Has wire marking changed - or what do you use.

[SteveG]

When I was an apprentice sparky back in the 1970's and we were rewiring houses or first fixing new houses/flats, I was taught a marking method for T&E that seemed to be common but undocumented throughout the industry.
I'm talking specifically about lighting circuits and the loop-in system.

At the ceiling rose there would be (normally) 3 twin cables. The L&N in and out would have a notch or bite taken out on the sheathing on the red side (brown now I know) and the switch wire would have a single line across it done by pliers. If there was a second light on the same switch this would have an X on it done by pliers.
At the switch; if it was a 2 way there would be 1 twin from the light and a 3 core+e (red/yellow/blue) between the 2 way switches.
The connections at the 2 way confused me at the time as to how they worked (but they did) I only worked it out much later.
The yellow would go in the common terminal and the 2 reds in SW1 and the blue and black in SW2 (and yellow in the common at the other switch.

Not done any house wiring in 35 years. Is it still done like this?

 

[Pete999]

Cor that brings back memories Steve

 

[telectrix]

my method has always been XX for the incoming cable, X for the outgoing, nick for switch, line across for s/l out.

 

[ruston]

hing

Not done any house wiring in 35 years. Is it still done like this?

I still use the notching , and the rest is pretty much the same, only the colours have been changed to protect the innocent.
I use x for switch though , and 1 and 2 notches for in and out ,3 for your other lamp if there is one .
But that is just me for some order of running.

 

[telectrix]

if i'm in a good mood, i mark with a sharpie. i'm one of the few sparks who can write legibly.

 

[hightower]

Being new to the game, I've always just used a sharpie:

IN
OUT
SWITCH

Easy enough

 

[ruston]

if i'm in a good mood, i mark with a sharpie. i'm one of the few sparks who can write legibly.

I do too , when I can find them.

 

[telectrix]

i've also got an alternative code which i use if i don't like the guy who gets the 2nd fix.

 

[Risteard]

Used to put two lines on strappers. (Here 3-core isn't generally used for two-way - a twin brown is used for strappers.) Also don't need to mark switch drop as twin brown. Therefore also don't need to mark permanent (although taking a nick out of the phase side of the cable is quite common).

 

[Risteard]

I do too , when I can find them.

LOL. An overeager painter can ruin that one for you though...

 

[telectrix]

they soon learn the error of their ways after you scribble graffiti on their newly painted walls though.

 

[SteveG]

What about the plasterers that like to fold your wires (if you don't) right into the sockets and than completely skim over them leaving you to try find them or even forget one.

 

[ruston]

What about the plasterers that like to fold your wires (if you don't) right into the sockets and than completely skim over them leaving you to try find them or even forget one.

LOL. An ov

They have still been brain removed too, and are continuing the tradition.
A hammer around the sides redresses the balance a bit.

 

[andyb]

I basicly used the same as the op apart from the l/n. I just never marked these at all. So the common 3 plate would have 2 unmarked cables and one with a line for the switch drop. A cross for another light.
Why do you need to know live in live out when second fixing?

 

[SteveG]

Why do you need to know live in live out when second fixing?

Belt and braces really. But if you bare all three off and forget which is which you have the indents on the wires to give you a clue.

 

[ackbarthestar]

I moved on from side cutters to a quill pen and Gothic script....it scares the life out of the plasterers

 

[Risteard]

Why do you need to know live in live out when second fixing?

My thoughts exactly. It is of no interest to me which is which!

 

[ruston]

Belt and braces really. But if you bare all three off and forget which is which you have the indents on the wires to give you a clue.

Same here , for the odd time the

Same here really , for the odd time they have been damaged or disappeared owing to other trades.
Habit really , it only takes a minute .

 

[telectrix]

I basicly used the same as the op apart from the l/n. I just never marked these at all. So the common 3 plate would have 2 unmarked cables and one with a line for the switch drop. A cross for another light.
Why do you need to know live in live out when second fixing?

sometimes you need to 2nd fix when some of the fittings are not on site, so knowing which is feed in and feed out can be useful if you need to get part of the lighting up and running.

 

[Adie moore]

similar side cutters method here, although loop in and loop out get a straight snip up the middle and anything else gets a number of indents across the cable that corresponds to the other end of the cable.

 

[LankyWill]

Ive always just marked the switch wire with a nick. Dont see the need to mark the feeds up, and as for the sharpie, its a complete waste of time. After the pill head painters slapped a full bucket of matt white on yer cables yer F****D.

 

[Adam W]

Everyone I've met who uses a system of notches swears blind that their system is the industry standard.
It is not.
It may have been what they were taught but it wasn't what anyone else was taught.
There is no system of notches made reference to in any official documentation and it isn't taught in colleges, it's down to personal preference and only works if everyone working on the job knows the system.

I'm one of the ones who writes on the sheath what it does - if you've got cables with 'feed', 'S/L', 'strappers' etc on them then it's clear to anyone what the cables are for. Sure the decorators could paint over them, or the wood butchers could drill into them, or the spreads could butter over the boxes, but you could go on forever like that.

 

[Deleted member 93172]

Just a nick on the switch wire, and if there is a looped light a cross will do for me.

 

[Marshall Elec]

I do too , when I can find them.

I buy them whenever they are on offer. I never seem to have any though and usually find them somewhere near where my Mrs has been working

 

[Marshall Elec]

2 notches on a switch wire and just one for a follow on.

 

[Midwest]

What about the plasterers that like to fold your wires (if you don't) right into the sockets and than completely skim over them leaving you to try find them or even forget one.

Bit like this;

In was plastered over circa 1966, and I discovered it still live in 2015!

 

[D00DY_T00DY]

LOOP IN/LOOP OUT, SW/W, 2-WAY HALL etc with a sharpie

 

[Wilko]

Bit like this;
View attachment 33425 View attachment 33426
In was plastered over circa 1966, and I discovered it still live in 2015!

Fantastic !
I had one at mine that I only found because the back box rusted and blew out the plaster. House was built early 70s and I reckon it never saw action. Then I had the rising damp to fix as well

 

[Charlie_]

I would leave the loop blank and mark sw with one line/mark across the cable, sw 2 with 2 lines and so on.. Intermediates marked with a cross and strappers 2 lines along the cable.
That was all in the olden days before I started with knx, now it's a doddle

 

[DPG]

Bit like this;
View attachment 33425 View attachment 33426
In was plastered over circa 1966, and I discovered it still live in 2015!

Does that mean the ring final was open then? Daz

 

[Midwest]

Does that mean the ring final was open then? Daz

I was doing a kitchen refurb'. The property had had a new dual rcd CU installed year or so before, and I noted that there were two socket radials, which I thought unusual for such a property. This concealed socket was the end of both radials (and would of been the 'missing link' for the RCF). Found the cable drop while I was planning the kitchen alterations. In the end I decided to stick with the two radials, and disconnected one of the legs, and made safe the other.

 

[DPG]

Nice one. Daz

 

[freddo]

Strange, we use a nick in the side for a cable to a switch, split down the middle for a cable to a load, no marking for main in/out, if there are several sets of cables such as at a 2gang switch, a horizontal mark note which cables go together. Thermostat and smoke alarm cables get an X. I don't use a pen as the messy painters paint all over the cables.

 

[Deleted member 93172]

If I do mark cables with a sharpie, I always cover the writing with tape to protect the markings.