chandalier light goes dim as you add more lamps

[pallys]

Hi, hope someone can help.

In my hallway I had a basic ceiling light fitting on a low power energy saving bulb. Missus got a chandalier form Wilkinson's over a year ago that I never got round to fitting until now...was a Jerrico 5 candle chandalier for £40. Each lamp holder can take up to 60W E14 SES bulbs.

I've wired it up as per Wilko instructions but everytime I add a 42W halogen candle style bulb (£1 each) the light output halves. I.e. its brightest with only 1 bulb in and as I add each one in up to the 5 they all end up with a very faint glow.

The light can be turned on/off from 2 locations:

2 gang switch
- switch 1 chandalier
- switch 2 turns outside front light on (energy saving bulb)

3 gang switch
- swtich 1 chandalier
- switch 2 turns on cloak room light (energy saver)
- switch 3 turns on landing light up stairs (energy saver)

The other lights don't seem to get brighter as I add a candle bulb. But it's hard to tell because the other lights are energy savers and they don't really lend themselves to get even brighter imo.

​

There was 1 cable from ceiling and inside of that were 3 wires:
brown,
blue,
yellow/green.

Then there was a separate single wire dropping from the ceiling which was also a yellow/green. Seems like I had 2 earths?

The light fitting also had a brown, blue, yellow/green so I joined these up to the 3 core in a block. The light fitting also had another yellow/green (or was it green/blue?) and I joined this to the separate yellow/green hanging from the ceiling in the 4 block.

In total 4 from ceiling was joined to 4 from the light fitting, the same colours.

To rule out the light fitting, I had a 2nd chandalier that the wife bought also over a year ago for me to fit elsewhere...I wired this in the hallway and same problem. I then wired it in the landing upstairs - same problem. The second chandalier I tried also did not require to be earthed but still same problem.

I tried different bulbs just incase - same problem...bulbs keep dimming as I add one more...

So I have ruled out the lamps and 2 different manufacture chandaliers being faulty.

Any idea what's wrong with the house wiring?

Thanks.

Ps. House built in 1988, a part p electrician previously lived here.

 

[thebigcheese]

Sounds like it's wired in series and not parallel, google should be able to tell you why that's a problem but it would be quite difficult to rectify without a bit of a rewire

EDIT:
I meant the whole chandalier is wired in series with another light fitting (or extractor fan etc) somewhere in the house.

​

 

[decolad69]

Hi, what happens when you remove a lamp ? If wired in series all lamps will go out when you remove one.

 

[pallys]

Hi, what happens when you remove a lamp ? If wired in series all lamps will go out when you remove one.

Hi, it still works with 1 lamp in, this is when it's at its brightest. The chandalier(s) are definately not wired in series as per above, and I have tried two different manfufacturers and they can't both be faulty.

Im sure it's a problem with the house wiring that I need help with.

 

[thebigcheese]

Oops! I meant the whole chandalier is wired in series with another light fitting (or extractor fan etc) somewhere in the house.

 

[Kamikaze]

Could be that you mixed up the switch wire and neutrals on the ceiling rose.

 

[pallys]

Oops! I meant the whole chandalier is wired in series with another light fitting (or extractor fan etc) somewhere in the house.

Hi, is there a way/mehtod that I can use to test that this is the case?

 

[pallys]

Could be that you mixed up the switch wire and neutrals on the ceiling rose.

I did them to the same colours, but I can test it the other way around incase its wrong at source, is it OK to do this?

(I don't have RCD, but the lighting downstairs does seem to be on its own fuse and if it trips I can flick the switch back to 'on' in the unit in the garage.)

 

[Des 56]

I think you are on a loser with this one mate
The wires need to be identified and sorted, sadly,guessing what goes where may not be a good idea

 

[onions1066]

Split all the cables touch the blues 1 at a time and when you feel a crippling spasm going up your arm towards your heart you've found the switchwire. Boom job done everyone's a winner.

 

[thebigcheese]

Easiest way would be to see if anythign else visably dims around the house, problem would like most likely be at the switch or ceiling rose. It shouldn't take a spark who's good at fault finding too long to find the problem and fix it for ya

 

[LlandrilloSpark]

^^^ !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ^^^^^

 

[decolad69]

If you had a single cable as you describle in your post with Brown Blue and Green +Yellow you can't mix that up ? It sounds as if you have no neutral at the light.

 

[Octopus]

Given its Xmas eve I would suggest you make do with 1 bulb or take it down and put the original light back.

Last time I saw something like this was when a DIYer took down a light and got the connections muddled up!

 

[LlandrilloSpark]

IMO I think a problem with the fitting, first off have you 230v between Line & Neutral at the ceiling?, you might need a sparky to test this.

Lads, would this work, I would try it

Measure the resistance across one on your halogen candle lamps, then work out what the total resistance of the fitting should be with the 5 lamps in place if correctly wired in paralell, then place an low resistance ohm meter across L and N of the fitting and compare the readings.

Then take the resistance of the one lamp and times it by 5, this would give you the resistance of the fitting if incorrectly wired in series

Compare the correct parallel readings to incorrect series readings.

This may tell you if the fitting is wired wrong.

You will prob need a spark with a meter to do this.

If it makes no sense it's because I've had a cider or two!

 

[telectrix]

sounds like a loose connection.OK with a small load, but as soon as you increase the load, it's dimming due to loss of volts. only answewr is to get a sparks in. half hour .... sorted.

 

[snowhead]

Was the single cable coming out of the ceiling twin and earth, with sleeving on the earth (green /yellow)
OR a flexible cable?

Was the upstairs a similar type cable?

When you wired the second chandellier upstairs was the first still wired in down stairs?

You won't be able to guess your way out, even an experienced spark might need a couple of guesses.

 

[tony mc]

The first bit would get me never mind the op as you would be into 1/RT = 1/R1 + 1/R2 + 1/R3 etc working out the parallel cct to get the resistance of the fitting!

Or am I thinking out of the box!

I would guess that there is a VD issue and maybe a bad neutral connection somewhere on the cct

 

[LlandrilloSpark]

I know Tony but its only 5 lamps!

 

[telectrix]

guesses??? we don't do guesses. just a " got it sorted, mate, just need a connector from the van" ( while scratching head)