Best Consumer unit for home

[James]

I try to keep out of Domestic work but I have a problem at home.

Currently I have a wylex fuse board with re-wire fuses.
they are great because nuisance tripping never happens!!

however, it is an overhead TT supply and this is covered by a 30mA non delay rcd that covers the whole house.
this evening the rcd tripped and the wife got mad at me.
because in her mind being married to an electrician means that our electricity should be of a better quality than everybody else's and one stupid trip switch shouldn't turn everything off.

now no amount of waffle and bull faeces including flux capacitor integration into a 100 year old house is going to persuade her that it cant be done so I am now sadly looking into doing a job that is 10 years overdue.

If I am going to do it, I am going to do it properly so what are your recommendations for domestic consumer units?
may as well have all the mod cons in it SPD, RCBO, time delay rcd incomer.
are there any other bells, whistles or collections of random letters i should be thinking about?

might need a pen fault detector as i think in future they may upgrade the supply and i have a car charger.

 

[LukeD]

Depends.... Do a GOOD EICR first and see if the wiring will cause a RCBO board issues ... if so, stick on a twin RCD and hope for the best or do a full rewire .God know how many "stolen " neutrals and earth etc you have?

 

[James]

I have no continuity between N and E
global IR is good
I have already decided to replace it, any issues found when doing so will be rectified.
so really i am looking to find what the best gear is.
my normal go to for industrial is eaton but i think maybe Schneider might have a better reputation for domestic?

 

[LukeD]

Fusebox... might be most peoples answer ?

 

[James]

And before anybody tells me that i should get a registered electrician to come round and do it,
or the specification of something like this is to complex to suggest online because we think that you are about to take on a DIY project above your knowledge base.

Trust me when I tell you that i have changed several sockets and lights etc in the past and they all work fine so you have nothing to worry about ;-)

 

[SparkyChick]

I've been using Contactum, I think they are the Defenders, for a while and I've had no issues. They have nice space inside, look nice. Last one was in the summer replacing a couple of ancient Wylex 3036 boards. Plenty of device choice, if you need things like timers and such like.

I've only fitted one Schneider, Easy series, but I've worked on a few and there's just something that I can't quite put my finger on... I tried it, didn't like it and never did another one.

 

[westward10]

Crabtree Starbreaker.

 

[nicebutdim]

If it was my own house I'd go with something that guaranteed future availability for upgrades etc.

Hager or Crabtree would tick this box, along with being decent quality, but starbreaker would be top of the list - DP RCBOs ensuring no stray neutral currents give rise to angry wife and plug in busbar means no chance of having to switch the lot off if adding another circuit.


Edit: What @westward10 managed to post without the sales pitch.

 

[James]

Crabtree Starbreaker.

Glad you like them, I have one of there 3 phase boards in my workshop so the breakers would be the same as some i have in stock.

 

[James]

If it was my own house I'd go with something that guaranteed future availability for upgrades etc.

Hager or Crabtree would tick this box, along with being decent quality, but starbreaker would be top of the list - DP RCBOs ensuring no stray neutral currents give rise to angry wife and plug in busbar means no chance of having to switch the lot off if adding another circuit.


Edit: What @westward10 managed to post without the sales pitch.

ah, ok the starbreaker boards are not the same as the board i have in the workshop, that uses a more standard busbar type distribution.

 

[nicebutdim]

Are you sure it's starbreaker?

Didn't think they made 3 phase devices for the range.


Edit: answered as I was typing. Can't seem to get ahead of posts in this thread.

 

[Dustydazzler]

My own house would be the old plastic MK board I have collecting dust in the garage and use up all and any old RCBOs I have kicking about from other jobs that I can shoe horn onto the busbar

 

[nicebutdim]

this evening the rcd tripped and the wife got mad at me.
because in her mind being married to an electrician means that our electricity should be of a better quality than everybody else's and one stupid trip switch shouldn't turn everything off...

If I am going to do it, I am going to do it properly so what are your recommendations for domestic consumer units?
may as well have all the mod cons in it SPD, RCBO, time delay rcd incomer.

