Tiler for £12 an hour??

[jammysparks]

I believe that to justify wages you need to look how long it takes to become proficient at a trade.
If you look at the average 3rd year electrical apprentice he could probably rewire a house with his eyes closed.
But on the other hand plastering can take 6 years to become proficient at.

So if you put them together the plasterer should be getting more.

This may upset a few people because sparks are renowned for thinking we at the top of the tree because we can do a few calculations and can read.

But do a full day laying brick or skimming ceilings and you would be wanting the same if not more than the electrician sat wiring a cu.

If it takes someone six years to learn plastering then they must have an arm missing.

I started my electrical career when i was 17 in 1993, ive been employed for my apprentership and some 6 years after by a large company where i done a lot of everything, industrial/commercial as well as a little domestic, run sites with 10+ sparks under me, bank refurbs,office blocks bowlplexs etc etc...im ranting here.
Ive earnt some damn good money before the recession hit and probably averaged 800 take home pay a week employed but ive had to do average 80 hours a week for that and a lot of nights.
It got to the point where id had enough of the cutbacks to my pay which resulted in me doing same hours for half the pay nowadays so i left in august last year and have gone self employed, im now niceic domestic registered and things are slow, but luckily due to my wife going back full time after our daughter we manage just about.

Im ranting but ill get there, bare with me

The point is because work is not as frequent as id like ive gone on the tools with a plasterer as a m8 and been taught, now im not as quick as a guy who does just plastering day in day out but my finish is as gd as most and i regularly get paid more to do this than spark, i went with the guy for 2 weeks ffs and can pass off as a plasterer amongst the fulltimers.

My brother is a floorlayer and in between electrical jobs and plastering jobs to make ends meet i do some labouring for him and his crew in airports on big contracts and get paid £180 oer day.

The whole thing is mucked up and trades such as plasterers and floorlayers walk on a site and the area is mostly cleared for them "so they can get on" whilst we get pushed to a side and have to work around everyone.

Theres no respect for sparkys, loads of people have a go themselves. Doesnt help that anyone can buy electrical materials/accesories without having to show some kind of competence or qualification.

 

[paulthe spark]

Have to agree with jammysparks there I've losses count number times walked into a house to 1st fix and have to clear partitions, insulation, crap etc out of the way also bending under scaffoldings to get into the house only for the scaffolding to be cleared at the door as soon as joiner comes in with his sheets frustrating

 

[martysparky]

True enough any body can buy plaster from B and Q cheaper than the builders merchants and have a go like I did recently.

I plastered a ceiling and a few walls ( first time after reading a thread on here ) ok not 100% on the finish but ok and a lot cheaper buying a few bags of plaster than plaster plus the plasterers fee. No risk of death!!!

say, this was electrics and someone done a 90% good job... that 10% could very well be fatal

Ok we could do one of those in a week courses

Plastering
Tiling
basic plumbing
Electrics
Blah blah

Yes you could do a course and meet the grade etc but you could not do electrics even if just domestic and meet that grade unless you had studied for a few months before hand unlike the others.

So, although all trades have value and deserve to be paid well I think it is clear that electrics is more technical and dangerous.

Having said that i have worked in many areas in my time including: Glass, Carpentry, Tiles, Engineering,
I suppose it comes down to the level of craftsmanship / degree of skill / expertise etc.

If your a carpenter is your capability making and fitting a window or making and fitting a bespoke kitchen.

tiler, installing a simple splash back or complex Victorian designs

When the demand is there you can charge as much as you can get.

I think though at the mo with so many ppl out of work the public knows they can get some unemployed person to do work cheap. And what unemployed skilled person would refuse cash for there skills.

From what I see the public will either want to pay peanuts for the world or pay an arm and a leg for nothing. I.e. either have a really cheap job done or pay a huge amount of money playing safe with a big company.

the smaller companies seem to be between a rock and a hard place although will probably do a better job than both above.

So, the way I see it is you'll alway get someone saying how much money they earned.

The prob with sparking is as long as the customer gets that cert they think they are safe and that cert is also a means of bargaining for the customer as said earlier wires aint a visible or cosmetic attraction etc.

a cert means safe and thus bargain hard for lower prices.

Why oh why Part Public is not Public aware or is there a ploy in place creating a demand for the cert.

When the public are demanding the cert and made aware as with Gas safe surely the value of the spark will return.

god what a ramble

 

[stretchyboy]

If it takes someone six years to learn plastering then they must have an arm missing.

I'll be laughing about that on and off for the rest of the day

 

[joethepudding]

Guys I am afraid we live in an aesthetic world. If you are a finishing trade you wll be more valued by the customer.

