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And indeed I will not give up. Thank you for your trust so far !
I was thinkin on power it up more than 5V myself as well, andI also remember you suggesting me to do it as well, some times before.
I can not do what you ask me, because I'm afraid of damage it. I did a ton of tests so far, on the breadboard, and right at this moment, is working excellent on 5V. It is drawing a very low current of 30mA to 60mA, the entire board ! I'm affraid of damage it or disturb it's normal functionality, irreversibly and I did work for it a ton of time just to experiment so drastically at this point in time. I've already made a test with my american friend, by connecting the pin9 to +5V and indeed all the leds are lit FullY ! , but... the current is way over my expectations, was around 150 to 200mA. So I revert it back to my usual way of functionality which is dimmer but quite visible and it is not blinding me when in use, that's one of my points keeping the leds at a dimmer intensity. Also probably a major modification in the design itself and component count and values- for example: adding a resistor for each led in the wing, who knows. If that will get me the best functionality of it, then I will do it, but this as a possible example, and not in plan to do it now, haha.
I also have that 5V power supply mounted on the wall, though is not a terrible reason for that alone, but it counts as one.
In the future ! (tada-tadaaaa) , I plan to probably make another wing. THis one here is a prototype how I though alone to make it with my own head, and I admit I have mistakes in it. But I plan to make it with an engineer or someone way better than me, who can seriously make it run at it's full potential/randament with full brightness, with brightness variation, with sensing variation perhaps, all the things I could not resolve right now but it is functional as it is so I can't operate it from this point.
I hope you understand my reasons, and not insist on it. Some things I can do, some I can not. Thank you for your support.
Discuss How to shield a live wire at 240V ? in the UK Electrical Forum area at ElectriciansForums.net
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I have just constructed the 555 Rx monostable circuit and connected to my first prototype in which the column of 8 yellow leds represents the leds of your wings. This circuit is on the right in the video and the right hand red led indicates the received and elongated pulse from the Tx.
On the left hand side is a 555 astable which produces a pulse output at a frequency of about 5-10Hz. It represents the output from the data pin of the Rex when the Tx button is pressed briefly. You can see its red led flicker on and off when I press and the release briefly a push button which turns this circuit on and off. The pulsed output is fed into the diode-resistor-capacitor circuit you have already constructed. The voltage across the capacitor connects to the base of the npn transistor which switches pin 2 of the Rx 555 between 5 - 0 -5 V to produce the negative going trigger pulse to initiate a monostable cycle.
Pin 3 of the Rx 555 is fed to a series CR circuit. The voltage across the Capacitor is Vs which feeds into the comparators which drive the 8 leds.
It works then at least on my bench.
?
ps I could not read R4 in the video So I used 10k. I see in your last post you used 47k. I will do the same.
On the left hand side is a 555 astable which produces a pulse output at a frequency of about 5-10Hz. It represents the output from the data pin of the Rex when the Tx button is pressed briefly. You can see its red led flicker on and off when I press and the release briefly a push button which turns this circuit on and off. The pulsed output is fed into the diode-resistor-capacitor circuit you have already constructed. The voltage across the capacitor connects to the base of the npn transistor which switches pin 2 of the Rx 555 between 5 - 0 -5 V to produce the negative going trigger pulse to initiate a monostable cycle.
Pin 3 of the Rx 555 is fed to a series CR circuit. The voltage across the Capacitor is Vs which feeds into the comparators which drive the 8 leds.
It works then at least on my bench.
?
ps I could not read R4 in the video So I used 10k. I see in your last post you used 47k. I will do the same.
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- Reaction score
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R2 and C1 will make t1 about 1 second. You may wish to make this time constant longer. For the testing phase it is rather too short to check operation. I suggest you increase R2 or C1 by a factor of 5 so the pulse output from the monostable is about 5 seconds.
t2 determined by R3 and C3 is a time constant of about 220 x 10exp-6 seconds which is very short. If t1 is about 5 seconds you want t2 to be about 2 to 3 seconds. Easiest thing is to increase R3 or C3. A bit of trial and error until you have a t1 you are happy with and t2 < t1. Assume t2 = R3 x C3 seconds and then adjust until you have achieved t2 < t1.
