general rant....ish

[Guest55]

Biff 55 all integrated fixed appliances

What does the customer say about no swtches stan ?
They might be happy with the clean uncluttered look ? They're paying the bill.
But like spinlondon says , theres no technical requirement , its just common practice really.

 

[jamie-spark]

here is what it says in the electricians guide to the building regs

Socket-outlets supplying appliances pushed under a work-surface, eg. dishwashers, tumble dryers and fridges, should be accessible when the appliance is pulled out.

Appliances built into kitchen furniture (integrated appliances) should be connected to a socket-outlet or fused connection unit that is readily accessible when the appliance is in place and in normal use or supplied from a socket-outlet or other connecting device controlled by a readily accessible double pole switch or switched fused connection unit

think its more a guide though

 

[Des 56]

Jamie,the word "should"can become more persuasive than it merits,it aint so persuasive as "must"

Stanley Have you also read the section about permanently connected equipment ?

quote

The connections for the washmachine, fridge and oven and hob were all by means of a fixed cooker outlet plates, and the microwave by means of a 13 amp switched socket.
​

 

[stanleyblade]

the customer wanted exactly that, the uncluttered look, i was just worried that there was no local way of isolating the supply in an emergency without running down to the cellar to isolate appliance. to my mind i thought the switches could have been placed in a base unit towards the front for ease of access.I would rather be over cautious with these things thanjust do what customer wants just because they paying the wages. but on other hand would rather be put right and be told than to go along the wrong path albeit for the right reasons,,,,, if that makes sense??

 

[stanleyblade]

Thanks jamie, this is where i need and appreciate the help this forum gives.To me readily accessible is above worktp or at worst in cupboard , not down in dingy cellar , but get the idea. the cellar is still readily accessible . cheers

 

[theroadblock]

the customer wanted exactly that, the uncluttered look, i was just worried that there was no local way of isolating the supply in an emergency without running down to the cellar to isolate appliance. to my mind i thought the switches could have been placed in a base unit towards the front for ease of access.I would rather be over cautious with these things thanjust do what customer wants just because they paying the wages. but on other hand would rather be put right and be told than to go along the wrong path albeit for the right reasons,,,,, if that makes sense??

You have all the best intentions there mate keep at it, in this case there is no strict 'you must' but albeit, what the customer says is NOT always right and its good that you checked before becoming a yes man /applaud for you my good sir!

 

[Swicade]

I've always put local isolation and will always stress to a customer the merits of doing so.

If they dont want to see them front edge of a cupboard is far far better than going down the steps to a cellar....where some one like my missus would likely leave the brush/ironing board/washing basket/etc/etc all ready for me to trip over as she was 'going to take it all down to the cellar later!'.

Fairplay to ya Stanley for sticking by what you think is best for safety.........almost earns yeself forgiveness for the 1 week course

 

[stanleyblade]

not as yet des, that will now be my light read material for bed time. the microwave was not meant to be wired to a plug , but hard wired into cooker out let plate, as manufacturer install guide stated, so the spark was changing the cable size as it was only in 2.5, and also the socket to a plate. and your right about should and must, took "should " as "must" thanx

 

[stanleyblade]

i lied , 4.5 days, we finished early on the friday :smartass2: but thanx

 

[spark 68]

I would just like to add the manufacturers instructions overule BS7671.

 

[Deleted member 26818]

The last time there was any reference to a cooker switch in the Regulations was in the 14th edition.

"A.29
Every stationary cooking appliance shall be controlled by a switchseparate from the appliance and within 6 feet of the appliance. Where twostationary cooking appliances are installed in one room, one switch may be usedto control the two appliances provided that neither appliance is more than 6feet from the switch."

For some reason, the OSGs keep refering to this, even though the requirement was removed some ten years before the first OSG was published.

 

[Simlec]

Forget your BGB & OSG what does it say in the appliance manual/instructions! Because if some think was to go wrong thats the first place the inspectors will look. They nearly always say they need local isolation. Good on you for not been one of these fit it and walk way with there money types.

 

[Guitarist]

I would just like to add the manufacturers instructions overule BS7671.

Indeed mate. Some electricians seem to have trouble reading the figures on their MFT's tho, let alone an "instruction book".

 

[Guitarist]

The last time there was any reference to a cooker switch in the Regulations was in the 14th edition.

"A.29
Every stationary cooking appliance shall be controlled by a switchseparate from the appliance and within 6 feet of the appliance. Where twostationary cooking appliances are installed in one room, one switch may be usedto control the two appliances provided that neither appliance is more than 6feet from the switch."

For some reason, the OSGs keep refering to this, even though the requirement was removed some ten years before the first OSG was published.

I think it's due to the OSG being an amalgamation of BS7671 and the building regs, which refer to the 2 metre "recommendation".

 

[stanleyblade]

thanx spark 68, complete muppetry on my behalf as my eyes were drawn to cooker control switch at the bottom of table and it was late , although no excuse, so overlooked that,

 

[AndyL]

REG 537.4.1.1 --- Means shall be provided for emergency switching of any part of an installation where it may be necessary to control the supply to remove an unexpected danger

Pretty sure a chip pan fire would be included in this description

 

[AndyL]

REG 537.4.2.5 The means of operation shall be readily accessible at places where a danger might occur

Maybe within 2m of cooker rather than in basement

 

[Simlec]

REG 537.4.1.1 --- Means shall be provided for emergency switching of any part of an installation where it may be necessary to control the supply to remove an unexpected dangerPretty sure a chip pan fire would be included in this description

I'm pretty sure I would be going for a wet tea cloth or fire blanket !!! Not a switch!

 

[alarm man]

im pretty sure with a 23k kitchen they dont put the chip pan on when they get home from the club..

 

[StuSpiers]

nah they get the butler to do it.