Small claims court?

[rocker]

Okay, now for rant#2 for the day.

I've talked about this guy before, I did a load of work for him on his house and he hasn't paid me. He's a builder and I have subbed to him quite a bit in the past.... always got on with him and his crew, he was always a little slow to pay but I always got it in the end.

Anyway, we are talking now about three jobs I have done for him, one indoors at his house at the END OF AUGUST, one small job for one of his customers on october, and vaious works outdoors at his house which went from September till early November (lots of little jobs, he kept adding things to the list and it was a 'do it when you have the time' kind of setup, so done over several weeks).

It was agreed that the first job would be paid up when I finished the indoors, but somehow that got amalgamated into the total bill (without my say-so, I'll add), the same with the job for his customer.

As I'd worked with him before I stupidly didn't get him to sign a contract. Cos he was a mate. Yea, right.

So, after ringing and ringing and texting him for weeks, him saying he'll pop the money to my house, not turning up, he'll ring me when he's on his way home and meet me, not bothering, in mid December he finally answers his phone and says he will get his wife to meet me at a shopping centre with the cash, so she meets me and says 'here you go, two fifty'
'Two fifty?'
'Yea, that's how much he told me to bring, is that not enough?'
'No love, it's not. Don't worry, I'll take that now and I'll get in touch with him about the rest.'

So I take the money, try ringing him, no answer, so I send him a text saying 'thanks for the part payment I appreciate it, but when can I have the further £400?'. No reply. Christmas comes and goes, ringing, texting, nothing. So I try another tact 'are you getting my messages? If you're having problems with your phone I can just come to your house'. No answer, so I think 'Hmm, maybe he has lost his phone'. So last Wednesday I posted him a red reminder, with an itemised breakdown of everything that's been done, and a demand to pay within 14 days. I put a note in there saying 'I've been messaging you but assume you lost your phone, get in touch'.

The next day I get a message from his phone saying 'I have been getting your messages, I'll ring you on Monday'.

Guess what, he's fallen off the face of the earth again.

Soooo sorry to bore you all with this AGAIN but has anyone actually taken anyone to small claims court? What happens, what do you have to do and how much do you have to pay? I'm still not particularly established on my own as a business, and while I can afford to pay my way and go out for a few beers, £400 isn't peanuts to me, but it's more about the damn principle. Loads of these extras were done in the freezing cold, working late in the dark etc etc because his missus wanted it done for Christmas etc, AND it was all done at a knock down rate because he was a 'mate'. Not only this, but he lives in a massive detached house in a really nice out-of-town area, and all he seems to do is disappear to Travis Perkins (or so he says) for hours on end, come back, have a coffee, tell people what to do, maybe do a bit of basic joinery and then he's swanning off again. I'm working my --- off, and when I'm notdoing that I'm working my --- off trying to find work, and I have to live in a rented terraced right in the city which doesn't even have the luxury of a front garden (I actually really like my house but it still GRINDS MY GEARS that he gets all that for doing precisely sod all.)

Arg I keep ranting and I'm sorry, but yes, small claims court, what's the process? Any help would be appreciated.

 

[Paul.M]

Her Majesty's Courts Service -Forms and Guidance

There you go Rocker, have a good read.

 

[Paul.M]

Is it possible to ask his wife about this, seems easier to get in touch with. She may be able to twist his arm a bit for you.

 

[rocker]

Nah I don't have her number. Anyway, if someone rang my missus up about a work complaint, I'd hit the friggin roof! Don't want to bring the womenfolk into it.

 

[High Tower]

Take him to the small claims court mate, and take him for the full £650, i assume you diddnt sign a recipt when she handed the 250 over so you never had it.....right!

Feel for you mate !!

 

[Marvo]

Step 1; Find a pikey (shouldn't be too difficult from what Ive read on here.
Step 2; Employ him to collect said debt in the form of a cheque.
Step 3; Phone the builder and tell him the pikey (and his extended family/pets etc) is coming to collect unless the amount is deposited in your account.
Step 4; If no deposit materializes send in the pikey and pay him his 20% when he returns with your cheque.

 

[rocker]

You love that word now, don't you marvo!

He's rung me! He said he had been avoiding me and said he was 'shocked' at the price, comparing it to the price I did a rewire on one of his customers bungalow for him.

I reminded him that he knocked me down from 2100 to 1900 on that job, that he took 2500 from the customer and said to her that was what I had quoted, and that that job was meant to be a very quick in and out rewire, few days first fix, plasterers in while I was on another job, then a couple days for 2nd fix. It turned out to be a much higher spec job which was dragged out over a few months because it wasn't planned at all. I said he knew this was a bone of contention with me, and had I known what would be involved I would have charged around three grand on it, so comparison with that job was a bit pointless.

