It's getting worse

[Pete999]

I'll bet you've never started a thread about winter fuel allowances, odd that eh.

Well mine and my Mrs has come through thank you vert much.

 

[telectrix]

it would be interesting to see how many families who complain about being unable to afford heat possess flat screen HD TVs, sky sports, playstations, ipads and smartphones. ( this is not to detract from the situation of people in genuine need).

 

[sean_ork]

it would be interesting to see how many families who complain about being unable to afford heat possess flat screen HD TVs, sky sports, playstations, ipads and smartphones. ( this is not to detract from the situation of people in genuine need).

That as good a logical point as the rivers of blood hint made by someone here previously.

 

[Midwest]

As I posted before, arming every single UK police officer is not practical and not possible and would not thwart terrorist attacks, look to the US, France etc.

Most of the recent terrorist attacks in the UK, have been from UK residents radicalised by others. Imam's have been quick to condemn this attack, but it still won't stop individuals from continuing in the name of their religion, whatever that might be.

I'm afraid we live in a dangerous world, whether from terrorist attack, or crossing the road.

 

[GMES]

I'll bet you've never started a thread about winter fuel allowances, odd that eh.

Says the member of 4 years with 43 posts to his name odd that eh!! feel free sean to start participating in the forum more, you have spoken more in my thread than you have in 4 years of being a member, Crack on mate and start a thread.

 

[sean_ork]

Says the member of 4 years with 43 posts to his name odd that eh!! feel free sean to start participating in the forum more, you have spoken more in my thread than you have in 4 years of being a member, Crack on mate and start a thread.

Comments like that don't win arguments - on the topic here, does post count add credibility ?

I thought a bit of a reality check and a few facts might be just a bit more pointed and help calm the scaremongers.

 

[GMES]

Comments like that don't win arguments - on the topic here, does post count add credibility ?

I thought a bit of a reality check and a few facts might be just a bit more pointed and help calm the scaremongers.

1. No they don't win arguments but don't make comments about me or others not starting threads when you haven't really participated over 4 years
2. no post count doesn't prove credibilty but it does prove that you're an engaging and active member and not just popping up once in a blue moon to try and argue points not relevant to the particular thread.
3. how can reporting a factual incident be scaremongering, at no point have I said I am happy about what is happening I merely asked should we arm the police.

 

[Pete999]

Comments like that don't win arguments - on the topic here, does post count add credibility ?

I thought a bit of a reality check and a few facts might be just a bit more pointed and help calm the scaremongers.

Sean, I don't know your situation or what you have been up to work/location wise, and I'm not having a go at you, perhaps you would feel differently about dealing with these animals if you have had actual experience of what they are about.

They are in fact what I can best describe as animals, having been in some of the countries where they originate from, I have seen first hand, even some of the so called moderates feel about westerners, we have to abide by their laws when we are in their countries, the same should apply to them.

Some of these places don't allow you to wear shorts in the heat and as for what the fairer sex are allowed to wear, well lets not get into that. It's scary to walk the streets in some places I have been to, and the police aren't that much better, intimidation is rife.

The radicals arrive here and preach their hate, why on earth doesn't the law allow us to do what is necessary and repatriate them back to their country of origin, no what we do is give them housing and allowances for them to continue preaching their hate, and even worse, recruiting normal law abiding youngsters to do their bidding, if they want to go to Syria (yes I have been there thank you very much) let them go, revoke their British citizenship and leave them to it.

 

[sean_ork]

You might have missed the point I have been making.

You started a thread on a topic which deals with the actions of very few, which lead to the possible deaths of comparatively few, and if we should arm plod to deal with it. Its been shown that arming plod is conceptually flawed in the case in question.


I've pointed out that there's no threads being started, or have been previously started with regards to the numerous other causes of a far far greater number of deaths in this Country.

If folks were really bothered about saving lives, there'd be a hoard of threads discussing the topics I've mentioned but then that's not the current popular bandwagon is it.

 

[Englishman]

This is the problem with the loony left.

Whenever anything is mentioned about Muslim terrorism, they bang on about white murderers, or food banks, or some other rubbish. And just completely ignore the actual subject that is being discussed.

And Sean, NOBODY IS TALKING ABOUT ANY OF THAT SO NOBODY CARES ABOUT YOUR OPINIONS ON THOSE MATTERS.

If you want to discuss your nonsense, start a thread about it and discuss it in there.

 

[GMES]

So get starting some threads then instead of making the same comments over and over again, which by the way could be viewed as trolling. I have asked a simple question and yet you have somehow turned into something else, I have said several times now that this thread is about the current terrorism events and what we should be doing about it so this is the last time I will say this, If you want to start a thread about the Nhs or winter fuel allowances etc etc then go and start one and we will all debate it with you, but if you continue trying to derail this thread then I will have no choice but to delete all pointless posts and start again.

 

[Englishman]

You might have missed the point I have been making.