The idea is for a brief burst of pulses from the Tx to trigger the Rx monostable. This way you conserve the life of the batteries in the Tx.
t2 determined by R3 and C3 is a time constant of about 220 x 10exp-6 seconds which is very short. If t1 is about 5 seconds you want t2 to be about 2 to 3 seconds. Easiest thing is to increase R3 or C3. A bit of trial and error until you have a t1 you are happy with and t2 < t1. Assume t2 = R3 x C3 seconds and then adjust until you have achieved t2 < t1.
The idea is for a brief burst of pulses from the Tx to trigger the Rx monostable. This way you conserve the life of the batteries in the Tx.
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OP
_q12x_
DIY
- Reaction score
- 212
Sorry for not responding straight away. My bad. But I was already in a parallel project. I started it in the night before talking with you. I interrupted it while talking to you, and then I got back to it immediate after that.
It was a necessity project. I had that problem when you have only 1 good power supply but 2 tools to be powered from it. So I made this board that is powering them both, from 1 power supply. Pretty neat, right? Again, necessity is the mother of inventions !
Here is a movie with it, a bit long(13min) :
I will get back to the project I discussed with you in a very short while.
It was a necessity project. I had that problem when you have only 1 good power supply but 2 tools to be powered from it. So I made this board that is powering them both, from 1 power supply. Pretty neat, right? Again, necessity is the mother of inventions !
Here is a movie with it, a bit long(13min) :
- Reaction score
- 4,350
I have been re-reading the datasheet on the LM3914 because I have been wondering whether it and its associated circuitry is oscillating and being unstable - dependent on the number of LEDs illuminated - worse when several LEDs are on or all are on. Do you think it is oscillating or shimmering or the first LED is slow to illuminate?
I wonder whether the 0V rail has a low enough resistance back to the power supply and whether the 0V and 5V supply to the LM3914 at pins 2 and 3 respectively is not decreasing too much as the LED light. You could do some checks on this with your voltmeter and scope.
Also, it is important for all 0V lines for the LM3914 and to items it connects to are all brought together to one point very close to terminal 2 - see Figure 1.
If it was me I would make up some thicker wire jumper leads with crocodile clips andusing these to parallel the 0V run from the PSU to pin 2 to see if it improved matters. And then repeat with another set taking 5V to pin 3.
Is there any disturbance to the illumination of the LEDs when the relays open or close?
https://www.ti.com/lit/ds/symlink/lm3914.pdf?ts=1614700327590&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.ti.com%2Fproduct%2FLM3914
Page 18 'Application Hints'-
Three of the most commonly needed precautions for using the LM3914 are shown in the first typical application drawing showing a 0V–5V bar graph meter. The most difficult problem occurs when large LED currents are being drawn, especially in bar graph mode. These currents flowing out of the ground pin cause voltage drops in external wiring, and thus errors and oscillations. Bringing the return wires from signal sources, reference ground and bottom of the resistor string (as illustrated) to a single point very near pin 2 is the best solution. Long wires from VLED to LED anode common can cause oscillations. Depending on the severity of the problem 0.05μF to 2.2μF decoupling capacitors from LED anode common to pin 2 will damp the circuit. If LED anode line wiring is inaccessible, often similar decoupling from pin 1 to pin 2 will be sufficient.
If LED turn ON seems slow (bar mode) or several LEDs light (dot mode), oscillation or excessive noise is usually the problem. In cases where proper wiring and bypassing fail to stop oscillations, V + voltage at pin 3 is usually below suggested limits.
