T
taz67
Hey, anyone got their HV ticket? or work in the high voltage industry? thinking about steering that way in the industry and could do with some advice cheers
K
Knobhead
Can you afford the training? Will your company pay? Do you need a HV ticket?
Why do you want to go down this road, it’s not fun, it’s downright bloody dangerous!
What experience do you have? 15 years in heavy industry before my company sent me on the HV system management course. Then it’s 3 years and you have to go on the watered down version as a refresher.
Yes I hold a HV ticket and cable jointing to 33KV. A 5-minute job takes 4 hours by the time you’ve done the paperwork and made safe.
Why do you want to go down this road, it’s not fun, it’s downright bloody dangerous!
What experience do you have? 15 years in heavy industry before my company sent me on the HV system management course. Then it’s 3 years and you have to go on the watered down version as a refresher.
Yes I hold a HV ticket and cable jointing to 33KV. A 5-minute job takes 4 hours by the time you’ve done the paperwork and made safe.
T
taz67
yeh i was going to pay for it myself , theres a job opportunity maybe coming up at a company and pretty much if i get my HV ticket i can have the job, how dangerous exactly? ive got a lot of experience commercial/light industrial,but nothing the heavy industry such as HV...am i daft for doing it at 25?
D
DurhamSparky
how dangerous is HV.....!! if you are asking that question you probably are making the wrong career move..!
T
taz67
i know its dangerous, i meant do u actually come within close proximity of energized live conductors.?? i dont have a clue at all never been near 15kv in my llife :/
K
Knobhead
The worse job I can think of is live testing.
You have to open the shutters to expose the live conductors. Then you have the fun of inserting the two foot long probes in to the spout to touch the live conductors. Checking the phasing between two substations is even more fun, you have six live open spouts to sort out.
Think about this, I’ve phased out two feeders, each had 20MVA 33/11KV transformers on each side of the breaker. Get it wrong and there’s no need for a cremation, the undertaker will just sweep you in to a cardboard box!
You don’t get a second chance!
Think about what you’re hoping to do and your experience. Light industrial isn’t anywhere near enough. As I said it took 15 years before I was considered ready. But that was for the HV system management course.
You have to open the shutters to expose the live conductors. Then you have the fun of inserting the two foot long probes in to the spout to touch the live conductors. Checking the phasing between two substations is even more fun, you have six live open spouts to sort out.
Think about this, I’ve phased out two feeders, each had 20MVA 33/11KV transformers on each side of the breaker. Get it wrong and there’s no need for a cremation, the undertaker will just sweep you in to a cardboard box!
You don’t get a second chance!
Think about what you’re hoping to do and your experience. Light industrial isn’t anywhere near enough. As I said it took 15 years before I was considered ready. But that was for the HV system management course.
M
mheyes
It takes a special bread of spark to work on HV. I am not HV authorized and I agree with tony’s point you must have years of experience within heavy industry and you must respect it at all times, One wrong move and it will be the last blue flash you will ever see.
Take a look on YouTube for HV switching.
Take a look on YouTube for HV switching.
Dangerous enough for you not to go anywhere near it if you ask a question like that :banghead::banghead:
E
Engineer54
Live testing of MV/HV equipment is normally kept to a minimum. Most testing of these systems are ''dead tests'', on rare occasions as Tony stated you may need to conduct phasing or to confirm live test with probe sticks. Most of the testing to energised systems, come in the form of proving an area which is to be worked on has been de-energised by isolation and the cable cores earthed!! Testing can be just as perilous even on some of the dead testing, such as the Hi Pot tests, which are often conducted at more than twice the nominal voltage...lol!!
Is it dangerous, of course it is, if you don't know what your doing or get careless!! MV/HV systems always command a great deal of respect... One thing you always remember, you don't need to touch these voltages levels, they come out to grab you when you get too close, the higher the voltage the greater the distance it can jump to grab you ...lol!!
Like Tony, I had a lot of intensive training and experience on these distribution systems, from my apprentice days right the way through to the present day. My ''Authorised Person'' training was with both as was then Eastern Electricity Board and the London Electricity Board but i was much younger than Tony at the time. Unlike Tony, i didn't attend jointing training, but have on more than the odd occasion helped certified jointer's, on dead direct buried joints...