You started a thread on a topic which deals with the actions of very few, which lead to the possible deaths of comparatively few, and if we should arm plod to deal with it. Its been shown that arming plod is conceptually flawed in the case in question.


I've pointed out that there's no threads being started, or have been previously started with regards to the numerous other causes of a far far greater number of deaths in this Country.

If folks were really bothered about saving lives, there'd be a hoard of threads discussing the topics I've mentioned but then that's not the current popular bandwagon is it.

We're bothered about terrorists murdering innocent people.

 

[sean_ork]

Pete, Ive spent decades in and around London and our big cities, I've felt the ground shake and have ducked to avoid broken glass as IRA bombs have gone off - I've seen the aftermath in other Country's of war - I've seen how quick a train carriage emptied when a darker skin employee sat with me after the London bombings - the fact that he was my QS didn't do anything to stop folks worrying.

Back when the IRA were active over here normal life didn't stop, folks weren't scared to go out, generally this Country's spirt carried us through, we just assumed (and where right) that everything possible was being done to prevent these attacks.

Things changed when someone's skin coloured could be used as a point of suspicion, certain sections of the community jumped on this to suit their own agenda.

These days we don't appear to be able to trust those who tell us that everything possible is being done to prevent these attacks, we appear to feel better if we can physically see something, such as armed police or the army, on every corner.

The attacks in other Country's haven't been stopped by arming plod, its a flawed concept - granted it might make some feel more secure, but its simply depriving areas of resources, such as intelligence, which is the real way to properly defeat ISIS.

Also giving those disaffected enough to join a purpose in life in this Country will starve the radicals of new cannon fodder.

 

[sean_ork]

So get starting some threads then instead of making the same comments over and over again, which by the way could be viewed as trolling.

It's called expanding the argument, your question was overly simplistic - with respect youve got to look at the entire picture.

 

[sean_ork]

Is anyone willing to illustrate an opinion in favour of arming plod with any evidence of where it has been effective ?

 

[Midwest]

I think someone should close this thread. Does no good to argue like this.

 

[GMES]

I am more than happy to let another member of staff come in and moderate it but I am not going to start waving the Moderator stick in my own thread.

 

[Englishman]

I am more than happy to let another member of staff come in and moderate it but I am not going to start waving the Moderator stick in my own thread.

The bloke's talking complete an utter nonsense. Why do the left wing just ignore the argument at hand and speak about other things?

 

[GMES]

I don't want the thread closing if i'm honest because it was becoming a good debate until we got sidetracked by completely unrelated arguments.

 

[Guest77]

I think someone should close this thread. Does no good to argue like this.

If this thread is closed just because Sean has an opinion most disagree with then you may as well shut the site.

 

[Englishman]

If this thread is closed just because Sean has an opinion most disagree with then you may as well shut the site.

He doesn't have any opinion on what we're discussing, he's making a new argument!

 

[sean_ork]

I don't want the thread closing if i'm honest because it was becoming a good debate until we got sidetracked by completely unrelated arguments.

I respect your opinion, perhaps others can see how my points actually are related, if its maximising the numbers of lives we are trying to save.

I'll make no further comments along those lines, ill just reitterate my last and leave it there.

Is anyone wiling to illustrate an opinion in favour of arming plod with any evidence of where it has been effective ?

 

[Guest77]

I respect your opinion, perhaps others can see how my points actually are related, if its maximising the numbers of lives we are trying to save.

I'll make no further comments along those lines, ill just reitterate my last and leave it there.

Is anyone wiling to illustrate an opinion in favour of arming plod with any evidence of where it has been effective ?

Don't count your chickens, I think your on your own lol

 

[sean_ork]

Don't count your chickens, I think your on your own lol

Fair point

 

[Darkwood]

Can we all stick to the thread topic please, refrain from dragging in unrelated statistics and see if we can get back on track here, normally closing the thread would be easier but as GMES expresses, there is moments of a very good debate here so would be a shame to have to drop the thread.

There is clearly some strong opinions and passionate views here which is good for debate but we are teetering on the verge of turning into a slanging match which is not good so can we discuss like the gentlemen you are please

 

[Guest77]

Can we all stick to the thread topic please, refrain from dragging in unrelated statistics and see if we can get back on track here, normally closing the thread would be easier but as GMES expresses, there is moments of a very good debate here so would be a shame to have to drop the thread.

There is clearly some strong opinions and passionate views here which is good for debate but we are teetering on the verge of turning into a slanging match which is not good so can we discuss like the gentlemen you are please

Have you edited the thread fella? because I cannot see any problems so far.

 

[Guest77]

anyhow lets all cheer up a bit lol

https://www.bing.com/videos/search?...80AB4DFEE4D5F008A65780AB4DFEE4D5F0&FORM=VIRE3

 

[telectrix]

and.................