I wonder whether the 0V rail has a low enough resistance back to the power supply and whether the 0V and 5V supply to the LM3914 at pins 2 and 3 respectively is not decreasing too much as the LED light. You could do some checks on this with your voltmeter and scope.
Also, it is important for all 0V lines for the LM3914 and to items it connects to are all brought together to one point very close to terminal 2 - see Figure 1.
If it was me I would make up some thicker wire jumper leads with crocodile clips andusing these to parallel the 0V run from the PSU to pin 2 to see if it improved matters. And then repeat with another set taking 5V to pin 3.
Is there any disturbance to the illumination of the LEDs when the relays open or close?
https://www.ti.com/lit/ds/symlink/lm3914.pdf?ts=1614700327590&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.ti.com%2Fproduct%2FLM3914
Page 18 'Application Hints'-
Three of the most commonly needed precautions for using the LM3914 are shown in the first typical application drawing showing a 0V–5V bar graph meter. The most difficult problem occurs when large LED currents are being drawn, especially in bar graph mode. These currents flowing out of the ground pin cause voltage drops in external wiring, and thus errors and oscillations. Bringing the return wires from signal sources, reference ground and bottom of the resistor string (as illustrated) to a single point very near pin 2 is the best solution. Long wires from VLED to LED anode common can cause oscillations. Depending on the severity of the problem 0.05μF to 2.2μF decoupling capacitors from LED anode common to pin 2 will damp the circuit. If LED anode line wiring is inaccessible, often similar decoupling from pin 1 to pin 2 will be sufficient.
If LED turn ON seems slow (bar mode) or several LEDs light (dot mode), oscillation or excessive noise is usually the problem. In cases where proper wiring and bypassing fail to stop oscillations, V + voltage at pin 3 is usually below suggested limits.
OP
_q12x_
DIY
- Reaction score
- 212
Thank you mister @marconi. Very interesting what you find ! I must confess, that I did read this pdf a tiny bit. I should give it a full read as you just did now. But the problem is a bit more complicated than this, because alone, unlinked to the RF receiver, does not fluctuate or misbehave. ONLY when is linked (pin5) to the output of the RF receiver circuit after the 555 oscilator, ONLY then, it starts oscilating and random patterns in different times when I freshly connect it. So, it is very stable by it's own, but that particular circuit, with that 555 in it, it just messing it up. I will have to make a movie, showing this erroneous behaviour and explaining what I did ... hopefully as complete as I can and if I even remember all the permutations I did. At least the major ones.
There is an exception. When the 555 circuit is not added to the Rx on the receiver, and pin5 is connected directly to this Rx, all is doing fine, not oscilating, but not working as desired as well. I didnt try your circuit yet since I had to do that other projekt, but I will very soon and I will announce you how it went. Im a bit demoralized by these attempts, but I will get over them.
There is an exception. When the 555 circuit is not added to the Rx on the receiver, and pin5 is connected directly to this Rx, all is doing fine, not oscilating, but not working as desired as well. I didnt try your circuit yet since I had to do that other projekt, but I will very soon and I will announce you how it went. Im a bit demoralized by these attempts, but I will get over them.
- Reaction score
- 4,350
I suspect - knowing you a little better after 271 posts (!) - you will carry on 
Would you do one test for me in absolutely the way I describe? Make up a 6 Volt battery and use this to power your wings circuitry instead of the 5V power supply. Completely disconnect the 5V mains power supply (top left of your wings board) and unplug it from the socket. I would like to see how the modules behave when powered by a pure continuous direct current not derived from the mains supply. Four AA batteries should do the trick - four Cs or Ds even better.
Would you do one test for me in absolutely the way I describe? Make up a 6 Volt battery and use this to power your wings circuitry instead of the 5V power supply. Completely disconnect the 5V mains power supply (top left of your wings board) and unplug it from the socket. I would like to see how the modules behave when powered by a pure continuous direct current not derived from the mains supply. Four AA batteries should do the trick - four Cs or Ds even better.
