Found this in my 4 year old house...

[bailes1992]

I've just moved into a new house, It's a 4 year home built by a major developer. The previous couple who lived here were non-diy savvy and from speaking to them on numerous occasions the only work done on the house was decorating and flooring which they got people in to do.

Now, the house has Crabtree accessories which I personally think are unsightly and have yellowed over the last few years even through nobody has smoked in the house. So, I'm currently going around changing them out for Hager items and making a few minor alterations.

I have an external single garage. It is fed by a 6mm² T&E to a double back box in my dining room. In the back box there is a set of connectors where it joints onto a 6mm² 3 core SWA which goes into the garage. I can't see any ducts and the cable appears to be directly in the ground. While I was swapping out accessories I decided to change the blank plate on this back box and found this...
http://i.Upload the image directly to the thread.com/7LZeKwG.jpg?3
http://i.Upload the image directly to the thread.com/hY5PUL8.jpg?2


So no earthed armouring, no earthed back box and no earth tape on the black conductor of the SWA. Now I must admit I've seen a lot worse, but I'm quite annoyed that you buy a new-ish house with a copy of the EIC and come across something like this.

Now, regardless of the fact this doesn't meet BS7671 522.8.10, I thought this was downright lazy and of course I couldn't leave it as it was.

https://i.Upload the image directly to the thread.com/CtEbUX8.jpg

No my tidiest job but I managed to gland the cable off in the wall which left me with very grazed knuckles. I've used a serrated washer on the back of the SWA gland to ensure good continuity between the gland and the back box and I've obviously earthed the back box.

Now there's the issue of the hole I cut in the wall. The house is dot and dabbed so it's a simple case of cutting in a new piece of plasterboard, gluing it in with dry lining adhesive and a light skim of filler. The issue is my Wife who has said if it was such an issue, surely I should get the contractor back to fix or at least pay to fix the mess and she wants me at the bare minimum to contact the NHBC.

Now, would you just fix this yourself and leave it where it was or would you get others involved to pay for the costs of repair?

The only other interesting thing is there is a 30mA RCD in the garage despite the garage being fed from an RCD protected section of the CU in the house.

 

[suffolkspark]

I think id have just earthed the armouring at the garage end and not hashed up my wall

 

[bailes1992]

I think id have just earthed the armouring at the garage end and not hashed up my wall

I agree with you to a point but I've always been of the opinion that it's best practice to earth the SWA at the start and not the end. Ideally the SWA should be earthed at both ends which I will eventually do. My garage is being turned into a mini workshop so I will be installing a new single phase CU and installing a run of 50x50 galv trunking around the perimeter with galv conduit drops.

 

[Aurai]

I suspect it would be you versus a mighty wall of indifference. However, should you write to NHBC, I would love to know their response! This is the tip of a rather large iceberg. Thanks

 

[Dillb]

Who would NHBX be concerned about a hole you made? If you had contacted them raising your concerns then yes it would be their responsibility to make it all good, but you have made the hole.

 

[Wilko]

Unfortunately this is not a rare sight. It is a bit quicker to do it incorrectly so some folk (being polite) do it. Perhaps think about Wago style connectors to get all the earths together without being in series

 

[snowhead]

Don't waste your time contacting anyone.
They won't be interested.

Had there have been an injury they might have been.

 

[Squid]

Don't waste your time contacting anyone.
They won't be interested.

Had there have been an injury they might have been.

Get a blow torch burn around the hole, phone the developer up and say it "exploded" and blew a hole in the wall and killed the cat.

 

[FatAlan]

Presumably the contractor doing the installation did the EIC? You could flag it with which ever scheme they’re with and see if there are any SM review spots you can highlight it on. Otherwise don’t waste your time and sit back knowing that you’ve sorted it

 

[UNG]

Not worth contacting the NHBC they won't be interested unless you pay them to investigate it if they uphold your complaint your costs should be refunded by the builder.
Chance of success is minimal, looked into making a complaint some years back and research suggested the money would be better spent on the repair than the complaint after all the NHBC is owned by the buiders

 

[The Ghost]

I am afraid it is caveat emptor when purchasing a house. Any defect not picked up during a survey (you did have a survey?) may be actionable depending on what level of survey you had. However I doubt this would be covered by a survey as most take the cheapest option survey. So whatever defects you have inherited are yours to deal with.

 

[Taylortwocities]

I think id have just earthed the armouring at the garage end and not hashed up my wall

That was exactly my first thought on looking at the pic, before I saw your post!

 

[telectrix]

get the tin out.

 

[Octopus]

Its the sad reflection of what happens when unskilled people "throw" homes together .................

 

[telectrix]

i'm just waiting for lego to up their game and make their blocks 18" x 9". good insulation value and no need for bodgit the builder. all homes could then be self-build. "click and go".