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SJUhlRoBL8M

 

[Guest77]

and

https://www.bing.com/videos/search?...6B4574D0BACDB7A94D546B4574D0BACDB7&FORM=VIRE3

 

[telectrix]

i'm not watching that frog-canuck crooner/groaner! :rant:

 

[sean_ork]

At least this one is vaguely related to the topic :boxing_smiley:

https://youtu.be/2rr9k6WY4T4

 

[Darkwood]

Have you edited the thread fella? because I cannot see any problems so far.

Just a bit of preventative pro active posting,it was heading that way, temp's were starting to rise although as I wrote the post it got back on track but already posted so ill leave as a reminder.

Although what Michael bubble has to do with it other than he wants shooting IMHO ...Ahhhh now I see the relation to the topic :christmaswindow:

 

[Guest77]

Time to stop hijacking this thread Tel, I think a christmas thread which will pi$$ everyone off needs putting up in the chitchat haha

 

[GMES]

Hiya Mike yeah start a xmas thread and let's all get in the spirit.

 

[Englishman]

First argument thread that I've not been told off by the mods! Haha.

 

[telectrix]

must be making allowances, being as you're from slurry.

 

[Englishman]

Doesn't normally make a difference haha.

And I'm actually born and bred in central London, just live in the beautiful Surrey now.

 

[Midwest]

Don't count your chickens, I think your on your own lol

If your on about routinely arming all police officers, you've read my posts, can you give me your arguments on the contrary.


PS If we are all agreed to drop the subject, please feel free to ignore.

 

[Octopus]

Glen unfortunately it is something that is more and more likely to happen. Less than 5 yrs ago you would never have seen police in a station with weapons, now at most main line stations in London they are quite prevalent.

I think within the next 2 yrs most squad cars will have firearms in them, if not already.

There ARE more armed officers around than most of us think already!

 

[Octopus]

Doesn't normally make a difference haha.

And I'm actually born and bred in central London, just live in the beautiful Surrey now.

Until is all built over and ALL the roads are logged jammed

 

[Flanders]

I agree we should have armed police but not every police officers from what i seen the tazzer did do its job ,remember after 7/7 the police shot an innocent man aleast with a tazzer if they shoot the wrong man or women ,they will live to tell the tail , they have now posted extra armed police on the tube

 

[GMES]

I don't want to see any innocent people getting shot by the police but the issue for me is if a police officer responds to a call about a terrorist brandishing an ak47 I don't think it's fair to send him in with stun gun, for one thing he will need to get a lot closer to the gunman which leaves the officer in even more Danger, personally for me I think he would need to stop him from a safer distance.

 

[Englishman]

Until is all built over and ALL the roads are logged jammed

Biggest problem in my roads are cyclists and people who refuse to drive anywhere near the speed limit!

No buildings in my Area of Outstanding Natural Beauty

 

[Flanders]

I don't want to see any innocent people getting shot by the police but the issue for me is if a police officer responds to a call about a terrorist brandishing an ak47 I don't think it's fair to send him in with stun gun, for one thing he will need to get a lot closer to the gunman which leaves the officer in even more Danger, personally for me I think he would need to stop him from a safer distance.

Do you not feel with have enough armed respose teams already for this ,

 

[Paul.M]

Do you not feel with have enough armed response teams already for this ,

I'd like to have more of them tbh. Lets look at Friday nights attack and who responded first? Policemen only armed with tazers, thank God that the "attacker" was not carrying a gun!!!

 

[GMES]

Do you not feel with have enough armed respose teams already for this ,

If I am honest mate I don't what the numbers are for armed vs unarmed

I'd like to have more of them tbh. Lets look at Friday nights attack and who responded first? Policemen only armed with tazers, thank God that the "attacker" was not carrying a gun!!!

Spot on Paul and my point entirely, what chance would the officer have had and then the terrorist would have been free to attack even more civilians.

 

[Flanders]

You make a good point but how far do we go how many police do we arm just london , just the major city's or every town and vilage these attacks could happen any ware , i guess its all down to money do we spend it on intergance or guns , the police have guns in france and still those terible attacks happened .

 

[telectrix]

Biggest problem in my roads are cyclists and people who refuse to drive anywhere near the speed limit!

No buildings in my Area of Outstanding Natural Beauty

you must live in a cave, then. :28:

 

[Flanders]

There were 129,584 full-time equivalent ( FTE ) police officers in the 43 police forces of England and Wales as at 31 March 2013. This is a decrease of 3.4% or 4,516 officers compared to a year earlier (Table 1 and 3). There were 6,537 FTE Minority Ethnic officers in the 43 forces of England and Wales.

There were 6,868 authorised firearms officers in England and Wales as of 31 March 2009, according to government figures.

If I am honest mate I don't what the numbers are for armed vs unarmed


Just some info i got of the google i know some it is old data so just a quick guide about 5 % of the police are armed tbo i thought it would be hire

 

[Pete999]

You mean higher, or rent a cop