OP
_q12x_
DIY
- Reaction score
- 212
Thank you for your trust and for knowing me !I suspect - knowing you a little better after 271 posts (!) - you will carry on
Would you do one test for me in absolutely the way I describe? Make up a 6 Volt battery and use this to power your wings circuitry instead of the 5V power supply. Completely disconnect the 5V mains power supply (top left of your wings board) and unplug it from the socket. I would like to see how the modules behave when powered by a pure continuous direct current not derived from the mains supply. Four AA batteries should do the trick - four Cs or Ds even better.
And indeed I will not give up. Thank you for your trust so far !
I was thinkin on power it up more than 5V myself as well, andI also remember you suggesting me to do it as well, some times before.
I can not do what you ask me, because I'm afraid of damage it. I did a ton of tests so far, on the breadboard, and right at this moment, is working excellent on 5V. It is drawing a very low current of 30mA to 60mA, the entire board ! I'm affraid of damage it or disturb it's normal functionality, irreversibly and I did work for it a ton of time just to experiment so drastically at this point in time. I've already made a test with my american friend, by connecting the pin9 to +5V and indeed all the leds are lit FullY ! , but... the current is way over my expectations, was around 150 to 200mA. So I revert it back to my usual way of functionality which is dimmer but quite visible and it is not blinding me when in use, that's one of my points keeping the leds at a dimmer intensity. Also probably a major modification in the design itself and component count and values- for example: adding a resistor for each led in the wing, who knows. If that will get me the best functionality of it, then I will do it, but this as a possible example, and not in plan to do it now, haha.
I also have that 5V power supply mounted on the wall, though is not a terrible reason for that alone, but it counts as one.
In the future ! (tada-tadaaaa) , I plan to probably make another wing. THis one here is a prototype how I though alone to make it with my own head, and I admit I have mistakes in it. But I plan to make it with an engineer or someone way better than me, who can seriously make it run at it's full potential/randament with full brightness, with brightness variation, with sensing variation perhaps, all the things I could not resolve right now but it is functional as it is so I can't operate it from this point.
I hope you understand my reasons, and not insist on it. Some things I can do, some I can not. Thank you for your support.
- Reaction score
- 4,350
The final decision on the way ahead is down to you as the chief engineer of this project.
Here are there reasons why I know using a 6V battery will cause no harm to your modules:
1. As soon as current is drawn from the 6V battery it’s terminal voltage will drop because it has internal resistance;
2. For non of your modules or parts of your modules is the supply voltage of exactly 5V critical. An increase to just over 5V but not more than 6V will not damage anything.
3. There is most likely already more voltage variation already from the 5V mains powered dc supply. Is it a regulated or stabilised power supply maintaining 5V? To what tolerance? Is it providing 5V whatever the current? Have you monitored it?
I understand your caution.
The dc from a battery is pure direct current. The dc from the power supply has ripple, some ac mains superimposed and if it is a switched mode power supply then some harmonics of this conversion process. And on top of all these there is the electrical noise conducted between the mains and 5V because of imperfect insulation.
But do not be pressured by me. Do what you feel comfortable with since it is your project.
Here are there reasons why I know using a 6V battery will cause no harm to your modules:
1. As soon as current is drawn from the 6V battery it’s terminal voltage will drop because it has internal resistance;
2. For non of your modules or parts of your modules is the supply voltage of exactly 5V critical. An increase to just over 5V but not more than 6V will not damage anything.
3. There is most likely already more voltage variation already from the 5V mains powered dc supply. Is it a regulated or stabilised power supply maintaining 5V? To what tolerance? Is it providing 5V whatever the current? Have you monitored it?
I understand your caution.
The dc from a battery is pure direct current. The dc from the power supply has ripple, some ac mains superimposed and if it is a switched mode power supply then some harmonics of this conversion process. And on top of all these there is the electrical noise conducted between the mains and 5V because of imperfect insulation.