 

[stevethesparks]

i'm just waiting for lego to up their game and make their blocks 18" x 9". good insulation value and no need for bodgit the builder. all homes could then be self-build. "click and go".

Trouble is you'd get home to find your home has been nicked.

 

[pirate]

Why do you lot keep doing this to me? Bringing up the problems with "new-builds"?
You KNOW I hate them!!!!
Yes, Murdoch...unskilled people throwing them up.....
Oh, I need to lie down....

 

[Taylortwocities]

Just saw a clip on the news about a brick-laying robot.
Is the writing on the wall for sparkies?

 

[westward10]

I want the word caveat banned from the forum

 

[Toneyz]

You're lucky it's 6.0mm most new builds have only 2.5, when I used to work for a company that did new houses we took the T& E outside to an IP box to convert to SWA.Although not textbook if the other end was soundly made off using gland and preferably earthnut wouldn't of worried.

 

[Octopus]

Just saw a clip on the news about a brick-laying robot.
Is the writing on the wall for sparkies?

Hum .............. not sure how a brick laying robot could wire a house

 

[ipf]

It's a disgrace, but not much to do about it, I agree.
However, I'm just wondering how big the housing estate is....and how many other examples could be found with something similar.....now that COULD be interesting and maybe stir something up with a major housing developer.

 

[Taylortwocities]

Hum .............. not sure how a brick laying robot could wire a house

5 week training course

Simples!

 

[Octopus]

5 week training course

That's probably 5 weeks more than a labourer on a site running cables has had

 

[ipf]

Hum .............. not sure how a brick laying robot could wire a house

........Maintenance sparks, though ....for when they get fooked up and smothered in wet mortar by the brickies...?

 

[pirate]

I want the word caveat banned from the forum

Just substitute a shorter version...Cava!
Now, where is my glass?

 

[Wilko]

It's a disgrace, but not much to do about it, I agree.
However, I'm just wondering how big the housing estate is....and how many other examples could be found with something similar.....now that COULD be interesting and maybe stir something up with a major housing developer.

Could be quite common in that street

 

[Rpa07]

As all big developments have the same crews working the different trades, each house will be as good or as bad as the effort and professionalism the crews apply.
If they are slapdash I imagine that the first (practice) house and the last (bored now) house could be below par!
Just my opinion on recent works in a 90s Bristol development that had no creativity when it came to the lighting radial for upstairs - it looked DIY. It had never been touched from purchase.
Taking pride may take a little longer but worth the investment especially with people spending over 1/4 million on houses these days.

 

[bailes1992]

Unfortunately this is not a rare sight. It is a bit quicker to do it incorrectly so some folk (being polite) do it. Perhaps think about Wago style connectors to get all the earths together without being in series

I'm a huge fan of wago connectors, unfortunately the connectors I own only go upto 4mm so no good in this case. Also, a lot of my tools and gear went to my Fathers garage before I moved and I've yet to collect it so I didn't have any cable when I started this job last night!

Instead of cutting the earth before terminating it in the back box I just bent it over itself tightly, should either termination come loose I will still have an earth on the other end.
https://i.Upload the image directly to the thread.com/mPnaqXm.jpg?1

Presumably the contractor doing the installation did the EIC? You could flag it with which ever scheme they’re with and see if there are any SM review spots you can highlight it on. Otherwise don’t waste your time and sit back knowing that you’ve sorted it

Funny you should mention that. The company I work for had a visit from out NIC rep a few weeks ago and I was chatting to him about moving and he told me the company who did the install on our estate and said he'd not long had a visit with them. Might be worth giving him a call. I suspect the entire house of 250 houses is the same.

You're lucky it's 6.0mm most new builds have only 2.5, when I used to work for a company that did new houses we took the T& E outside to an IP box to convert to SWA.Although not textbook if the other end was soundly made off using gland and preferably earthnut wouldn't of worried.

I was quite surprised that it was 6mm². Prior to moving I was considering my options for putting a larger supply into the garage assuming it was going to be a 13A spur off the house ring final. I'm planning on replacing the current Wylex split board with a Hager board and individual RCBO's. Pending a cable calc I'm going to look into upgrading the circuit to 40A, obviously the current 32A connector blocks won't suffice so I need to look into something else, possibly just a set of 6mm² through crimps.

I popped out to the garage earlier and took a good look at the termination the other end. No better and the SWA not earthed that end either!
https://i.Upload the image directly to the thread.com/5kuJ9zO.jpg?1
https://i.Upload the image directly to the thread.com/VS8eiDP.jpg?1

I went luminaire shopping with my Missus yesterday and bought a few lights for the living room, dining room and hall. Changing them all over today and every single light had it's loop in a connector block taped to the wiring in the void above.
https://i.Upload the image directly to the thread.com/SqZJcrw.jpg?1

Wago box, wago connectors and a 64mm dry lining box to fix the lights to. Always done this and it makes future light changing an absolute doddle!
https://i.Upload the image directly to the thread.com/0a8Gjec.jpg?1
https://i.Upload the image directly to the thread.com/HwSS0Tw.jpg?1
https://i.Upload the image directly to the thread.com/ANIJJGH.jpg?1
https://i.Upload the image directly to the thread.com/8OyzcRI.jpg?1

 

[Adam W]

Its the sad reflection of what happens when unskilled people "throw" homes together .................

