3 way gang switch Led bulb still lights when switched off.

[DennisM]

Hope someone can help, went to replace sensor bulbs (incandescent) with leds when the bulbs went off or switched off they stayed on but with a small glow. I disconnected feed to utility light and lights went off no problem reconnected problem started. Is there a way to fix this problem, thanks for any advice.

 

[buzzlightyear]

Are you saying you replaced the bulb to led and when you put in the bulb knocked off the mcb ?

 

[SparkyChick]

First off the middle switch doesn't appear to be doing anything, so assuming it was working and was actually turning something on and off, you've changed something.

If the sensor lights don't have a neutral connection on the sensor, they will be passing a small current through the sensor to drive the electronics. This is often enough to make LED bulbs glow.

 

[DennisM]

Are you saying you replaced the bulb to led and when you put in the bulb knocked off the mcb ?

Replaced incandescent bulbs with leds, put old bulbs back in worked as before Didn't knock anything off nothing tripped.

 

[buzzlightyear]

Looking at those tails and the cpc joined together with other colours i think some thing amiss on that switch and are there any cpc to that back box .
Looks lile a diy job .
op was that wiring done by a spark ?

 

[DennisM]

First off the middle switch doesn't appear to be doing anything, so assuming it was working and was actually turning something on and off, you've changed something.

If the sensor lights don't have a neutral connection on the sensor, they will be passing a small current through the sensor to drive the electronics. This is often enough to make LED bulbs glow.

Middle switch not in use just has the live coming in and feed to other switches

 

[DennisM]

Looking at those tails and the cpc joined together i think some thing amiss on that switch and are there any cpc to that back box .
Looks lile a diy job .
op was that wiring done by a spark ?

There is an earth wired to back of box, done by a spark, the sensor switch runs in a loop with a switch from another room but that didn't effect the set up

 

[Wilko]

Hi - on the g/y for a moment - I see there's one in the plaster on the bottom of the backbox and one in the bundle to the left. Is there a reason these are not connected together?

 

[buzzlightyear]

I was think that me self , before i had lost contact with earth for a little Wyle.

 

[littlespark]

The bundle on the left look like a spare circuit, maybe going to a light that isn’t there anymore. Possibly what the middle switch once did.
There’s a cpc to the back of the box, so that’s fine.
The circuits are wired in 6181y single sheathed cables (no cpc, like meter tails but much smaller) so I suspect a joint box somewhere.

Possible the LED lamps are receiving just enough current to light up through the PIR. There may be specs on the PIR itself to what load is suitable for it. LEDs might just be too low.

 

[DennisM]

The bundle on the left look like a spare circuit, maybe going to a light that isn’t there anymore. Possibly what the middle switch once did.
There’s a cpc to the back of the box, so that’s fine.
The circuits are wired in 6181y single sheathed cables (no cpc, like meter tails but much smaller) so I suspect a joint box somewhere.

Possible the LED lamps are receiving just enough current to light up through the PIR. There may be specs on the PIR itself to what load is suitable for it. LEDs might just be too low.

Yes bundle on left never used (outside lights). May call someone In.

 

[littlespark]

That’s a good idea, Dennis... but be aware, make sure you get a recommended tradesman and not some cowboy that’s going to spend hours tracing cables unnecasseraly. If it works as it should with a regular lamp, but not with LED, then it’s an issue with the LED /PIR combo.

 

[DennisM]

That’s a good idea, Dennis... but be aware, make sure you get a recommended tradesman and not some cowboy that’s going to spend hours tracing cables unnecasseraly. If it works as it should with a regular lamp, but not with LED, then it’s an issue with the LED /PIR combo.

Thanks very much

 

[The Ghost]

If you do call someone in get them to tidy up those cables there are too many cables in there for the size of the box. Where are the lugs to screw the light in to? And the live into the unused gang could go to one of the used switches and a link across to get rid of at least one cable as well as cutting back the unused outside lights.