But do not be pressured by me. Do what you feel comfortable with since it is your project.
OP
_q12x_
DIY
- Reaction score
- 212
- Give me your best IR remote circuit that you can think of/know of, and that is working optimal at least 4meter distance.
It's the next thing I really want to try. My reason and my desire is to use multiple (probably 2)remotes with a IR led.
I suspected the RF boards will be problematic but now I know why ! That is called experience, even if it failed on me.
Can you help me on that?
Oh...and if it helps you in any way. my american friend had build (not like you) only the RF transmission + the 555 circuits for both Tx and Rx. For him it worked perfectly. But for me it did not. My point is that even if its working for you there, is not necessarily to work for me the same. Ive already experienced it and im telling you to know how things are. Another point I want to make with this example i mention, is that we must try it until it works, because if we try enough times, it will work. Im talking about the IR experiment we are about to make.
Im thinking to start making my own design but.... im really new to it, so Ill handle it to you first.
This circuit I found the other days. I want to believe it will behave the best and in my parameters I want it as I enunciate it at the start of this new post here.
If you have your own design, Im happy to see it. I kind of finding this circuit, that is a bit hard because of the double power supply I must insert, and I very much want to avoid that. And also at 5V, and not at 12V as this is offering.
But if no alternatives works, then this is the backup.
It's the next thing I really want to try. My reason and my desire is to use multiple (probably 2)remotes with a IR led.
I suspected the RF boards will be problematic but now I know why ! That is called experience, even if it failed on me.
Can you help me on that?
Oh...and if it helps you in any way. my american friend had build (not like you) only the RF transmission + the 555 circuits for both Tx and Rx. For him it worked perfectly. But for me it did not. My point is that even if its working for you there, is not necessarily to work for me the same. Ive already experienced it and im telling you to know how things are. Another point I want to make with this example i mention, is that we must try it until it works, because if we try enough times, it will work. Im talking about the IR experiment we are about to make.
Im thinking to start making my own design but.... im really new to it, so Ill handle it to you first.
This circuit I found the other days. I want to believe it will behave the best and in my parameters I want it as I enunciate it at the start of this new post here.
If you have your own design, Im happy to see it. I kind of finding this circuit, that is a bit hard because of the double power supply I must insert, and I very much want to avoid that. And also at 5V, and not at 12V as this is offering.
But if no alternatives works, then this is the backup.
- Reaction score
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Do not be upset but I am taking a break from responding to any more posts. It sounds like you have a helpful and knowledgeable American engineer who can assist you.
Honestly, I cannot devote much more time to this interesting challenge. I have to turn my attention to another project to do with solar electricity for my brother-in-law.
When I have time I will/may return to my version of your challenging project.
I repeat we part for now but not for ever so to speak.
Good luck! Please do continue to post your progress because the thread you started now has a few thousand hits so many folk are reading it on the Electricians Forum.
?
Honestly, I cannot devote much more time to this interesting challenge. I have to turn my attention to another project to do with solar electricity for my brother-in-law.
When I have time I will/may return to my version of your challenging project.
I repeat we part for now but not for ever so to speak.
Good luck! Please do continue to post your progress because the thread you started now has a few thousand hits so many folk are reading it on the Electricians Forum.
?
OP
_q12x_
DIY
- Reaction score
- 212
Well, believe me or not (I get the feeling you don't, haha) , I do care about my project to make it as close as I imagine it in the first place. I agree, it is time consuming and hard, especially for me alone. Also slow. Well, not that alone, counting your 2 guys help. But still, I only have 2 hands and I have to keep focused on what is getting me closer to my final objective.
I agree with you. Breaks are good; and Im telling you a secret, breaks are also contributing to the good result as much as the hard work. I am personally take breaks, not so drastic, but more small and often, I kind of managing them. I also have a routine. That's why I'm slow. Also my inexperience in a lot of things, but that is another discussion.