My own house would be the old plastic MK board I have collecting dust in the garage and use up all and any old RCBOs I have kicking about from other jobs that I can shoe horn onto the busbar

I feel a bit silly now, not having thought of that suggestion.

 

[SJD]

As mentioned by nicebutdim, if I was planning to live there long-term, I'd want something that will be supported long-term. So much though I like and routinely install Fusebox, I'd have to wonder will they be around in 10 or 20 years, or would I end up looking on eBay for spares. It is hard to know for sure of the decent brands which will survive long-term, my best guess is Hager.

 

[ipf]

Schneider acti9 3 phase is great but I'm not keen on the easy9 domestic single phase. Fusebox seems ok but it's Hager for me.
For donkeys years, I was a Wylex fan but not the latest stuff.

 

[Baddegg]

As above I like the fuse box range and fit the spd models as standard…..3 this week so far ….if I can’t get them I use contactum defender….both these balance quality against the amount people will pay in the domestic market…..but reading through I’m in agreement with the long term view and would probably stump up for Hager or Schneider in my own place when I inevitably find myself in your position @James….it won’t be long as my wife recently discovered that our “electric thingy” (not my work) doesn’t look as nice as the one I’ve just fitted in her friends place…

 

[AJshep]

I like the Electrium consumer units but the cost is still higher then others.

For my house I'd probably go for a Hager with built in SPD. The SPDs in the Hager consumer units are rated at 100amp so don't require any additional OCPD. However as it's a TT I'd be inclined to change the Main switch to a 100ma Time delayed.
Hager have recently dropped the price of their mixture SPSN miniature RCBOs to around £15 each.

 

[timhoward]

Hager have recently dropped the price of their mixture SPSN miniature RCBOs to around £15 each.

I was about to say that the benefit of Crabtree Starbreaker is they make SPSN RCBOs.
Then you wrote that; so maybe I'm wrong but I've never seen a single module SPSN RCBO from Hager, only SP+N. I know the AFDDs are SPSN.
I think I specifically asked this on here a while back and this was confirmed.

 

[ferg]

I went for Hager in mine and that is what I fit as standard.
I've fitted a few fusebox boards where cost was the primary concern and I have to say I much prefer Hager.
As above the RCBOs have come down in price lately making cost less of an issue.
When it came to changing mine I had a Fusebox and RCBOs in stock waiting for a home and I still fitted Hager.
I used to keep both brands but now I only keep Hager.
Due to my location I have to carry a fair bit of stock and have been using Hager for many years without issue.

 

[nicebutdim]

I went for Hager in mine and that is what I fit as standard.
I've fitted a few fusebox boards where cost was the primary concern and I have to say I much prefer Hager.
As above the RCBOs have come down in price lately making cost less of an issue.
When it came to changing mine I had a Fusebox and RCBOs in stock waiting for a home and I still fitted Hager.
I used to keep both brands but now I only keep Hager.
Due to my location I have to carry a fair bit of stock and have been using Hager for many years without issue.

Can you resolve the issue of whether or not Hager offer SP+N RCBOs (regardless of cost) in a single module width? My understanding was the same as @timhoward in that they don't.

For me the main selling point of Hager is the fact that backward compatibility has been maintained over many years, but would favour Starbreaker in that regard as the range also incorporates other beneficial features. I don't dislike Hager in the least, but often struggle to understand their popularity in the domestic distribution board market.

 

[ferg]

Can you resolve the issue of whether or not Hager offer SP+N RCBOs (regardless of cost) in a single module width? My understanding was the same as @timhoward in that they don't.

For me the main selling point of Hager is the fact that backward compatibility has been maintained over many years, but would favour Starbreaker in that regard as the range also incorporates other beneficial features. I don't dislike Hager in the least, but often struggle to understand their popularity in the domestic distribution board market.

I'm not 100% but I'm almost certain Timhoward is right.

It's probably a bit Milwaukee or Dewalt TBH.
For me I'm a creature of habit and as I say I have to carry a fair bit of stock so switching between brands is a pain.
Backwards compatibility is a big selling point as is the longevity of the brand, availability, build quality and appearance.
Like a lot of one man bands I've had some of my customers a very long time so I like to be confident that what I fit is going to stand the test of time and not bite me in the backside a few years down the line.