 

[GeorgeCooke]

Ignoring all the wiring in the switch (which I assume you have not altered), this is a common problem with LEDs and is due to induction between a line and switched live cable. The usual fix is to put a snubber (capacitor and resistor in series) across the LED.

https://uk.farnell.com/roxburgh/xe1202/rc-network-250v-0-2uf-120r-pcb/dp/2336099?st=snubber

 

[GeorgeCooke]

Ignoring all the wiring in the switch (which I assume you have not altered), this is a common problem with LEDs and is due to induction between a line and switched live cable. The usual fix is to put a snubber (capacitor and resistor in series) across the LED.

https://uk.farnell.com/roxburgh/xe1202/rc-network-250v-0-2uf-120r-pcb/dp/2336099?st=snubber

 

[GeorgeCooke]

Ignoring all the wiring in the switch (which I assume you have not altered), this is a common problem with LEDs and is due to induction between a line and switched live cable. The usual fix is to put a snubber (capacitor and resistor in series) across the LED.

https://uk.farnell.com/roxburgh/xe1202/rc-network-250v-0-2uf-120r-pcb/dp/2336099?st=snubber

 

[GeorgeCooke]

Ignoring all the wiring in the switch (which I assume you have not altered), this is a common problem with LEDs and is due to induction between a line and switched live cable. The usual fix is to put a snubber (capacitor and resistor in series) across the LED.

https://uk.farnell.com/roxburgh/xe1202/rc-network-250v-0-2uf-120r-pcb/dp/2336099?st=snubber
all the wiring in the switch (which I assume you have not altered), this is a common problem with LEDs and is due to induction between a line and switched live cable. The usual fix is to put a snubber (capacitor and resistor in series) across the LED.

 

[GeorgeCooke]

Ignoring all the wiring in the switch (which I assume you have not altered), this is a common problem with LEDs and is due to induction between a line and switched live cable. The usual fix is to put a snubber (capacitor and resistor in series) across the LED.

https://uk.farnell.com/roxburgh/xe1202/rc-network-250v-0-2uf-120r-pcb/dp/2336099?st=snubber
all the wiring in the switch (which I assume you have not altered), this is a common problem with LEDs and is due to induction between a line and switched live cable. The usual fix is to put a snubber (capacitor and resistor in series) across the LED.

 

[GeorgeCooke]

Ignoring all the wiring in the switch (which I assume you have not altered), this is a common problem with LEDs and is due to induction between a line and switched live cable. The usual fix is to put a snubber (capacitor and resistor in series) across the LED.

https://uk.farnell.com/roxburgh/xe1202/rc-network-250v-0-2uf-120r-pcb/dp/2336099?st=snubber
all the wiring in the switch (which I assume you have not altered), this is a common problem with LEDs and is due to induction between a line and switched live cable. The usual fix is to put a snubber (capacitor and resistor in series) across the LED.

 

[GeorgeCooke]

Ignoring all the wiring in the switch (which I assume you have not altered), this is a common problem with LEDs and is due to induction between a line and switched live cable. The usual fix is to put a snubber (capacitor and resistor in series) across the LED.

https://uk.farnell.com/roxburgh/xe1202/rc-network-250v-0-2uf-120r-pcb/dp/2336099?st=snubber

 

[GeorgeCooke]

Ignoring all the wiring in the switch (which I assume you have not altered), this is a common problem with LEDs and is due to induction between a line and switched live cable. The usual fix is to put a snubber (capacitor and resistor in series) across the LED.

https://uk.farnell.com/roxburgh/xe1202/rc-network-250v-0-2uf-120r-pcb/dp/2336099?st=snubber

 

[littlespark]

What are you trying to say, @GeorgeCooke ?
I think a mod has some duplicate posts to delete.


I’ve got an LED fitting to look at after Xmas in a neighbours house, and this thread has the same problem:
It’s on the stair landing so is controlled through a 2 way circuit. 2 switches. The problem is that the light stays on dim when it should be off, but only when the switches are in a certain configuration. Ie
Switch 1 off, switch 2 off..... light off
Switch 1 off, switch 2 on..... light on
Switch 1 on, switch 2 off..... light on
Switch 1 on, switch 2 on..... light dimly on(should be off)

So likely an induced feed onto one of the strappers in the 3 core+ earth cable. (Newish build, I know it’s wired in flat grey)

I might get one of those snubbers and see if it works.