He says he will 'try' and pay me over the next few weeks but he has done a job for someone who hasn't paid HIM, to which I empathised by way of saying 'no, it's not very nice, is it?'. He's making out like is skint which I know is bollox, but what can I do.

He then said he wants me to go and quote for some work in a restaurant refit he's doing. I said I'll have a look at it, but we'll have to really discuss payment methods beforehand..... I think I'm just gonna have to walk on any more work he has which is a shame, as I said, I used to get on with him and his crew, I just can't afford to fanny about with money like this, and be messing about on big jobs with people who can't organise their way out of a paper bag.

 

[BLBelfast]

Im in the same boat. Done loads of kitchens for a fitter. Always paid on time without a problem. Let a few jobs money pile up unpaid. Next thing didnt hear anything from him. This is going back to November. Phoned and sent him a few messages with no reply. Then when I phoned from another number he answered. He did sound awful on the phone and told me he had been in hospital for three weeks due to developing some illness. I didnt believe him as I didnt know you would be allowed your mobile in hospital but apparently now you are

Anyway left it a few more weeks and he still hasnt paid up. No contracts signed, no idea where he lives and if he is in hospital that is fair enough but he has got paid from the jobs we done and I need the money. Owes me £900 of which a good bit is owed to a wholesalers who are going to blacklist me.

 

[Former Sponsor TM]

I'm sorry to hear this Rocker, We use a company called FRS for all our debt collection. Peter Graham is our contact, I'm not sure what he does but it's very effective and have always received our outstanding debts. He does charge for the privilege but his rates seem very fair. It might be worth giving him a call, even if it's just for a bit of advice? You can find his contact details on here: FRS Financial Recovery Services - 0113 266 5679

Best of luck to you!

 

[Knobhead]

It will cost you £65 (10%) of the claim. If found in your favour it will be refunded. You don’t need a solicitor as it’s done on a informal basis. Basically a chat with the two parties involved with a court officer as adjudicator.

 

[Marvo]

You love that word now, don't you marvo!

You're right, I discovered the word on here and looked up the definition on the urbandictionary.com.....that and the way you guys were talking about them. I laughed solid for nearly a week and mentioned it to loads of people, I started randomly calling people a pikey, asking them if their mother was a pikey and even told someone he smelt like a pikey but nobody understood the word and not an eyebrow was raised...... until one guy also laughed when he heard me use the word and suggested I watch a movie called 'Snatch'.
I downloaded a copy and it was hard work to watch so I found an English subtitle file and watched it again. It nearly cost me a perfectly serviceable set of underpants and almost my marriage once wifey figured out what pikey meant after I'd been calling her one all week. I thought it was the funniest thing I'd ever seen and I'd never even heard of it before, it never made it big in SA.
Yeah I know what you're probably thinking and you're right, I should get out more....it's the small things I get a kick from and I'm actually laughing now just thinking about the word.

Sorry about the off topic post

 

[accordfire]

He then said he wants me to go and quote for some work in a restaurant refit he's doing. I said I'll have a look at it, but we'll have to really discuss payment methods beforehand..... I think I'm just gonna have to walk on any more work he has which is a shame, as I said, I used to get on with him and his crew, I just can't afford to fanny about with money like this, and be messing about on big jobs with people who can't organise their way out of a paper bag.

We've had one like that lately too - several thousand owing since September! No amount of calls, letters, texts, emails move these folk.

If I understand correctly, the total amount outstanding at present, as originally charged is £400? How long has that been outstanding - from the date of invoice? The total amount of the invoice was £650?

What VERBAL terms did you agree with this clown? Did you discount over your normal rate at all - you may have grounds to raise the charges, if you did. What terms were on your original invoice in respect of payment?

Are you VAT registered?

Once we've got the answers to all of these, we may be able to raise his debt to a level whereby you CAN do something about it legally - CCJs are ultimately a waste of time unless you're prepared to pay almost what you're claiming here by way of serving a distraint warrant on him once you obtain judgment. Sad, but true. You can get your moral victory easily enough, but a CCJ is unlikely to bother this guy much if at all because he'll know the ropes, and let is get awarded in "default" - i.e. without contesting it, and then have it wiped on the basis he knew nothing about it.

If we can raise the total bill over £750, including VAT if you charge it, including reasonable admin charges, and so forth, there is a much more useful tool you can use.

As for quoting further work for the guy, by all means do so, but ensure two things: (1) payment of all materials up front minimum, ans (2) insert a clause in your terms which allows you to secure the work against his property - a vehicle or something which he owns without lien (i.e. doesn't owe finance on) - and get a solicitor to draw up the letter of security, to which he should also attach registration documents, and then the lot should be held in escrow until completion. If he fails to pay in the alloted time, sell the vehicle for the cost of the debt. Failing that, obtain full payment in advance.