 

[AJshep]

Your right after looking they are only Single pole !!

 

[timhoward]

Maybe I over think this, and maybe less relevant in the home of a sparks who has IR tester, but generally I reckon being able to disconnect N-E faults easily is a big benefit of RCBO boards and for this reason I don’t tend to fit Hager. When AFDDs actually work, are testable, and cost £25 I might reconsider!

 

[baldelectrician]

I always use Hager, however my confidence in them has been dented with the AFDD woes

In my home I have a Hager 3P+N DB with RCBO's plus an essential services DB for lighting, heating etc with a 63A Hager DP changeover switch

 

[mainline]

For me the main selling point of Hager is the fact that backward compatibility has been maintained over many years

Apparently, Hager are only compatible for metal consumer units.

That's only for about the last 7 years.

 

[nicebutdim]

Apparently, Hager are only compatible for metal consumer units.

That's only for about the last 7 years.

I thought it went back much farther in time.


Like Starbreaker

 

[mainline]

I always use Hager, however my confidence in them has been dented with the AFDD woes

I agree I saw a Hager afdd being tested, and it did absolutely nothing, other makes tripped fine.

 

[Timbo]

SBS consumer units, double pole rcbo's, twin busbar, no flying neutral leads. SPD available.

 

[westward10]

Is that fitted or on your couch.

 

[Diddy]

SBS consumer units, double pole rcbo's, twin busbar, no flying neutral leads. SPD available.

That guy who started this company was years ahead of the game. Quality products.

 

[nicebutdim]

That guy who started this company was years ahead of the game. Quality products.

They have an excellent reputation, but I can't help wondering about the future availability of components. While I like the idea of trade only sales, their business model doesn't lend itself to volume sales or widespread availability.

I've never seen an SBS board in the flesh and, if I found myself faced with adding a circuit to one, would be less than pleased with the hoops that have to be jumped through in order to add a new circuit. No chance of local availbility, the need to open an account to buy components and a requirement to prove competence in order to do so. I'd have to think long and hard about fitting an SBS board for a customer, if future simple works were to be made unnecessarily arduous due to mail order only availability and the possibility of no longer being available if the owner were to retire without finding a buyer for the business.

 

[timhoward]

That guy who started this company was years ahead of the game. Quality products.

I’ve fitted two. There’s lots I like about them. CPC bar could have more capacity for bonding. And I wish they didn’t use self drilling / tapping screws to hold din rail on.

 

[pc1966]

I went with Wylex for my rewirable home board's replacement (though it has been upgraded with plug-in breakers 25 year before...) and a friend's dual-CU problem home, and that was largely due to:

• Known brand, even if they have proven dumb on compatibility many times
• Spare readily available
• SPD that has no need for separate OCPD
• DP switching RCBOs
• Quality seems OK

For work though it has been Hager TPN stuff and the lack of DP switching RCBO irks me, but I do very little in either case.

If your supply is TT then going with a 100mA delay incomer and DP switching RCBOs would seem the best plan. Some Wylex board types don't support that (as I found out recently) but I think the domestic ones with the gravity-dropping covers do have that option, but those are limited in load, think it is 50A MCB and 40A compatible RCBO from memory.

As TT you don't need open PEN stuff for any EV, though you might get a TN-C-S supply if 3P upgrade offered for that?

 

[Timbo]

They have an excellent reputation, but I can't help wondering about the future availability of components. While I like the idea of trade only sales, their business model doesn't lend itself to volume sales or widespread availability.

I've never seen an SBS board in the flesh and, if I found myself faced with adding a circuit to one, would be less than pleased with the hoops that have to be jumped through in order to add a new circuit. No chance of local availbility, the need to open an account to buy components and a requirement to prove competence in order to do so. I'd have to think long and hard about fitting an SBS board for a customer, if future simple works were to be made unnecessarily arduous due to mail order only availability and the possibility of no longer being available if the owner were to retire without finding a buyer for the business.

I believe (don't hold me to it) that it is LVE stuff.

