House rewire and compliance certification question

[Mattressback]

hi, asking as a customer not a tradesman

Having had a rewire and had some issues with the electrician , namely his working standards and the fact the job took twice as long as estimated. I paid a third up front before work started, he then coerced a not agreed upon second payment out of me a little later and now the electrician is now demanding the final third of the invoice before he will provide me with any certification .

Because there is an element of mistrust I’m worried he may take the remainder of the money and then I will be left chasing him forever after for the certificates. I’ve suggested he bring them and I transfer the money there and then in front of him but he has refused this offer and is insisting on final payment first.

Is this standard practice?

 

[Pete999]

Whenever I submitted my invoice's, the appropriate certification & notification had already been submitted to my client. I did so because of the advice given here on this forum by members (as it is in this thread).

However, I cannot find anything in BS7671 which states such documentation has to be provided, before payment. Not surprising really, as BS7671 is about requirements for electrical regulations, not good business practise.

Reg 631.1 Upon completion of the verification of a new installation...…, an EIC.…. shall be provided. So define completion?

Those who have bought & sold houses recently, could explain that you can't have your keys for the new house, until the solicitors have received the various monies.

I purchased a new build property, but never received the documentation, until well after moving in (in fact it had to go back, as it hadn't been signed).

I would say it is good practise to provided certification before receiving payment, but there is no requirement to do so.

Certification is part and partial to " doing the work" so unless certification is completed, the work is not completed, so why pay for work that isn't finished?

 

[Midwest]

Certification is part and partial to " doing the work" so unless certification is completed, the work is not completed, so why pay for work that isn't finished?

Completion of the installation will take place when both client & contractor agree; not just when the actual work has finished.

 

[Pete999]

Completion of the installation will take place when both client & contractor agree; not just when the actual work has finished.

The work is completed when the contractor has finished the work that was agreed at the onset of the contract. in my opinion.

 

[rolyberkin]

Any contract must involve an offer and an acceptance, conditions can be part of that acceptance on either side. That be said if in the terms of the contract the certificate is not provided until full payment has been made BS7671 is neither here or there as the contract would be legally binding. I would like to see any discussion at County Court.

 

[Midwest]

The work is completed when the contractor has finished the work that was agreed at the onset of the contract. in my opinion.

Other analogies (which I've read elsewhere), along with the MOT example are accountancy books, examination certificates, boiler service certificates, even that poxy Trust Mark, all require payment before you can receive your certificate.

One of the respected members, recounted a story where he hadn't been paid fully. And as the installed materials remained his property until paid, went round cut & chopped etc everything out.

Perhaps withholding a certificate is less extreme?

 

[Deleted member 26818]

Personally, I’ve produced certification both before and after payment. Never been a problem for me.

As for MOT and Lanlord boiler safety certificates, in my experience, they are produced before payment.
Never used an Accountant or Trust mark.

 

[buzzlightyear]

This is to op you have sighed a contract to pay the monies in full plus extras ,now he takes you to court you will have to argue with a judge that what damge that was done and of course the dust sheets ,
all the best judge rinder .

 

[Midwest]

Personally, I’ve produced certification both before and after payment. Never been a problem for me.

As for MOT and Lanlord boiler safety certificates, in my experience, they are produced before payment.
Never used an Accountant or Trust mark.

Personally I always provided my clients with certificates etc before payment, no problems with payment for me. However I can understand some that have had late or problematic payers, and I can understand their viewpoint about withholding certificate until payment.

The certificate for an MOT is done electronically now days, but you won't get your copy until you paid along with your keys; although I could see that getting complicated. I was referring to my gas boiler cert, which was emailed 2 weeks after I paid them, and chased up.

Don't know what I was thinking, enrolling with Trust Mark

 

[Deleted member 26818]

Not saying that you get the MOT certificate before payment necessarily (though that is often the case), saying the certificate is produced before payment.
That being said, last time I got an MOT on my car, I dropped the key off in the guy’s letter box, phoned up the next day to let him know.
He collected the car from my house, did the MOT and then returned the car to my house leaving the certificate and key in the locked boot of my car.
I then dropped the payment off in his letter box after phoning up to find out how much.

 

[richy3333]

In a domestic situation and given all the consumer law that exists I think you'd be on a sticky wicket to withhold a cert if not paid. If nothing else the homeowner would likely get the sympathy of the court. If you hand over a certificate its one less argument the customer has not to pay.

My T&C's say we do not move furniture and if we have to it is at the customers risk (albeit we take as much care as we can do). Happy to leave and return another time.

I no longer do occupied rewires either. Too much hassle!

 

[Pete999]

Think the best way forward for getting paid on time would be to, ex[lain in your quote when payment is due, say 50% at end of first fix, the rest on completion, and allow the client to hold back 10% of the cost for a period of say 1 month for any faults or mistakes, all within the 30 day period

Touche Mon Ami, Ant.

 

[Pete999]

Think the best way forward for getting paid on time would be to, ex[lain in your quote when payment is due, say 50% at end of first fix, the rest on completion, and allow the client to hold back 10% of the cost for a period of say 1 month for any faults or mistakes, all within the 30 day period

Touche Mon Ami, Ant, think my sausage fingers are getting worse, still no excuses, if you can't take criticism then don't dish it out, that's for me.

 

[Toneyz]

Touche Mon Ami, Ant, think my sausage fingers are getting worse, still no excuses, if you can't take criticism then don't dish it out, that's for me.

You dished it out first Those in glass houses and all that.

 

[Pete999]

You dished it out first Those in glass houses and all that.

Hence my reply Ant Touche Mon Ami translation serves me right for saying your spelling was wrong, my Friend. Crikey no offence meant Mate.

 

[MG201]

If Any doubts pay using a credit card then u have full insurance