I'd be prepared to go one further and bet that was the work of someone who trained abroad - for some reason foreigners seem to see armour or braiding as for mechanical protection only, and don't bother terminating it.

 

[Dave OCD]

@bailes1992 - You might find these handy in future mate, take 6mm comfortably and rated at 41 amps.
3-Way Push-Wire Connector 773 Series Pack of 50 | Cable Connectors | NoLinkingToThis - https://www.googleadservices.com/pagead/aclk?sa=L&ai=DChcSEwjP4rjOmYjaAhVBnO0KHcQZDXQYABANGgJkZw&ohost=www.google.co.uk&cid=CAASE-RowZnfr13rh1Q3fwXwSkB5CtQ&sig=AOD64_0jgKAxqgegeOMMrFKKtc6Ea5h37w&ctype=46&q=&ved=0ahUKEwjnybTOmYjaAhVCqaQKHVbcDd8Q9aACCDI&adurl=

 

[telectrix]

wago do 6.0mm connectors 3 port only. rated 41A.

3-Way Push-Wire Connector 773 Series Pack of 50 | Cable Connectors | NoLinkingToThis - https://www.NoLinkingToThis/p/3-way-push-wire-connector-773-series-pack-of-50/25805?tc=BA3&ds_kid=92700019931970099&ds_rl=1248181&ds_rl=1245250&ds_rl=1249484&gclid=Cj0KCQjwkd3VBRDzARIsAAdGzMAmifcVOOH2UezHZp8lKJMJIz6zthX1IZrwTRzmcpUfuWZF6CvppQoaAnD-EALw_wcB&gclsrc=aw.ds&dclid=CN3OkbqbiNoCFTMj0wodiwQHLQ

 

[Dave OCD]

Ha - see post 31 Tel.

 

[telectrix]

yeh. you were quicker, but my post had a link.your's did not.

 

[Dave OCD]

It did you know !

 

[telectrix]

well it ain't there now. we need sherlock holmes. the case of the missing link ( and before you say it, i am not the missing link. piltdown man was not my grandfather ).

 

[Dave OCD]

Are you sure Tel, I can see it as plain as day, have you been on the beer ?

 

[bailes1992]

Cheers guys! Will definitely have to stock up on them.

Next weekend I have to rip out the sink in the utility room to make room for a tumble dryer. I was hoping buying a new-ish house would mean less work for me!

 

[telectrix]

Are you sure Tel, I can see it as plain as day, have you been on the beer ?

copied and pasted yourpost:
@bailes1992 - You might find these handy in future mate, take 6mm comfortably and rated at 41 amps.

 

[Dave OCD]

But I can see the link I attached on my screen !

 

[telectrix]

we need a poll. all members vote whether or not you can see the link.

 

[Dave OCD]

1 vote here for YES

 

[telectrix]

i voteNO. so it's even stevens, scousers 1. pasty munchers 1.

 

[Dave OCD]

I vote yes again , 2-1. If it's any consolation Tel my youngest son and me are big LFC fans.

 

[telectrix]

I vote yes again , 2-1. If it's any consolation Tel my youngest son and me are big LFC fans.

i'd not call that consolation, just good sense.

 

[Dave OCD]

 

[Midwest]

I went luminaire shopping with my Missus yesterday and bought a few lights for the living room, dining room and hall. Changing them all over today and every single light had it's loop in a connector block taped to the wiring in the void above.


Wago box, wago connectors and a 64mm dry lining box to fix the lights to. Always done this and it makes future light changing an absolute doddle!
https://i.Upload the image directly to the thread.com/0a8Gjec.jpg?1
https://i.Upload the image directly to the thread.com/HwSS0Tw.jpg?1

I and others use the slightly smaller Click Flow 102C connector, and I ain't providing no missing link!

 

[Paul Ellis]

Could somebody tell me why why the back box would need earthed in this situation?

 

[Toneyz]

Usually, the metal back box is earthed via the screws in contact with the earthed metal eyelid screw holes of a socket.In this situation, a plastic blank plate is fitted therefore there is no earthing of the back box via the screws and needs an earth fly lead.

 

[pirate]

Navy solution...
if it moves, grease it
if it doesn't, paint it
and everything else...earth it

has anyone else noticed the high level of sediment in Tesco's Duoro?
(Tried to upload a pic, but "an error occurred"...doh!)