I'll probably open another discussion on IR remote alone, since here is "too much" from what I get it... and I kind of agree, I kind of talked about everything on this way too long thread. We'll see.
I also thought remotes are easy. It looks they are not that easy. Very weird.
Thanks for the help so far. And have fun with that sport play on tv you said you are watching these days.
Cheers mate.
I agree with you. Breaks are good; and Im telling you a secret, breaks are also contributing to the good result as much as the hard work. I am personally take breaks, not so drastic, but more small and often, I kind of managing them. I also have a routine. That's why I'm slow. Also my inexperience in a lot of things, but that is another discussion.
I'll probably open another discussion on IR remote alone, since here is "too much" from what I get it... and I kind of agree, I kind of talked about everything on this way too long thread. We'll see.
I also thought remotes are easy. It looks they are not that easy. Very weird.
Thanks for the help so far. And have fun with that sport play on tv you said you are watching these days.
Cheers mate.
OP
_q12x_
DIY
- Reaction score
- 212
"I am wondering how your project has progressed"
Oh, hello mister marconi !
I literally didn't check this website for awhile sorry for that, from 2 reasons, and I hope is understandable:
1-I was working slowly and nothing really to update with, and 2- I didn't made too much progress.
Me and my american friend- sorry to mention him but its how reality stands, yes, I get some help and im very grateful I have it to be brutally honest. And you are one of my friend since you got involved into this crazy project of mine.
So... the update so far, is that I am expecting some components to arrive from my friend from america, but in this time while I am waiting for them , I built with my friends help as well, a IR receiver and transmitter only on the breadboard so far. And we got splendid results, especially for the range from the IR to my palm in front of it and back to the receiver. Exactly as you did it, but with new circuit.
The real problem that remains is the interference from the window, that is directly in front of the wall, and in front of that panel and it's IR sensors. So..at any time, any wild IR light, from the sun or somewhere else, might switch this thing. And... hmmm... I am in a bit of depression.
The thing is, with these things, you always get the bad results from them, and if you're very smart or very lucky (or very persistent like I was and still am), you will get some good results as well.
Yes, it is hard as it gets. It's a challenge.
Have you thought about a career in renewable energy?
I wish to be able to work in such fantastic domains like electronics or electrics but I have no paper to certify the validity of my knowledge.... so it's a fantasy to even hope. I know my place very well and Im fine with it, for a long time. What are you thinking about? DO tell me, you made me curious.
Oh, hello mister marconi !
I literally didn't check this website for awhile sorry for that, from 2 reasons, and I hope is understandable:
1-I was working slowly and nothing really to update with, and 2- I didn't made too much progress.
Me and my american friend- sorry to mention him but its how reality stands, yes, I get some help and im very grateful I have it to be brutally honest. And you are one of my friend since you got involved into this crazy project of mine.
So... the update so far, is that I am expecting some components to arrive from my friend from america, but in this time while I am waiting for them , I built with my friends help as well, a IR receiver and transmitter only on the breadboard so far. And we got splendid results, especially for the range from the IR to my palm in front of it and back to the receiver. Exactly as you did it, but with new circuit.
The real problem that remains is the interference from the window, that is directly in front of the wall, and in front of that panel and it's IR sensors. So..at any time, any wild IR light, from the sun or somewhere else, might switch this thing. And... hmmm... I am in a bit of depression.
The thing is, with these things, you always get the bad results from them, and if you're very smart or very lucky (or very persistent like I was and still am), you will get some good results as well.
Yes, it is hard as it gets. It's a challenge.
Have you thought about a career in renewable energy?
I wish to be able to work in such fantastic domains like electronics or electrics but I have no paper to certify the validity of my knowledge.... so it's a fantasy to even hope. I know my place very well and Im fine with it, for a long time. What are you thinking about? DO tell me, you made me curious.
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