Can't tell you how much any of this training costs these days as i have never paid, it's always been company provided. As far as i know, (but it may have changed) You don't need the ''Authorised Person'' status to work on MV/HV, you can also get ''Certified Person'' status, who works under the supervision and control of an Authorised Person...
Is it dangerous, of course it is, if you don't know what your doing or get careless!! MV/HV systems always command a great deal of respect... One thing you always remember, you don't need to touch these voltages levels, they come out to grab you when you get too close, the higher the voltage the greater the distance it can jump to grab you ...lol!!
Like Tony, I had a lot of intensive training and experience on these distribution systems, from my apprentice days right the way through to the present day. My ''Authorised Person'' training was with both as was then Eastern Electricity Board and the London Electricity Board but i was much younger than Tony at the time. Unlike Tony, i didn't attend jointing training, but have on more than the odd occasion helped certified jointer's, on dead direct buried joints...
Can't tell you how much any of this training costs these days as i have never paid, it's always been company provided. As far as i know, (but it may have changed) You don't need the ''Authorised Person'' status to work on MV/HV, you can also get ''Certified Person'' status, who works under the supervision and control of an Authorised Person...
K
Knobhead
Taz, you're looking at £1500 for a 5 day course
D
DurhamSparky
my employer has shelled out nearly 7k on my training for HV..! and that is still at a basic level...!!
Its not all that bad, you get to wear super sexy suits when you pay with the big stuff ! Just prior to first synch with a 13.8 kV, 40 MVA generator.
Theory is that if anything goes wrong, the flash suit will save your life. Note that even for racking in LV breakers you should be wearing a flash suit, visor and goves as a safety precaution, not than many do.
Theory is that if anything goes wrong, the flash suit will save your life. Note that even for racking in LV breakers you should be wearing a flash suit, visor and goves as a safety precaution, not than many do.
D
DurhamSparky
i got a pair of them gloves..!!! not got a sexy suit though... company drew a line under budget!!
View attachment 11409
View attachment 11409
K
Knobhead
HeHe, first time I did phasing out I was wearing a tee-shirt and shorts. That was a very long time ago.
Mad, but if you had seen some of the gear we were worked on, you had to be mad! 11KV tee switches that had been in service 60 years, the OCB,s were only 15 years younger. DMO (dependant manual operation) is taboo now but normal when installed.
View attachment 11412
No it’s not me operating the OCB. It’s a Ferguson Paillin unit, 3.3KV in this case. We used them on 11KV.
D
DurhamSparky
i feel dead lucky to work on a site with 2009 ABB Switch gear installed through out!!
A
alarm man
D
DurhamSparky
lol..... hey probably same stuff man!! just £50 more expensive
A
alarm man
i hope not,she fails at the dishes never mind hv...now theres a thought..:love:
A
Andy 7671
Type in "2.00 arc flash interior substation racking breaker" on you tube.
Removed one from a PCC once, and by removed I mean unbolted from decommissioned panel and put on pallet.
We then put in new panel, connected busbars under German supervision. we wore latex gloves cleaned the bars with proprietry cleaner, he then has us brush twice, in an opposing diagonal with brass brush before assembly.
We then bolted in a new rack. It was dead, the whole area was dead, I was trying to understand the drawings on the wall, like why would you have a switch or capacitor on the earth.. the jokers would ratchet it up and press the button, just for the craic,
The endless waiting for permits to be signed ensures a pretty safe system of work, didnt want to be alarmist. if you watched video, dont have enough experience to say anymore.
Thats it really, in hindsight it is probably the job Im most proud of
Removed one from a PCC once, and by removed I mean unbolted from decommissioned panel and put on pallet.
We then put in new panel, connected busbars under German supervision. we wore latex gloves cleaned the bars with proprietry cleaner, he then has us brush twice, in an opposing diagonal with brass brush before assembly.
We then bolted in a new rack. It was dead, the whole area was dead, I was trying to understand the drawings on the wall, like why would you have a switch or capacitor on the earth.. the jokers would ratchet it up and press the button, just for the craic,
The endless waiting for permits to be signed ensures a pretty safe system of work, didnt want to be alarmist. if you watched video, dont have enough experience to say anymore.