I priced some work for a women last month, she was very happy to pay £1,500 for the fitted wardrobes. But she didn’t want a lintel over her new French doors because of the cost!!

She didn’t care that half her house could come down as long as her bedroom looked good.

That’s why I love lighting design as it gives us a chance to get in on the finishing touches.

 

[stretchyboy]

This is so true, we have an intruder alarm side of the business and i recently went to a guy in Barking who is a friend and he had just had his window double glazed in a lovely wood effect, been broken into for the second time in two years yet wouldn't part with 400 quid (which was parts only!!!) for a wirefree system with six sensors, three door contacts, gsm dialler(no phone line in house) to protect it all ................ I think we are all living in bizarro land at the moment. Too many "deals" going round people are just waiting for someone to do things at a loss all the time.

 

[aptsys]

...wouldn't part with 400 quid (which was parts only!!!) for a wirefree system...

Neither would I. No one with common sense would opt for a wireless alarm system!

 

[ezzzekiel]

took 4 years to complete apprenticeship as plasterer, although after 6 months i was out on my own.
mind you rendering, pebble dash etc to a while longer to master

 

[stretchyboy]

Neither would I. No one with common sense would opt for a wireless alarm system!

I used to think that for the last 17 years i've been installing wired systems, but if you buy good kit there is nothing wrong with them. This kit is Grade 2 so it can connect to a central station/ police if you want and has 5yr battery life on sounder, 3yr battery life in panel and 2-3 years on detectors depending on usage....... half day install and no mess.

 

[cantabrian9]

yeh i can believe this kind of rate like one member said they normally work on price ,joiners on shopfitting normally get around 150 per day +30 to 40 per day Xs and they are only sticking a bit of wood up!!!! then you get some dipstick job foreman(joiner)shouting c;mon sparks yer holding the job up when they have finished banging their nails in ETC we are just starting second fix + commisioning!!!!!

 

[devon1]

Testing job nearby paying £11 per hour Self employed, all qualifications required, £8.60 paye government job. There ain't t no money in sparks jobs and there will not be again, if you can get out do it or if your happy on low pay stick with it, but forget about earning any descnt money. I don't think the rates will ever come back to what they should.

 

[Adam W]

Not while there are so many people offering to work for free.
Does that happen in other trades? Do tilers, plumbers, painters and decorators etc work for free to gain experience?

 

[paulthe spark]

I wouldn't worry guys the money will get
much better soon due to all the guys dropping out the trade due to poor wages there will be a shortage of sparks soon and this will again reflect on the wages

 

[devon1]

paulthe spark, This won't happen this time due to the new influx of workers from overseas. There are many sparks available at low wages, The sparks dropping out have found something better or retiring and are being replaced with sparks who are prepared to work for lower wages. The people wanting the work done can get their work done for lower labour costs, they will never be forced to pay more. why would they want to hand over more money? Get used to low pay, it's here to stay.

 

[Lyngarth]

I have been doing this work as a DI for two years now, before that, decorating and tiling, of which I still do a bit now and then.

I charge a flat rate of £185 per day (8 hrs ) for decorating or tiling and £210 for electrical work.

Have not been without work for the last 20+ yrs, but I find it a lot easier getting the money for the decorating than anything else.

Poeple can see the end results with this but not with wiring, so they think your on the make all the time.

 

[pennywise]

Maybe I could start tiling the fronts of socket outlets with mosaic tiles, or painting murals on them, I could start charging proper money and the customer might pay me on time

 

[livelounge]

I just feel as every trades getting easier ours osgetting harder there is always more electrical stuff going in to places now and what really annoys me is when someone wnats a job doing and go and tell them what involved in it and they dont want it done no-more do they think there is batteries behind switches and sockets really getting ----ed of with the trade now

 

[paulthe spark]

Lyngarth u only need to learn the art of plastering and you will be able to offer the complete service lol also what area are you in cuz at those sorts of rates ud b laughed at where I live but I'm up in the north I suppose

 

[cantabrian9]

every proper spark on this forum appears to be disallusioned the domestic boys buy test gear etc not cheap compared to just the odd trowel and float now and again (no calibration needed either!!) like others have quoted people DO NOT UNDERSTAND what is involved to get a light to work or power to a socket (when i was on my apprenticeship the spark told me "always remember boy WE are the scientist of the building trades") NOT NOW ? SAD!!

 

[martysparky]

I think it is fair to say that sparks do similar work as an accountant with all the math and regs etc involved nowdays but with the added graft of physical work.

we should be getting paid more for the amount of information to be considered not pushed / dumbed down.

What are all the regs going to do when nobody will pay for a spark and no spark can afford to meet the regs.

with that in mind is it a class collar war we are loosing.