Oh dear, this is really quite shocking!

[Engineer54]

I don't hate the players Trev. A lot of these guys I guess were sold amazing stories of mega bucks, working for yourself etc from really good salesmen. Who can blame them TBH.

ME!!

What are you saying here, that all these jokers didn't have a clue about not being able to be competent after completing just a 17 day/5 Week course?? Do me a favour, i put equal blame on these guy's as i do the training centres. Both know/knew this is a backdoor loophole, ...End Of!! (created by the very organisations that were originally put in place to promote safety and to prove the competency of it's applicants working in the domestic sector)


We've heard ''All'' the excuses these people come out with on here, as to why they can't possibly follow any of the correct procedures or courses to becoming an electrician....

 

[davesparks]

As well as sending the letter to ELECSA who will ignore it and do nothing as long as the bodger pays his subs you should forward it to the DCLG and more specifically mr Clive Betts MP who is now on our side in fighting this nonsense.

 

[UNG]

How about a letter to some of the trade press to highlight this issue this may only be one installation but who knows how many others there are out there waiting to be found around the country

 

[Badged01]

How about a letter to some of the trade press to highlight this issue .....

Not too sure that they aren't in the pocket of the schemes!

 

[Engineer54]

As well as sending the letter to ELECSA who will ignore it and do nothing as long as the bodger pays his subs you should forward it to the DCLG and more specifically mr Clive Betts MP who is now on our side in fighting this nonsense.

I wouldn't be putting too much faith in Mr Clive Betts just yet, he is a politician at the end of the day and can change his allegiances at the drop of a hat, especially if it looks like it could affect him or his political career... Give the guy time to ''Prove'' his commitment, don't just assume commitment from his spoken/written words.... Words are the tools of his trade, that he uses to best advantage on a daily basis!! ...lol!!

 

[GMES]

I don't hate the players Trev. A lot of these guys I guess were sold amazing stories of mega bucks, working for yourself etc from really good salesmen. Who can blame them TBH.

The only thing I can say about that is you don't have to be a farmer to know when your looking at a Pig

 

[TheHUNTED]

ME!!

What are you saying here, that all these jokers didn't have a clue about not being able to be competent after completing just a 17 day/5 Week course?? Do me a favour, i put equal blame on these guy's as i do the training centres. Both know/knew this is a backdoor loophole, ...End Of!! (created by the very organisations that were originally put in place to promote safety and to prove the competency of it's applicants working in the domestic sector)


We've heard ''All'' the excuses these people come out with on here, as to why they can't possibly follow any of the correct procedures or courses to becoming an electrician....

Yeah, but my argument still stands. People were sold these short courses on promises. The people on these courses knew they could carry out electrical works in domestic properties legally after a few weeks, practising in customers houses, making mistakes and scratching their heads as soon as something isn't straight forward. Unfortunately to Joe public there is no difference between electricians and short course Domestic Installers. In fact, the term DI may suggest it's their speciality.

I did my full apprenticeship, going to college one day a week, but the stuff I was taught at work from some of the old sparks I wouldn't get anywhere else, and probably wouldn't have now. It was also some of the best times of my life. It is wrong what's happening out there, and I for one hopes that it stops now. I would love to see the market full of apprentices but I bet currently DI out weigh apprentices by 100/1.

 

[GMES]

Hunted I am not a Bricklayer but If I did attempt to build a wall and left big gaps in it where there should be bricks, and it also zig zagged from left to right I would know it was wrong.
I would then knock it down and employ the services of a professional Bricklayer.
The Person responsible for this installation whether short course or time served, surely must be able to look at it and realise it is wholly the wrong way to do things.

 

[TheHUNTED]

I'm not defending the installers, or the companies that run the courses. Some of the work I've seen is disgusting and dangerous. Whilst these courses exist, we will encounter Electrical Trainee. These Courses need to stop, scams need to start looking after the electricians, which will never happen as it's a money making business, and as long as the cheques clear, why would they want it too.

 

[trev]

I'm not defending the installers, or the companies that run the courses. Some of the work I've seen is disgusting and dangerous. Whilst these courses exist, we will encounter Electrical Trainee. These Courses need to stop, scams need to start looking after the electricians, which will never happen as it's a money making business, and as long as the cheques clear, why would they want it too.

I'm sorry but you're wrong, as long as the schemes exist we will have these dangerous chancers kicking around and carrying out installs of this quality. The schemes will never promote the idea that people need to be properly trained, qualified and experienced as this notion will kill the goose that is laying golden eggs. This is why they need to be put out of business and there's only one way that's going to happen and that is if people (I.E. the current members) stop paying their annual subs.
I know I keep saying it but we have the power and ability to force meaningful change in the trade. If we don't do it who will?

 

[Geordie Spark]

I'm sorry but you're wrong, as long as the schemes exist we will have these dangerous chancers kicking around and carrying out installs of this quality. The schemes will never promote the idea that people need to be properly trained, qualified and experienced as this notion will kill the goose that is laying golden eggs. This is why they need to be put out of business and there's only one way that's going to happen and that is if people (I.E. the current members) stop paying their annual subs.
I know I keep saying it but we have the power and ability to force meaningful change in the trade. If we don't do it who will?

I never paid any of them and CORGI (as was back then) only got my first years sub. After that I realised it was a con and no customer ever asked if I was registered so I stopped paying them. I figured as long as I had my ACS card which was proof I was trained and competent that was good enough for me.

 

[uksparks]

Well I have done the EICR, oh dear, ohhhhh deeeeaaarrr, oooohhhhh deaaarrr, I think you are going to need to sit down before I tell you... (Plug i need to type it all up then tell you)

 

[Silly Sausage]

I look forward to it!