Thats it really, in hindsight it is probably the job Im most proud of
K
Knobhead
Not all of it was ancient, the system grew since the 1930’s onward. From it’s early days we had our own power station, as time went on the system was finally connected to the national grid (this is when it was found out the internal system ran reversed to the grid). At this point the power station was shut down for good. But the 11KV incomers were reversed.
As plants expanded or new plants installed switchgear that was current at the time was added. Ferguson Paillin gear (in last photo) had VCB’s cobbled on to the board. I got lumbered with that job on one plant.
To go around the works was like a time warp!
DMO switchgear is a nightmare, it fights back when you try to switch it on load. The load tries to force the contacts apart as your closing them. Magnetic forces and the oil vaporising are trying to stop you closing the switch, fail and the oil tank can explode!
OK I’m mad, but I wouldn’t swap a moment of it, but there again I got away with it!
As plants expanded or new plants installed switchgear that was current at the time was added. Ferguson Paillin gear (in last photo) had VCB’s cobbled on to the board. I got lumbered with that job on one plant.
To go around the works was like a time warp!
DMO switchgear is a nightmare, it fights back when you try to switch it on load. The load tries to force the contacts apart as your closing them. Magnetic forces and the oil vaporising are trying to stop you closing the switch, fail and the oil tank can explode!
OK I’m mad, but I wouldn’t swap a moment of it, but there again I got away with it!
D
DurhamSparky
****ing hell...!!
i will stick to 21st century equpitment!! i remember when i was at the mod there was a huge fan in a room that was abandoned!!
had paper work from 1943 in the room and old news papers etc.... al the signage was nicely hand painted and look really eeery!!
when you mentiooned the time warp it came back to me.. there was me playing with 1990's chillers and starters and behnid the wall next to me was pre war ventilation equiptment
i will stick to 21st century equpitment!! i remember when i was at the mod there was a huge fan in a room that was abandoned!!
had paper work from 1943 in the room and old news papers etc.... al the signage was nicely hand painted and look really eeery!!
when you mentiooned the time warp it came back to me.. there was me playing with 1990's chillers and starters and behnid the wall next to me was pre war ventilation equiptment
E
Engineer54
One of the most badly designed and installed MV main switchboard was an ABB board!! Take the full height back panel off one of the cubicles (with no handles to hold) and there staring at you was the bare bus-bars just above head height!! never seen anything like it before, ...Bus-bars in MV switchboards are normally run in there own chamber that are completely separated access wise, from the rest of the panels having there own cover plates etc...
I much prefer the Merlin Gerin (Schneider) MV switchboards myself where the bus-bars are safely tucked down low and always insulated with easy access to the bolted sections (after removing cover plate) from the cable gully...
D
DurhamSparky
yeah the back panels on our have no handles!! we improvised with a suction lifter!!
K
Knobhead
The original 1930’s gear was eventually embargoed “no live switching” so a fault would be a major upheaval. The 11KV Ferguson Paillin gear had new trucks fitted, the 3.3KV remained DMO.
The plant I spent most of my time on set off with just two 250KVA 550V transformers. When I finished there was two 750KVA 550V, four 1000KVA and a 500KVA 440V transformers. It had grown a bit.
Across the works I installed 13.8MVA of transformers and switchgear. the place was forever changing and expanding.
It was fun but bloody hard work. In one substation upgrade I had to solder 56 lugs or ferules to 500mm singles in two days.
The plant I spent most of my time on set off with just two 250KVA 550V transformers. When I finished there was two 750KVA 550V, four 1000KVA and a 500KVA 440V transformers. It had grown a bit.
Across the works I installed 13.8MVA of transformers and switchgear. the place was forever changing and expanding.
It was fun but bloody hard work. In one substation upgrade I had to solder 56 lugs or ferules to 500mm singles in two days.
K
Knobhead
Thing ain't changed that much then, take the back off Ferguson Paillin gear and there's lots of stuff to kill you. Again no handles!
E
Engineer54
Durham,
Are they full height back panels too, that expose the bus-bars?? Those full height back panels are heavy and NEED handles on them at the very least... Don't know why they wouldn't have installed an inner cover to the bus-bar chambers to at least keep them separated from the rest of the cubicle...