 

[oscar21]

Not sure why people are rating the Wylex and Crabtree stuff, the last couple of boards from them I have fitted have been awful. The metal they are made out of it more like tin foil but the worst part about them by far is you can't take the din rail out of them. It makes life so much easier if you can get all the gubbins out of the box to fix it and dress the cables first.

 

[nicebutdim]

Not sure why people are rating the Wylex and Crabtree stuff, the last couple of boards from them I have fitted have been awful. The metal they are made out of it more like tin foil but the worst part about them by far is you can't take the din rail out of them. It makes life so much easier if you can get all the gubbins out of the box to fix it and dress the cables first.

Can't say much for wylex, but I rate Crabtree for reasons already stated. Again I can't post much about wylex, but any starbreaker board I've fitted didn't the impression of being flimsy - quite the opposite when drilling as they've been made from considerably thicker sheet steel than many competitors.

Out of curiosity, when did you last fit a starbreaker board? Specifically starbreaker and not wylex.

 

[pc1966]

Not sure why people are rating the Wylex and Crabtree stuff, the last couple of boards from them I have fitted have been awful. The metal they are made out of it more like tin foil but the worst part about them by far is you can't take the

What have you found that is cheap-ish and good?

din rail out of them. It makes life so much easier if you can get all the gubbins out of the box to fix it and dress the cables first.

The DIN rail assembly is fairly easy to remove, there are two screws and a key-hole style of fitting so you can loosen them, lift and pull-forward the DIN rain and its out, reverse for fitting. Just don't loosen screws too far or you have to find them again...

 

[oscar21]

Do they still make the starbreaker board, thats the one with the plug in MCB's isn't it. All I know is the last Crabtree board I fitted was identical to the Wylex one, even the MCB's had the same style din clip on them.

 

[oscar21]

What have you found that is cheap-ish and good?

The DIN rail assembly is fairly easy to remove, there are two screws and a key-hole style of fitting so you can loosen them, lift and pull-forward the DIN rain and its out, reverse for fitting. Just don't loosen screws too far or you have to find them again...

I like the Fusebox boards and would fit them if I got to choose, my mate reckons the newest Chint board he fitted the other week was the best he's used in a while, plenty of space and all the MCB's line up perfectly. As for the din rail in the new Wylex boards, they are riveted in and there is now way of removing them. Its a pain in the arse if you are fitting a dual RCD on as you have to remove all the tails to get them out of the way instead of removing them all in one go. Here is what I mean about the din rail. (Crabtree and Wylex are the same with this model)

You probably could get it out if you bent the case enough but its not designed to be removed really.

O/T but I'm stuck with that board now, I was in a rush and the spec said Crabtree board so I found a Toolstation that had one in stock and bought it, it wan't until I was halfway through fitting it that I realised it had AC RCD's in it, I wasn't even aware they still sold that version. There was no way I was uninstalling it all and a new type A board was the same price as separate RCD's so I just got one of them, swapped the RCD's over and carried on. But now I'm stuck with something I cant take back as all the model labels and box are wrong. What can I do with it.

 

[nicebutdim]

Do they still make the starbreaker board, thats the one with the plug in MCB's isn't it. All I know is the last Crabtree board I fitted was identical to the Wylex one, even the MCB's had the same style din clip on them.

They do and I'd assumed that's what you were referring to as it's what people had recommended.

I also quite like fusebox, but their enclosures don't come close to the quality of starbreaker. More than a few people have complained about fitting covers on fusebox boards - it's not a problem I've encountered, but I can see how this could happen, due to flex in the enclosure, as they aren't pressed from particularly heavy steel.

 

[pc1966]

I like the Fusebox boards and would fit them if I got to choose, my mate reckons the newest Chint board he fitted the other week was the best he's used in a while, plenty of space and all the MCB's line up perfectly. As for the din rail in

Thanks for that suggestion.

the new Wylex boards, they are riveted in and there is now way of removing them. Its a pain in the arse if you are fitting a dual RCD on as you have to remove all the tails to get them out of the way instead of removing them all in one go. Here is what I mean about the din rail. (Crabtree and Wylex are the same with this model)

OK that is not what I have used, here is the NHSPN00111L recently done:

And from a year or two back the NM606FLEXS (suspect that part is changed as now single-module SPD):

 

[oscar21]

Yes they were much better and 10 times better quality, not only did the din rail come out but the whole backing plate did as well so it all came out as one solid block.

