Kitchen Unit Lights to LightSwitch - Help Appreciated

[Callum Thomas]

Hi Guys,

I am currently getting a kitchen overhaul and want to install some unit/kick-board lights. I want to be able to control the unit lights with the light-switch which controls the down-lights in the kitchen ceiling. I have swapped the switch out for a double switch.

The lights have came for the units but they require a plug socket. I was thinking of cutting the plugs off the lights and putting them onto a transformer. As previously mentioned, there are 2 sets of lights, both require 12v power supply. One set has 10 lights each at 0.2w (2 watts in total) and the other set has 6 lights with a combined power of 2.5w.

I was thinking of cutting the plugs from these 2 sets of lights and buying a 6w LED Driver transformer to connect all the lights up to. The last thing i want to do is be able to control all of this via a light-switch which currently controls the ceiling lights in the kitchen. I have swapped this out for a 2-gang light-switch and successfully wired up the ceiling lights to one of these switches. The remaining switch i want to wire this transformer up to. Was wondering how i can go about doing this and power it from the existing lighting from the ceiling lights. However, obviously there is no neutral from this switch so where does this come from? Also, should i be using flex cable from the light switch to the transformer? Does anything need to be earthed?

Any help is greatly appreciated.

P.S Here is a link to the transformer i am looking at. Is this suitable?

LED Driver Transformer DC 12v-6w, 10W 12w, 18w, 30w,40W for MR11, MR16 LED Strip | eBay - https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/LED-Driver-Transformer-DC-12v-6w-10W-12w-18w-30w-40W-for-MR11-MR16-LED-Strip/291227662579?hash=item43ce8578f3:m:m1oUI8fA_qqZMfaQKe59ytA

 

[Dave OCD]

Crafty Callum - Starting a new thread after the previous one was closed ! The reply below was written by me just as the other thread was closed down......
Ok I don't condone encouraging untrained people to carry out electrical work but if the plinth lights come with a transformer plug as their means of connection there is no sensible option but to use a 13a socket.
My suggestions would be connect the socket via a switched fused spur with 3a fuse or if you really must have the switch at the main light switch position put in a separate dry lining box and have 2 single switches thus keeping different circuits apart - but still feed the whole setup via a fused spur.

 

[Wilko]

Hi - to add functions to your light switch position will likely require more cables to be run. If so, they will need testing and certifying to BS 7671 to prove their safety. If your existing consumer unit (fuse box) doesn't include RCD supervision for this circuit then it will likely need to be added and tested and certified etc. These steps are required so that you are safe and your house insurance remains valid. Perhaps look at wireless control plug in option?

 

[Leesparkykent]

I notice you've changed this thread...possibly from the advice I've seen given to you on another forum you've posted on. If this thread goes the same way as the other then this will be close as well. No one on here should provide you with step by step instructions.

 

[Pete999]

Hi Guys,

I am currently getting a kitchen overhaul and want to install some unit/kick-board lights. I want to be able to control the unit lights with the light-switch which controls the down-lights in the kitchen ceiling. I have swapped the switch out for a double switch.

The lights have came for the units but they require a plug socket. I was thinking of cutting the plugs off the lights and putting them onto a transformer. As previously mentioned, there are 2 sets of lights, both require 12v power supply. One set has 10 lights each at 0.2w (2 watts in total) and the other set has 6 lights with a combined power of 2.5w.

I was thinking of cutting the plugs from these 2 sets of lights and buying a 6w LED Driver transformer to connect all the lights up to. The last thing i want to do is be able to control all of this via a light-switch which currently controls the ceiling lights in the kitchen. I have swapped this out for a 2-gang light-switch and successfully wired up the ceiling lights to one of these switches. The remaining switch i want to wire this transformer up to. Was wondering how i can go about doing this and power it from the existing lighting from the ceiling lights. However, obviously there is no neutral from this switch so where does this come from? Also, should i be using flex cable from the light switch to the transformer? Does anything need to be earthed?

Any help is greatly appreciated.

P.S Here is a link to the transformer i am looking at. Is this suitable?