I have to say though, that there SF6 66KV switchboards are pretty good, couldn't fault those at all on the ones i've seen so far!!
Are they full height back panels too, that expose the bus-bars?? Those full height back panels are heavy and NEED handles on them at the very least... Don't know why they wouldn't have installed an inner cover to the bus-bar chambers to at least keep them separated from the rest of the cubicle...
I have to say though, that there SF6 66KV switchboards are pretty good, couldn't fault those at all on the ones i've seen so far!!
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D
DurhamSparky
the LV stuff is about 7ft high and about 6-700 wide...
the HV stuff is pretty much the same apart from they have encased a separate chamber at the rear that sits back from the board and has all connections etc...
if i believe rightly the HV bus A+B sits at the bottom UNDER the Circuit Breakers, i have not took apart the unit yet as its still shiny shiny and due to the nature of the building, turning it off for maintenance is made up at a government ministerial level...!!
possibly learnt from previous mistakes...!! we do on the 3000kva stuf have a exposed bus that runs about head height but it has a perspex cover in place after you remove rear access panel... not much to save you but stops you pushing fingers and head in..!
the HV stuff is pretty much the same apart from they have encased a separate chamber at the rear that sits back from the board and has all connections etc...
if i believe rightly the HV bus A+B sits at the bottom UNDER the Circuit Breakers, i have not took apart the unit yet as its still shiny shiny and due to the nature of the building, turning it off for maintenance is made up at a government ministerial level...!!
possibly learnt from previous mistakes...!! we do on the 3000kva stuf have a exposed bus that runs about head height but it has a perspex cover in place after you remove rear access panel... not much to save you but stops you pushing fingers and head in..!
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E
Engineer54
Yes i remember the the photo's you posted showing the MV cables dropping from above tray work to the extended connection chambers towards the base of the cubicles...
You shouldn't need to switch off a complete switchboard to replace a fuse in the moving voltage transformer, just the cubicle your working on which was exactly what the electricians were doing on that ABB panel...
I've seen so many different ABB MV switchboards, it's hard to say if they have a set designs for them!! ...lol!!
Don't have much of a problem with ABB LV switchboards, but still prefer MG stuff, but that's probably more to do with me being more conversant with them, than ABB or other manufacturers ..lol!! As far as RMU's the MG design has got to be the standard that everyone else strives to meet or better...
V
vaughant
I did the Hv course back in July and it was very interesting,scary stuff though!!!
I've been in the game of medium/ heavy industry/control for nearly 20 years and there was no way I could have passed the exam after 5 days,there's a lot to it.
Tonys right on the £1500 bit but I think the exams a day course and test for another £500.
The questions are pretty much given to you regarding the written part but you need to do the switching program yourself and take the examiner round with you.
If you pass the switching program but fail the exam you can resit the exam only but if you fail the switching program you fail the lot.
It's mainly mechanical work your doing and as said above the switching should be done for you in your actual job so pretty safe overall although it's near enough guaranteed death if you make a mistake.
I've been in the game of medium/ heavy industry/control for nearly 20 years and there was no way I could have passed the exam after 5 days,there's a lot to it.
Tonys right on the £1500 bit but I think the exams a day course and test for another £500.
The questions are pretty much given to you regarding the written part but you need to do the switching program yourself and take the examiner round with you.
If you pass the switching program but fail the exam you can resit the exam only but if you fail the switching program you fail the lot.
It's mainly mechanical work your doing and as said above the switching should be done for you in your actual job so pretty safe overall although it's near enough guaranteed death if you make a mistake.
N
Nivag316
I have been a HVAP for 7 years and SAP for 2 years trained at Radcliff on Soar power station and Guilds accredited, it is ok to get the training but you will need to get your company's AE to authorise you to switch on your own equipment. You will need extra training and authoring to switch on any REC equipment (old designation but they will always be the REC to me)
Get used to long boring nights in the cold/wet/dark standing around doing nothing then 2-3 hours of non stop panic then hours of paperwork each time.
Get used to long boring nights in the cold/wet/dark standing around doing nothing then 2-3 hours of non stop panic then hours of paperwork each time.
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