having to use the switch unless its to carryout maintenence then continue the cable to the PIR light.

Is that what you mean?

 

[malcolmsanford]

Not the greatest of designs as the whole idea of a switch is to be accessible and a switch for an outside light in a loft is not exactly that but if that is the way you want to do it then that is call.

 

[Deleted member 19807]

normally you can't use a cable going to a switch as there is no neutral, you need to come off a cable between light fittings, you will need 2 core and earth cable, personaly i would install the switch near the pir so its clear how to isolate the light.

 

[davie a]

Ok think ive got it,

1. so is it ok to put in a 3 terminal junction box in loft on any of the twin and earth lighting circit cables up there as long as theres live, neutral and earth?
2. run twin and earth from junction box to a 1G 2W (or is it 1G 1W) switch located in loft or nearer PIR ie downstairs cupboard ?
3. finally continue twin and earth from switch to PIR light fitting?

Therefore the light will be live always and controlled by PIR duing darkness hours and in summer when its not required i could switch it off using the switch thats installed?

Please if anyone could verify this then im happy

Thanks

 

[ezzzekiel]

yep that will work ,

or - had a quick glance at pics and it looks as though neutrals are at switch (check first) swap to a 3 gang switch and loop live from common and return the neut choc block then all your switching are together.

 

[davie a]

Sounds good Ezzzekiel but may be a bit out of my comfort zone, Just looking for the easiest, most simple option really.

 

[ezzzekiel]

coming from your current switch would prob be easier, swap switch for a 3 gang putting wires back as they are, loop a bit of cable from the top of one switch (which will be a permanent live into the com of the spare switch on your 3 gang put live from cable going to pir into bottom of switch (l1) and put the neut into the choc block with the other two.

 

[robswainelect]

Perhaps you should get an electrician to do it for you?
You really should not be doing electrical work unless you are qualified to do so!
Electricity is dangerous!

 

[davie a]

Ah I see Ezzzekeil this is what I will do and am only typing it out to make sure Ive got your plan correct.

Change current switch for a 3 gang and put wires back as they are.
loop a piece of red cable from top of one of the two current switches and place end into the com of the spare switch on your 3rd gang.
Put live from cable going to pir light into bottom of 3rd gang switch.
Put neutral wire from pir into block with other 2 black wires and attach the earth from the pir to tha box with the other earths.

Correct???

 

[davie a]

Hi all, Quick question ive had great advice on installing Pir light but Im wondering if i wire as above wheither ill have the option of switching the light on like a normal light or will it only operate via pir( when it detects movement)?

Thanks

 

[Deleted member 19807]

Hi all, Quick question ive had great advice on installing Pir light but Im wondering if i wire as above wheither ill have the option of switching the light on like a normal light or will it only operate via pir( when it detects movement)?

Thanks

That will depend on the light you buy, read the instructions and that will tell you. If you wire the light from the switch the job becomes notifiable to building control as it will be covered by part p.

 

[davie a]

ok thanks, is 1.5mm twin and earth suitable for this ?

 

[Deleted member 19807]

ok thanks, is 1.5mm twin and earth suitable for this ?

assuming a 6A mcb or 5A fuse 1.5 should be ok, will depend on your Zs reading

 

[davie a]

Update:
Put light up outside and ran 1.5mm t&e from it to directly to the switch.
Changed switch from 2way 2gang to a 2way 3gang and wired the first 2 switches exactally as the previous switch was wired as advised.
Ive put the earth from the outside light onto the box with the other earths and put the neutral in a block with the other neutrals.
Finally I put a piece of wire from L1 of the second switch then to the com of the 3rd(outsidelight) switch and its not working unless the 2nd switch is on so i moved the wire to the L2 of the 2nd switch and now the 2nd switch has to be off for the light to work so am wondering should i have put the wire from com of 2nd switch to com of 3rd?
Obviously has something to do with the fact its a 2 way switch.

Any advice would be great before the mrs gets in

 

[malcolmsanford]

Got it in one link com to com

 

[Des 56]

Just read your last post only
From what you have said,you are trying to get a permanent feed from the 2-way,with the 2-way cofiguration used,you wont do that,the live there is being switched between legs of the strappers
You need a permanent live,which should be found on switch 1 (you have a 50/50 chance of the choice being switched or permanent unless you test it first
Fit the loop from the feed wire at switch 1 to the common terminal of switch 3

 

[davie a]

Ive uploaded a pic thats shows the new 3gang switch only thing missing is the loop and everything else is taken from old switch i posted earlier, should make my explination clearer i hope.

 

[davie a]

As malcom suggested i put the loop into the middle com that has 2 red wires going into it since its one way and put the other end into the new 3rd switch com and everything works. My final question is....Is doing it like this ok?

 

[GStueyXR]

Dont wish to be rude to anyone, but not only have you endangered a life by advising people on how to wire lights in an area of massive earth potential... not only have you left yourself open to prosecution for advising an unqualified person......

But you have also done his local spark out of some work!

 

[davie a]

Take it its a no go this method then,
I have done electrics before but nothing more than this type of thing and only after taking advice from experts. If I have any work thats too much i get a spark in, ive changed switches before so didnt think it would be too difficut but when it threw up something i wasnt sure about I asked for advice.

If its dangerus id appreciate a heads up?

 

[ezzzekiel]

yes its fine the way its wired,

As for the advice as mentioned by gstuey - this forum would be a pretty lonely place if no questions were to be asked and the same things could be said about every post on the internet.

 

[davie a]

Much appreciated guys! If your happy im happy and the light works so thats a bonus.

Thanks again.

 

[ezzzekiel]

If its dangerus id appreciate a heads up?

no electrical work is dangerous the danger is behind the person holding the screwdriver, that is why it is always better to call in (in an ideal world) a professional, however i dont think for one minute that anyone with some sense cant manage to add a light fitting and you obviously coped well and would of done it one way or another with or without any advise given on this forum.