LED Driver Transformer DC 12v-6w, 10W 12w, 18w, 30w,40W for MR11, MR16 LED Strip | eBay - https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/LED-Driver-Transformer-DC-12v-6w-10W-12w-18w-30w-40W-for-MR11-MR16-LED-Strip/291227662579?hash=item43ce8578f3:m:m1oUI8fA_qqZMfaQKe59ytA

Tenacious, I'll give you that Callum

 

[buzzlightyear]

https://www.bing.com/videos/search?...997990DCA9461585AD63997990DCA9461&FORM=VDRVRV

 

[Pete999]

gran of ****ing libertys - Bing video - https://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=gran+of+****ing+libertys&&view=detail&mid=88F25CA4C61A2A2E38D988F25CA4C61A2A2E38D9&rvsmid=585AD63997990DCA9461585AD63997990DCA9461&FORM=VDRVRV

 

[westward10]

The end....

 

[123]

@Wilko what's RCD supervision?

 

[Toneyz]

Is there a neutral at the existing switch?
Is there another switch on the back of the wall of the existing switch which light is on the same circuit?
how do you plan the run cables?
Do these lights come with moulded plug transformer so can only be plugged into a socket?

 

[buzzlightyear]

this op has snuck back in through the back door!

 

[Toneyz]

this op has snuck back in through the back door!

You've come back in from the naughty step?

 

[Octopus]

Given the picture the op posted of his aged Wylex rewire able fuseboard, I can confidently predict that any changes he and or others are doing to his kitchen will not comply with the regs

But I doubt the op will be interested in this ........

 

[Strima]

As I said on the other thread that got locked get a WiFi switch and plug the whole lot into a normal socket

Stop dicking around with things you know nothing about and are liable able to kill you.

 

[Spoon]

Hello again.
Just go with @Strima suggestion in the post above, which was also mentioned in your other thread, there you ignored most of the advice...

 

[Callum Thomas]

Hi Guys,

I've decided to go with the plug socket idea as i've been told confusing things by different people. Some say the socket is the way to go as these lights come with moulded plug transformer so can only be plugged into a socket. Others say buy my own transformer but i wouldn't be comfortable to cut the plug for something which may not 100% work if i screw up. I have drew up a diagram of what i plan to do, just after some guidance on whether this would be safe and would work.

Just to further explain the diagram, the power source is going to be from the existing lighting circuit in the ceiling. I'm going to put a WAGO connector on the 'Live Loop' and branch off from here to the light switch. I am then going to run another cable to the double socket into the 'Live' terminal as a 'Switched Live'. The neutral i'm going to also bring from the lighting circuit from the ceiling, i'm going to connect the two Neutrals using a plastic connector and run this along side the back box in the wall cavity. Will also link up the earths in the lug of the metal face-plate for the switch.

What are your thoughts guys?

 

[Callum Thomas]

As I said on the other thread that got locked get a WiFi switch and plug the whole lot into a normal socket

Stop dicking around with things you know nothing about and are liable able to kill you.

As previously mentioned, I want to be able to control it via the Light switch, not Wi-FI.

 

[Octopus]

As previously mentioned, I want to be able to control it via the Light switch, not Wi-FI.

I refer you back to post #13

 

[Spoon]

Hi OP. Do you know the regulations that this will have to comply with?
Why the 'Dumb' on @Murdoch post?
Do you have test kit to test the circuit afterwards?

 

[Octopus]

OP - are you just an annoying troll ?

You ask for advice and pretty much ignore every sensible suggestion made.

Hopeless

Fingers crossed this will be locked soon and you may get a ban ..... Fingers crossed!

 

[Octopus]

Hi OP. Do you know the regulations that this will have to comply with?
Why the 'Dumb' on @Murdoch post?
Do you have test kit to test the circuit afterwards?

Probably because I gave him a dumb for his recent post which is almost identical to one he had posted on his earlier thread which is now locked.


My crystal ball suggests this will be locked soon .....

 

[Callum Thomas]

OP - are you just an annoying troll ?

You ask for advice and pretty much ignore every sensible suggestion made.

