ELECSA Certification Scheme Elecsa not accepted ????

[Sav]

Hi everyone,
Just a quick question.

Been asked by a letting agent friend of mine to do some periodic inspections on some properties for rent.

I told him I am with Elecsa, but he just called and send the surveyor will only accept NICEIC certs !!!!

I told him Elecsa is the same sort of scheme, but the surveyor is adament that only NICEIC is what he is accepted.

He is wrong isn't he ????

Thanks and best regards,

Sav

 

[ringer]

What's it got do do with a surveyor?

 

[chrisgc]

I am looking to join a competent person scheme and would rather ELECSA but due to peoples lack of knowledge I am considering NICEIC.

I dont think its fair that these home diy programmes all mention NICEIC as this gives the impression that they are the only one you can belong to.

Something has to be done as surely it borders on monopolising (through no fault though of NICEIC).

Surely programmes which in the past have been on BBC should not solely be plugging one company as this (what I thought) is against their regulations.

Lettings agencies seem to believe its NICEIC or nothing - I think it makes them seem like they have knowledge by mentioning them letters in a sentence - when in fact they dont seem to have a clue.

 

[Phil]

Hi everyone,
Just a quick question.

Been asked by a letting agent friend of mine to do some periodic inspections on some properties for rent.

I told him I am with Elecsa, but he just called and send the surveyor will only accept NICEIC certs !!!!

I told him Elecsa is the same sort of scheme, but the surveyor is adament that only NICEIC is what he is accepted.

He is wrong isn't he ????

Thanks and best regards,

Sav

i actually spoke to Jean Mickle about this issue a couple of weeks ago and she has given me her number for any members that are having issues with local authorities etc to speak to her on 0845 634 9043

 

[Phil]

let me know how you get on

 

[IQ Electrical]

I told him I am with Elecsa, but he just called and send the surveyor will only accept NICEIC certs !!!!

I told him Elecsa is the same sort of scheme, but the surveyor is adament that only NICEIC is what he is accepted.

He is wrong isn't he ????

It's not a question of right or wrong, the client can specify a particular trade body if they wish, it's often just down to the fact that on the rare occasion someone does know of a trade body, it's normally the NICEIC!

 

[Des 56]

Print off these replies and educate the numpty


If they want an inspection report that may very well be "signed" by a competent person, but very possibly, carried out by a person with little or no training,then by all means choose an Niceic company

If you prefer to be assured that the person carrying out the report is actually trained to do so,either make sure the Niceic operative is actually qualified or the Qualifying supervisor does the on site inspection and the report ( unskilled labourers tend to do poor Pirs )

Or chose from an equivalent scheme ,such as Elecsa or Napit where the individuals competence is assessed

 

[Guest123]

I may need educating here also, but do PIR's come under the scope of the Elecsa part p scheme??? for instance with the NIC they are a bolt on to DI status.

What I mean is are they included in your enrolment or are they an optional extra??? Or do you have to join Elecsa's big brother the ECA???


Sadly it is as IQ said, anyone can ask for whatever scheme memebership they want

 

[Phil]

i believe it`s just the nic that want a little extra to do the pir`s mate tbh. from what i recall napit and elecsa are ok with doing pir`s

 

[swparksey]

I may need educating here also, but do PIR's come under the scope of the Elecsa part p scheme??? for instance with the NIC they are a bolt on to DI status.

What I mean is are they included in your enrolment or are they an optional extra??? Or do you have to join Elecsa's big brother the ECA???


Sadly it is as IQ said, anyone can ask for whatever scheme membership they want

This is what gets me, there is nothing in law requiring a person carrying out a PIR to be registered with any competent person schemes, we have become our own worst enemies by allowing NICEIC NAPIT etc to add this as part of your scope. This is outside of their scope and what part P was put in place to achieve.
But as good sheep we do what they say.
When we should be reporting them for anti competitive behaviour any attempting to create a cartel, this is essentially what they are doing and you as scheme members are allowing them to get away with it.

