Electrical Work?

[KJJ1971]

Hi,

I changed jobs half way through my final year of my Electrical Installation course back in 2001. Unfortunately, my new job meant I worked unsociable hours, which meant I wasn't able to qualify as I failed in attendance.

I have however carried out many successful electrical installations from additional lights / sockets, consumer unit changes to complete rewires, all of which passed test & inspection by a qualified electrician.

My question is:
I need to change a consumer unit in a flat I rent out and my tenant is questioning the legality of me doing the work, regardless of being tested by a qualified electrician. Am I allowed to do this?

Thanks, Keith

 

[Vortigern]

The electrician you cite, does he have third party notification competency under the scheme he is with? Assuming he does then I cannot see a problem with that. The requirements are that he specifies the equipment and inspects and tests at various stages of the work and finally issue a third party notice which is usually a little bit different to the normal certificate for this work. The scheme has to be notified and approve the third party notification. If this does not happen you will leave yourself/the electrician open to liability in the event proper procedure has not been followed and any damage/harm results from poor or negligent workmanship or equipment use. It might also be sage to advise your insurers and get their view on the matter to ensure you will not invalidate your insurance.

 

[KJJ1971]

The electrician you cite, does he have third party notification competency under the scheme he is with? Assuming he does then I cannot see a problem with that. The requirements are that he specifies the equipment and inspects and tests at various stages of the work and finally issue a third party notice which is usually a little bit different to the normal certificate for this work. The scheme has to be notified and approve the third party notification. If this does not happen you will leave yourself/the electrician open to liability in the event proper procedure has not been followed and any damage/harm results from poor or negligent workmanship or equipment use. It might also be sage to advise your insurers and get their view on the matter to ensure you will not invalidate your insurance.

Hi Vortigern,

I am confident in my work, so can I change the consumer unit one day and have a qualified electrician test the following day?

 

[SJD]

I am confident in my work, so can I change the consumer unit one day and have a qualified electrician test the following day?

With a consumer unit change, if you are adding RCD protection, you really need to test things like insulation resistance before you connect the circuits to the new unit. Otherwise, how do you know it is not going to cause problematic tripping after you've left?

 

[Dustydazzler]

Yes a qualified (I hate that word) can sign off your work for you so long as this is done straight after you do the job and not 6 years later

 

[Vortigern]

I can see you are confident in your work. I have just outlined what needs to be done by an accredited third party electrician. That is the key part. As I say he would have to specify equipment which may involve SPD and or AFDD as well as RCD and be able to test. I am a third party accredited electrician and the scheme I am with and others I have been with subject this process to very close scrutiny. And as I said, insurers???

 

[Vortigern]

qualified (I hate that word)

but, but but it's in your statement thing below your post?

 

[Deleted account]

The whole installation needs to be tested prior to re energising the board. third party notification gets tricky when doing a board change.

can you leave the board isolated until your sparkies tests the circuits. Probably not.

id say a board change is not possible with third party notification.

basically your sparkies will have to undo all your conductors in the board in order to test. Basically undoing what you have done. I can’t see how that would be financially viable.

if I was your Tennant I’d be concerned if some one who was not registered qualified or skilled in doing the work.

 

[MJPD29]

If I was the tenant i would be saying exactly the same thing. I cant see what you'll gain by fitting this yourself as every single connection will be removed for testing purposes. You could maybe supply the board to save yourself a few quid if your spark agrees, which again I would not unless it was the board i specified. You may be confident in your work and it may be fine, but I cant really see how you'll save any pennies on this venture.

 

[Electrics]

Hi,

I changed jobs half way through my final year of my Electrical Installation course back in 2001. Unfortunately, my new job meant I worked unsociable hours, which meant I wasn't able to qualify as I failed in attendance.

I have however carried out many successful electrical installations from additional lights / sockets, consumer unit changes to complete rewires, all of which passed test & inspection by a qualified electrician.

My question is:
I need to change a consumer unit in a flat I rent out and my tenant is questioning the legality of me doing the work, regardless of being tested by a qualified electrician. Am I allowed to do this?

Thanks, Keith

The law states that anybody can do electrical work of any kind as long as they are competent.

 

[nicebutdim]

The law states that anybody can do electrical work of any kind as long as they are competent.

I think the point here is testing requires that every connection be disconnected, tested and reconnected. As such, the spark who tests this is going to have to re-do 90% of the work involved in the board change.

 

[DPG]

The law states that anybody can do electrical work of any kind as long as they are competent.

Yes, but what about testing, certifying, and notifying?

 

[Electrics]

Yes, but what about testing, certifying, and notifying?

I don't know what the law says about those things (except for notifying which anyone can do) but was just answering his question about legality when installing.

 

[DPG]

I don't know what the law says about those things (except for notifying which anyone can do) but was just answering his question about legality when installing.

The work will need certifying and notifying. Good advice had been given by people already to be honest.

 

[Electrics]

The work will need certifying and notifying. Good advice had been given by people already to be honest.

But there is a prevalent myth that you 'need' XYZ to 'do electrical work' and you don't.

Certifying can be done by notifying building control which can be done by anyone.

You can do the lot with zero qualifications.

I just like to remind people of that because i dislike people coming out with all sorts of baloney when it comes to electrics. My father in law tried to tell me it was 'illegal' to do electrical work unless you're 'fully qualified' and that you cannot sell your house without certificates, all of which is total guff, although it doesn't stop even electricians from peddling it.