Hopeless

Fingers crossed this will be locked soon and you may get a ban ..... Fingers crossed!

I take it by the lack of criticism to my last proposal that this would be an acceptable way of doing things. Thanks to those who actually PROVIDED any relevant information to help me accomplish what i wanted to.

 

[Octopus]

My advice to you is don't meddle with things you don't understand.

 

[Spoon]

I take it by the lack of criticism to my last proposal that this would be an acceptable way of doing things.

lmao..... like you care what we think...
Do you not like me... You don't answer any of my posts...
I haven't provided any relevant information as I feel that you are not competent enough to do the work.

 

[Callum Thomas]

Hi OP. Do you know the regulations that this will have to comply with?
Why the 'Dumb' on @Murdoch post?
Do you have test kit to test the circuit afterwards?

"553-04 Lighting points
553-04-01 At each fixed lighting point one of the following accessories shall be used:
(i) a ceiling rose to BS 67
(ii) a luminaire supporting coupler to BS 6972 or BS 7001
(iii) a batten lampholder to BS 7895, BS EN 60238 or BS EN 61184
(iv) a luminaire designed to be connected directly to the circuit wiring
(v) a suitable socket-outlet
(vi) a connection unit to BS 5733 or BS 1363-4.
A lighting installation shall be appropriately controlled, e.g. by a switch or combination of switches to BS 3676 and/or BS 5518, or by a suitable automatic control system, which where necessary shall be suitable for discharge lighting circuits.
553-04-02 A ceiling rose shall not be installed in any circuit operating at a voltage normally exceeding 250 volts.
553-04-03 A ceiling rose shall not be used for the attachment of more than one outgoing flexible cord unless it is specially designed for multiple pendants.
553-04-04 Luminaire supporting couplers are designed specifically for the mechanical support and electrical connection of luminaires and shall not be used for the connection of any other equipment."

So who's to say that you don't adopt 553-04-01(v), and install "a suitable socket-outlet" to the lighting circuit, as a lighting point, for supplying lights (or whatever). Reasonable labelling (and / or reasonable location, e.g. at high level) should help overcome the temptation to plug heavy current using equipment into it (thereby avoiding nuisance trips); it would be hard to argue that such a labelled / located socket outlet, even if it is to BS1363, is not a "a suitable socket-outlet". Also,553-04-01(vi) refers to "a connection unit to...BS 1363-4", which is a standard Fused Connection Unit.

 

[Spoon]

What about the last question?

 

[Callum Thomas]

Just to further satisfy all those who didn't agree as they thought i'd go against regs and make it unsafe, going to put a 5A faceplate on the socket and fix a 5A plug top to a short RCD-Protected extension lead after cutting off the 13A plug top.Plug light transformer into the extension.
No fixed wiring contraventions/arguments.
As mentioned earlier by others ,even if it's a four way extension and some muppet plugs a kettle in to it the 5/6A protection will operate and keep both property and persons safe.

 

[Amp David]

I’d stick to the first reply you got in your last post callum. Then get a fuse borad upgrade

 

[Spoon]

Just to further satisfy all those who didn't agree as they thought i'd go against regs and make it unsafe, going to put a 5A faceplate on the socket and fix a 5A plug top to a short RCD-Protected extension lead after cutting off the 13A plug top.Plug light transformer into the extension.
No fixed wiring contraventions/arguments.
As mentioned earlier by others ,even if it's a four way extension and some muppet plugs a kettle in to it the 5/6A protection will operate and keep both property and persons safe.

As previously mentioned, I want to be able to control it via the Light switch, not Wi-FI.

How is the light switch going to work with you above post? It's that 'fixed wiring'?

 

[Pete999]

Just to further satisfy all those who didn't agree as they thought i'd go against regs and make it unsafe, going to put a 5A faceplate on the socket and fix a 5A plug top to a short RCD-Protected extension lead after cutting off the 13A plug top.Plug light transformer into the extension.
No fixed wiring contraventions/arguments.
As mentioned earlier by others ,even if it's a four way extension and some muppet plugs a kettle in to it the 5/6A protection will operate and keep both property and persons safe.