Anyway rant over, now prepared to be shot

 

[keniff]

elecsa have you pay extra for them to give you permission to do pir's its very kind of them and you only have to pay around £600

 

[IQ Electrical]

I believe Elecsa require a bolt on fee too for PIR's?

The thing is, no scheme provider is saying 'you can't do a PIR' they are saying if you wish to be assessed anually and carry out PIR's under our scheme name then you have to pay a fee for the privilege.

Personally, I think it's ********, but unfortunately, the big myth among specifiers and Joe Public is that you have to be backed up by a scheme.

 

[IQ Electrical]

Ha, Keithsims beat me to it!

 

[swparksey]

Personally, I think it's ********, but unfortunately, the big myth among specifiers and Joe Public is that you have to be backed up by a scheme.

I totally agree it is *******, but if everybody said stuff adding the extra Joe Public would not be able to get a scheme backed PIR as none of us would sign up for it then the scheme provider would not make any money from it and quickly drop it.

 

[Phil]

never ending pay out circle that comes alongside the trade. i once a long time ago thought when you qualified and got the relevant experience apart from the occasional update course and insurance that that was it..... umm how wrong was i everyone wants a bit.

 

[IQ Electrical]

Ok, you want a laugh, look at this for the best part of a grand!!!!

 

[Guest123]

Luke Plumbley not a member is he???

 

[nickblake]

Guys i have had the same problem Elecsa are brilliant when this happens i did a periodic on a rental property ,all ok no probles with it did her the certs all printed and it was refused and the letting agents sent out their electricians and guss what it was fine no problems and charged the customer £50 more than i charged so it cost her twice for the inspection spoke to elecsa about it and they delt with it

 

[nickblake]

Yes elecsa do a bolt on fee cost me another 320 , but that covers me for three years

 

[IQ Electrical]

Yes elecsa do a bolt on fee cost me another 320 , but that covers me for three years

Yes but what does it cover you for?

 

[nickblake]

Approved for periodic inspections of dwelings , already got my Part P with them

 

[IQ Electrical]

But what are the actual benefits that you received for your PIR fee?

 

[Graeme Harrold]

The fee alows you to use ELECSA headed forms. Yes they are taking money from you, but as said above, ELECSA cover you for 3 years, so their fee is quite low. Playing devils advocate, but is this not quality control, and if sold to your customers correctly should be able to boost your credibility..........Flack jacket on

 

[IQ Electrical]

It is, you can take off the flack jacket!
Sounds like a much better setup than the NICEIC

 

[Guest123]

IMO if you intend doing PIR's and works other than domestic etc, then you're better off either going ECA, NIC AC or even full scope Napit.

One fee for everything, job done.

 

[nickblake]

But what are the actual benefits that you received for your PIR fee?

In reality what are the benifits with any of them just you can use their logo , ive been with elecsa since i started on my own 3 years ago assesment in December , im not worried about it , as i know the guys are there to help you out yes maybe i may not answer the some of the questions correctly , they are there to help you out , and the real benifit is if i need technical advice its there the technical guys are 2nd to none

 

[IQ Electrical]

IMO if you intend doing PIR's and works other than domestic etc, then you're better off either going ECA, NIC AC or even full scope Napit.

One fee for everything, job done.

I think you're probably right.

 

[Andyfm]

Full scope NAPIT is OK for PIRs as long as you`ve got indemnity insurance

 

[Johno]

I am with elecsa, and do not pay the extra for PIR guidance (or whatever it is that the fee is for), I use the elecsa headed PIR forms though and have been told this is ok by elecsa assessor.

 

[swparksey]

I assume that you could use say the Approved Domestic Installer or Approved Contractor logo on you PIR form if say you are with NICEIC, after all you are one of these what could they possibly do about it? Maybe they will intoriduce another one, somthing like Approved Periodic Inspector?

It really gets up my nose,

And just found this on the NICEIC website

Please see our Virtual PIR Course details as domestic installers who successfully complete this course will gain automatic extension to do domestic PIR work.

Hummm more about sales now than safety