 

[Dustydazzler]

In exactly the same way you can build your own extension so long as you get the borough council to sign it off

How many university qualifications does the local builder need to build an extension ?

 

[nicebutdim]

I don't know what the law says about those things (except for notifying which anyone can do) but was just answering his question about legality when installing.

I find it's best to refrain from providing advice when knowledge is limited.

 

[DPG]

But there is a prevalent myth that you 'need' XYZ to 'do electrical work' and you don't.

Certifying can be done by notifying building control which can be done by anyone.

You can do the lot with zero qualifications.

I just like to remind people of that because i dislike people coming out with all sorts of baloney when it comes to electrics. My father in law tried to tell me it was 'illegal' to do electrical work unless you're 'fully qualified' and that you cannot sell your house without certificates, all of which is total guff, although it doesn't stop even electricians from peddling it.

I don't think your advice is helping the OP to be honest.

 

[nicebutdim]

I don't think your advice is helping the OP to be honest.

It provides a straight answer, but sometimes further qualification is prudent.

 

[Electrics]

I don't think your advice is helping the OP to be honest.

He asked if he is 'allowed' to do it so i answered. I was just making a small point and you've decided to stretch it into several posts. Just move on.

 

[DPG]

He asked if he is 'allowed' to do it so i answered. I was just making a small point and you've decided to stretch it into several posts. Just move on.

But he can't test it!!

So does he leave the tennant without electricity while he gets it tested and certs filled in?

I'm not stretching anything, I'm making a valid point.

 

[Dustydazzler]

The only way that I can see a DIY consumer unit really working out is if the DIYEr does it in an empty property and then gets an EICR done the day after (this does not get round the lack of planning permission)

BUT

That could work (not strictly correct) but better than having no testing

 

[nicebutdim]

He asked if he is 'allowed' to do it so i answered. I was just making a small point and you've decided to stretch it into several posts. Just move on.

You're allowed to drive at 200mph, but it might be considered irresponsible to advise anyone to do so without further qualification.

 

[Dustydazzler]

You're allowed to drive at 200mph, but it might be considered irresponsible to advise anyone to do so without further qualification.

Are you thou ?

If I drove at 200 miles per hour I would likely end up in jail

If I fit a fuse box at my own property I doubt the police would even smack my bum

 

[nicebutdim]

Are you thou ?

If I drove at 200 miles per hour I would likely end up in jail

If I fit a fuse box at my own property I doubt the police would even smack my bum

Only if you did so on a public road.

Like I stated, sometimes answers require further qualification.

 

[Deleted account]

The law states that anybody can do electrical work of any kind as long as they are competent.

not sure I agree with this statement.

In regard to law. Are you referring to statutory regulations or non statutory regulations.

also the term competent is no longer recognised in the regulations.
electricaly skilled is what is now required.

 

[Vortigern]

I am guessing the OP has had an EICR done as required in last years landlord requirements to provide said EICR, is that correct @KJJ1971 ? To be honest it is getting so complex now that after 45 years on the job and umpteen C&G qualies I begin to wonder if even I can change a box¬

 

[Vortigern]

The law states that anybody can do electrical work of any kind

Sorry, what "law" is that? Can you refer me to the primary source for that statement i.e. the particular chapter/statute?

 

[KJJ1971]

Wow,
Apologies for poking a preverbal hornets nest.

Everything here presented is of sound advice. I didn't realise the circuits needed testing prior to the board being changed, and as commented, if I were to change and wire in the new board, this work would have to be undone for said pre-testing, so pointless.

Oh, and just for your information I am a Mechanical, Electrical, Hydraulic and Pneumatic Engineer working in the Rail Industry. I guess you could say I know a little of everything ?

Thank you so much to everyone who has contributed in helping me, I am truly grateful.

Keith

 

[MJPD29]

Wow,
Apologies for poking a preverbal hornets nest.

Everything here presented is of sound advice. I didn't realise the circuits needed testing prior to the board being changed, and as commented, if I were to change and wire in the new board, this work would have to be undone for said pre-testing, so pointless.

Oh, and just for your information I am a Mechanical, Electrical, Hydraulic and Pneumatic Engineer working in the Rail Industry. I guess you could say I know a little of everything ?

Thank you so much to everyone who has contributed in helping me, I am truly grateful.

Keith

Impressive cv, but can you cook?

 

[KJJ1971]

Impressive cv, but can you cook?

I'm not allowed in the kitchen due to previous blunders!

 

[Gavin John Hyde]

It makes me think of a lot of british gas with the hive ev installers/ meter fitters. They put the meter fitters on an ev course and basic testing. Got them fitting ev chargers now. They did all of 5 days training for this. There is a QS somewhere who is signing off the certs. The meter guys may well have some experience of working with tails and fuses but understanding the nuances of ev charging is something im still learning after more than 150 installs. Same goes here .. experience and skills are key. The third party certification if used correctly is a good thing but has many limitations. I wouldnt want to sign off somebody elses board change as there are simply too many things that need checking. I would have to have absolute confidence in the person doing it.. ie know them, their experience and skills.

 

[Dustydazzler]

A friend of my wife who is in her late 20s is currently in the process of being employed by BG and on a BG course to install smart meters , EV chargers amongst other things and from what I understand its 2 days and then you are out in the real world. We might be catching up tonight so I might get chance to ask her what was involved and was it pass / fail , what testing she did etc etc