 

[ipf]

Yes they were much better and 10 times better quality, not only did the din rail come out but the whole backing plate did as well so it all came out as one solid block.

I did one and didn't know about the changes.......real pain in the arse. I mentioned it a while back.

 

[nicebutdim]

Unless they've changed in the last few months, DIN rail in Starbreaker boards is still removed with two screws.

I'm not sure why, but a lot of people consider Wylex and Crabtree one and the same and I find it a bit odd considering the former has ensured years of backward compatibility, while the latter changes designs more often than most sparks change their underwear. They're both Electrium brands and seem to share some technology (thinking early development of SP+N RCBO and single module AFDD), but that's where the similarities end.

 

[oscar21]

Unless they've changed in the last few months, DIN rail in Starbreaker boards is still removed with two screws.

I'm not sure why, but a lot of people consider Wylex and Crabtree one and the same and I find it a bit odd considering the former has ensured years of backward compatibility, while the latter changes designs more often than most sparks change their underwear. They're both Electrium brands and seem to share some technology (thinking early development of SP+N RCBO and single module AFDD), but that's where the similarities end.

Really?

https://www.NoLinkingToThis/p/wylex-16a-sp-type-b-mcb/489fr

https://www.NoLinkingToThis/p/crabtree-loadstar-16a-sp-type-b-mcb/189jt

https://www.NoLinkingToThis/p/wylex-dp-type-2-miniature-surge-protection-device-40ka/618vf

https://www.NoLinkingToThis/p/crabt...-miniature-surge-protection-device-40ka/174vf

https://www.NoLinkingToThis/p/crabtree-starbreaker-80a-30ma-dp-type-a-rccb/303vf

https://www.NoLinkingToThis/p/wylex-80a-30ma-dp-type-a-rcd/384hv

 

[nicebutdim]

Really?

https://www.NoLinkingToThis/p/wylex-16a-sp-type-b-mcb/489fr

https://www.NoLinkingToThis/p/crabtree-loadstar-16a-sp-type-b-mcb/189jt

https://www.NoLinkingToThis/p/wylex-dp-type-2-miniature-surge-protection-device-40ka/618vf

https://www.NoLinkingToThis/p/crabt...-miniature-surge-protection-device-40ka/174vf

https://www.NoLinkingToThis/p/crabtree-starbreaker-80a-30ma-dp-type-a-rccb/303vf

https://www.NoLinkingToThis/p/wylex-80a-30ma-dp-type-a-rcd/384hv

I'm able to see the similarities, yet am also aware of the fact that Wylex devices more often than not aren't compatible with their own boards.

The Starbreaker devices you link will fit boards going back a considerable number of years.

For obvious reasons Wylex and Starbreaker are incompatible, no matter how much bashing or cutting from the most determined spark.

 

[oscar21]

I know, I couldn't find decent pictures of the loadstar stuff but its identical to the wylex stuff, even the actual consumer units are identical.

 

[nicebutdim]

I know, I couldn't find decent pictures of the loadstar stuff but its identical to the wylex stuff, even the actual consumer units are identical.

Loadstar and Starbreaker are both identical to current Wylex products?

Seems unlikely, but I only deal with Loadstar as and when I come across it. I have very little knowledge of the Loadstar range. In general Fusebox is what I use on the basis of a combination of price, availability and devices- Starbreaker is comparatively expensive and not widely available over here, but I prefer it where quality and devices are concerned.

 

[oscar21]

I think so, here is the Crabtree CU I have with the non removable bus bar. (forget about the axiom SPD, thats another story).

Here is the latest Wylex unit

 

[nicebutdim]

I think so, here is the Crabtree CU I have with the non removable bus bar. (forget about the axiom SPD, thats another story).

View attachment 111508

Here is the latest Wylex unit

View attachment 111509

So where does Starbreaker fit into all of this?