Discuss Changing original 32Amp contactors for solid state relays? in the Electric Underfloor Heating Wiring area at ElectriciansForums.net

What is that black bar along the top of the 5 cbs? It looks like it connects together the top five terminals and is supplied by 3 white wires from under the disconnector connected to its terminals N, L1 and L2.

And a thin Blue (neutral) connects to the underneath terminal of the second from right cb which seems odd to me.

Could you point out to me the main neutral entering and being distributed please?

Are those five cbs double pole types?

Where did you measure those voltages you mentioned in #10?
 
ok adding some original photos here of the previous original wiring.
[automerge]1587564362[/automerge]
What is that black bar along the top of the 5 cbs? It looks like it connects together the top five terminals and is supplied by 3 white wires from under the disconnector connected to its terminals N, L1 and L2.

And a thin Blue (neutral) connects to the underneath terminal of the second from right cb which seems odd to me.

Could you point out to me the main neutral entering and being distributed please?

Where did you measure those voltages you mentioned in #10?

What is that black bar along the top of the 5 cbs? - Not sure that was original - appears to apply the power across all 5 cbs from all 3 cables as if they are all live. Yes from the 3 white wires from the main breaker.
I have the same upstairs.

That small blue wire suppliers the Live/positive to the timer.
The 3rd white cable coming into the main breaker is the one with 23v to ground. I haven't gotten my head around the 3 cable config yet. You can see they've used the small white wire from the final 20a breaker to supply the neutral for the timer.

I measure those voltages from the ground bus to the 3 main contacts on the 1st main breaker top left.

Original timer on the right was connected from the bottom outlets to each contactor. I removed the outputs as I have the sonoff now on the left.

Hope this helps. If you need more photos/details please ask.
Maybe Uruguayan standards?? I'm an expat from the UK so was odd for me.

Thanks again
 

Attachments

  • thumbnail5.jpg
    102.3 KB · Views: 19
  • thumbnail9.jpg
    102 KB · Views: 22
Last edited:
Thank you. I am being careful to understand how it is wired now. Eventually I will produce a drawing.
[automerge]1587566140[/automerge]
Could you , with great care, study your main consumer unit and establish where the group of three whites above the did connector are supplied from and post a picture. Don,t go sticking your fingers it tools inside to do this. Can you also identify the neutral for the under floor heating and what it connects to. Last take a picture of your main electricity meter(s).
 
Last edited:
ok let me try this.

The 3 white cables are wired from an identical adjacent fuse box. These are fed from an identical main breaker (did?). All in the same sequence. Other breakers to supply lights/sockets etc come from the first fuse box.

The main cable coming into the house has these 3 cables feeding into the did/breaker.
Outside we have a breaker at the front gate. The 3 red wires shown are the ones that come into the 1st main fuse box - same sequence again and then into the second box for the floor heating.

Not sure about the neutral.

I can see from the thermostats the cables from the contactors are fed onto the 1st and 2nd screws (must be live and neutral, left live, right neutral). Behind the thermostat you see the orange cables that must be leading to the floor. These do not have a floor thermostat, just air. Looks like the main white connects to the orange and the other orange to the blue. Live and neutral.

4 thermostats here. 2 from one contactor 'kitchen' must be in series, 1 for the living room, and one for the dining room.
[automerge]1587568267[/automerge]
Been studying the house for some months now. We moved in last year.
been installing cat6 through the conduits, changing all the wall sockets, adding intelligent lights switches and routers etc.

Found a lot of odd things. Don't even ask me about the main grounding of the house and pool area! All fixed now luckily.
 

Attachments

  • thumbnail10.jpg
    184.6 KB · Views: 21
  • thumbnail11jpg.jpg
    59.7 KB · Views: 20
  • thumbnail12.jpg
    68 KB · Views: 20
Last edited:
Other side of the wall. Thick Grey cable is the supply from the overhead street cables.
 

Attachments

  • IMG_20200422_122027.jpg
    82.7 KB · Views: 16
  • IMG_20200422_122000.jpg
    96.1 KB · Views: 15
  • IMG_20200422_122012.jpg
    83.6 KB · Views: 17
It must be getting late where you are. So one last photo please looking up underneath the meters to see the individual wires going into it. Then I will leave you be until tomorrow. I am going to cook some minty lamb mince Devon pasties.


Not 'did' - meant to type disconnector or main breaker if you prefer.