 

[trev]

Me too, sounds like a good one.

 

[Robotstar5]

Will I have enough bandwidth to view all volumes?

 

[Silly Sausage]

4 hours and we're still waiting!

 

[trev]

4 hours and we're still waiting!

Maybe it's a big report

 

[Silly Sausage]

Yes Trev!

 

[uksparks]

Right im just going to write a thread here and upload a few files etc, give me a few mins.... if you can wait!!

 

[dazza1981]

This better be worth it lol

 

[uksparks]

Hi,

Ok ive got hold of the originals that he has just posted to the customer, well they were copies that he has added a couple of bits in since the last copies which you saw in poor quality, just insulation resistance and correct polarity ticked.

Ok here's the certificate in better quality.



And for the report, I have just removed my header and footers from it and all client details, but the report, not handed to customer yet so if you feel anything needs adjustment let me know.

View attachment Electrical Installation Condition Report.pdf
View attachment Schedule Of Test Results.pdf
View attachment Continuation Sheet 6.pdf

Ill let you read it then ill tell you if you have missed anything, but check out a few photos below...


Unsure of the IP rating of this above shower...




Seal not fitted correctly...





No grommet example and no brown sleaving





Right im off to watch eastenders, back in a bit.

 

[Octopus]

Thats disgraceful.

Definitely write to Emma Clancy & Clive Betts.

Some thing HAS to be done.

 

[uksparks]

The OC and >200 were all meant to say >2000 on the test results as they were all open circuit.

i am sure he has just made the figures up, like the Ze for example... And PFC...

 

[Silly Sausage]

Picture 2 and TNS on his report, not much point in carrying on really!

Murdoch, Clancy won't give a ....
The customer needs to report, remember!

DON'T JOIN THESE SCHEMES.

 

[Octopus]

Picture 2 and TNS on his report, not much point in carrying on really!

Murdoch, Clancy won't give a ....
The customer needs to report, remember!

DON'T JOIN THESE SCHEMES.

Well, the schemes can try and hide behind this "excuse" but for how long?

Anyway isn't the OP going to help write the letter.........

 

[uksparks]

Glenn has kindly assisted with the letter that now just needs slight modification following today

 

[SparkyJoe]

How comes this has been hidden in the arms? or is it another thread

 

[trev]

I think it's here because the subject is potentially very sensitive. Obviously, whoever moved it would tell you better than me.

 

[Octopus]

Its been moved in here so forum sponsors the NICEIC can't see the thread!

 

[telectrix]

uk, not being picky,but you've got as couple of minor mistakes. you,ve given the main switch a fuse rating, when it's not fused, and the voltage rating is incorrect.

 

[Silly Sausage]

Its been moved in here so forum sponsors the NICEIC can't see the thread!

He was never a sponsor, twere a mistake.
Even if they did see it, they wouldn't care, ask GLENN, Phil etc who showed them this at ELEX. The customer needs to complain is their get out clause!

I PMed 'NICEIC Engineer' loads of times once to respond to a bad install that was shown on here....response....Silence!

Again, they don't give a &&&&.

DON'T PAY THEM ANY MONEY

 

[uksparks]

uk, not being picky,but you've got as couple of minor mistakes. you,ve given the main switch a fuse rating, when it's not fused, and the voltage rating is incorrect.

Sorry yes I see that, it's because I had edited the last one I did that was and forgot to remove it.

is there anything on it other than that you feel is too wrong that needs adjustment?

theres a hell of a lot wrong with the installation considering it's brand new!

 

[uksparks]

How comes this has been hidden in the arms? or is it another thread

Its been moved here as I don't particularly want the OP to see the conversation, probably best it's kept slightly out of public view.

you know what, i would sell my tools if I was him, I thought at first maybe there's just ken or two clumsy mistakes, but when you actually look it's horrendous.

forcthose of you who missed it, half the downstairs light circuit has no CPC continuity to the MET, ecerything visible was correctly connected and no junction boxes anywhere so I'm guessing the break or whatever is causing it is hidden on a wall somewhere.

 

[uksparks]

The other thing, the upstairs sockets, it's a radial (apparently) , there's seven sockets in total upstairs, but 4 of them are spurs... Or appear to be. There's no junction boxes anywhere and all sockets oybgave two cables so none if them are spurred off a socket.

am I not right in thinking 4 out of 7 sockets being spurs on a radial us raking the pee and not allowed?

 

[Octopus]

The other thing, the upstairs sockets, it's a radial (apparently) , there's seven sockets in total upstairs, but 4 of them are spurs... Or appear to be. There's no junction boxes anywhere and all sockets oybgave two cables so none if them are spurred off a socket.

am I not right in thinking 4 out of 7 sockets being spurs on a radial us raking the pee and not allowed?

As a radial additions can be made at any point! That said on a rewire that shouldn't happen!

 

[uksparks]

Another thing, on the 5x RCD test, theres no way what he has put was correct because I tested it numerous times and it kept giving me approx the same which is a lot less that he put, I bet he made it up.

 

[uksparks]

As a radial additions can be made at any point! That said on a rewire that shouldn't happen!

I did just look in the BGB and yes thats correct, but regardless its still crap IMHO plus where the heck are they all connected? Seems a bit dodgy to me.

 

[uksparks]

You know, its unacceptable making them all spurs because if you can get one sodding cable to the socket you can get two, there's just no damn excuse!

 

[uksparks]

uk, not being picky,but you've got as couple of minor mistakes. you,ve given the main switch a fuse rating, when it's not fused, and the voltage rating is incorrect.

The voltage rating, its 240v isn't it? Or am i being thick?

 

[telectrix]

i might be wrong, but most are rated (i.e. max. voltage ) at 400V.