Where are you in Uruguay? I am in London.
 
Sounds tasty. Miss many things from the UK.
We're 4 hours behind the UK so on my lunch break now. Work remotely here.
I live in Barra de Carrasco, Canelones. Just outside Montevideo.
Tricky to take photos as the meter is in a big sealed box with a small window just big enough to get my hand in.

Bon Appétit or buen provecho.
Regards
 

Attachments

  • IMG_20200422_124811.jpg
    60.9 KB · Views: 18
  • IMG_20200422_124813.jpg
    103.2 KB · Views: 26
Good morning. I will start to produce some drawings today. First though please tell me the colours of the wires in the thick supply cable under the meter.

From the meter box it looks like 3 reds head out to your home and no other wires - is this correct? What colours do they connect to at the meter? If you cannot say then please make a drawing for me.

There is also a terminal schematic on the plastic cover over the meter terminals which I cannot see completely - could you draw or photo it and mark up where the wires of the supply and the 3 reds connect to?
 
Observations 1

a. If one studies Drawing 1 attached, one can observe that through the 4 pole disconnector (top left) and then the 3 white wires to above the 5 circuit breakers all the 3 white wires top left are joined together by the black busbar. This means these three white wires top left cannot be L1, L2 and N because a short circuit would have occurred rupturing a fuse or tripping a circuit breaker external to this enclosure. If a short circuit has not happened then they more likely to be of the same potential ie: a line or a neutral. The N, L1, L2 and L3 markings on the disconnector are to inform how it should be connected to such a supply if presented to it.

b. Studying further, one can readily see that each of the 2 wire digital power meters are connected across a 20A circuit breaker - this is incorrect. When the circuit breaker is closed the input to the power meter is short circuited and will not read any power consumption. In addition, the power meter requires an L and N at its input where only an L or N (yet to be confirmed) has actually been connected. I note the meters are reading zero.

c. The output side of the power meter connects to the input of a contactor by the blue and white wires and then from the output of each contactor to the floor heating elements ( I assume at this stage). Because only an L or an N (yet to be confirmed) is provided at the input to each contactor then no supply voltage will ever be connected across the elements - therefore they will not heat up. I suspect then that the underfloor heating system does not work at all at the moment.

d. The timer, albeit now redundant, still has two wires to it presumably intended as its supply - blue and white. Since these are derived wrongly from the two circuit breakers on the far right whose inputs are connected together by the black busbar there will be no voltage supply applied to the timer - it will not function.

e. From d), since the wifi switch has been tapped off the input to the timer it too has not voltage supply and will not function.

f. it would be impossible to measure with respect to earth the three voltages 230, 209 and 23V at the input terminals to the disconnector while it was closed because as mentioned when the disconnector is closed all the two sets of 3 white wires are at the same potential because of the black busbar.

It looks to me then that the wiring for the UFH was wrong from the very start or changes have been made which have resulted in a completely incorrect arrangement. Do you know the history of the UFH - did it ever work?
 

Attachments

  • drawing1.png
    47.9 KB · Views: 19

Reply to Changing original 32Amp contactors for solid state relays? in the Electric Underfloor Heating Wiring area at ElectriciansForums.net

Similar Threads

Hi All; I have a flat with 6 areas warmed via underfloor heating. Each of the areas are controlled by its own thermostat Microline Ultra-Thin...
Replies
11
Views
5K
J
Hello all I have been sent here from Tilersforum so hopefully posting in the right place! I bought some Heatmiser 12v Network Thermostats and...
Replies
7
Views
3K
ik_cw
I

OFFICIAL SPONSORS

Electrical Goods - Electrical Tools - Brand Names Electrician Courses Green Electrical Goods PCB Way Electrical Goods - Electrical Tools - Brand Names Pushfit Wire Connectors Electric Underfloor Heating Electrician Courses
These Official Forum Sponsors May Provide Discounts to Regular Forum Members - If you would like to sponsor us then CLICK HERE and post a thread with who you are, and we'll send you some stats etc

YOUR Unread Posts

This website was designed, optimised and is hosted by untold.media Operating under the name Untold Media since 2001.
Back
Top
AdBlock Detected

We get it, advertisements are annoying!

Sure, ad-blocking software does a great job at blocking ads, but it also blocks useful features of our website. For the best site experience please disable your AdBlocker.

I've Disabled AdBlock