Advice wanted - unhappy with rewire

[remedial]

any update?

for what its worth, my opinion is that while it may be totally safe and technically acceptable, they have cut corners to save time, which will result in a poor finish.

 

[rapparee]

any update?

for what its worth, my opinion is that while it may be totally safe and technically acceptable, they have cut corners to save time, which will result in a poor finish.

The plasterer cut corners, the spark could have a legitimate excuse for routing the SWA in front of the skirting board. We can't see behind it.

 

[Rpa07]

Plasterer . . . . Spark there’s only one way!

 

[MJPD29]

Realistically the work could be fine and nothing in the pictures bar the loose cable suggests anything is actually wrong. Yes, maybe rough cutting out and I would have used conduit but there's nothing that indicates it is dangerous. I even see a grommet on the box so it can't be that bad...

 

[MJPD29]

Also your plasterer is rubbish

 

[Sarah123]

any update?

for what its worth, my opinion is that while it may be totally safe and technically acceptable, they have cut corners to save time, which will result in a poor finish.

Yep I think you're right on that one. They came Monday and sorted the sockets that had issues and have provided the certificates to show all relevant checks were done. They claimed a miscommunication and that they thought I wanted it all done in one go. Like you say the final product doesn't look great, but at least I can feel confident it's safe as we moved in yesterday. All in all wouldn't recommend them or use them again. Thanks for everyone's input

 

[DPG]

Glad things are looking more positive. Thanks for letting us know.

 

[Des 56]

[QUOTE="essex, post: 1510925, member: 107635" I am not saying it is ok to rip someone off but I am saying that expectations of work quality will be linked to the price paid.

Pay peanuts, get monkeys.[/QUOTE]

What a load of nonsense
Using that logic the more someone is prepared to pay the higher the standard of work that is expected

I personally have always kept my prices as low as possible whilst maintaining my work standard at the upper end of high when compared to most others

It has also been well documented that high prices tend to be the remit of many if not all cowboy companies

 

[spark 68]

Exactly Des,
If the spark had charged on the low side it would have been pay peanuts yada yada, if he had charged high then it would have been rip-off merchant, I don't see how the electrical firm could have won a fair trial on here
the plasterer looked crap but I digress, Essex knows F-all anyway so I am just ignoring him as ever/per usual , just like the good ol' days

 

[spynage]

I fill all my chases as standard. Feel stupid now with everyone saying its not a bad job. Why is that consumer unit practically sitting on the floor? To the OP how much did the job cost?

 

[Stuey]

this is how it should look.

View attachment 47965

this is how it should look.

View attachment 47965

 

[Stuey]

I hope this isn't one of yours ! Ring main Earths are one cable per terminal not two as in your picture

 

[telectrix]

I hope this isn't one of yours ! Ring main Earths are one cable per terminal not two as in your picture

if you're referring to my last post/pic., then you're talking bolloX. separating the cpc's between terminals is only required with a hi-integrity earthing circuit. eg. with computers. check your eggs regs. and come back with a reason for your comment.

 

[westward10]

I rarely use both earth terminals.

 

[telectrix]

just checked stuey's profile. he's new here. a good spanking and a megger on his testes will sort him out. .

 

[ChrisElectrical88]

I never use both earth teminals unless swapping and they wont reach.

 

[Midwest]

just checked stuey's profile. he's new here. a good spanking and a megger on his testes will sort him out. .

You wanna be careful saying things like that. SWD would have a field day.

 

[Stuey]

if you're referring to my last post/pic., then you're talking bolloX. separating the cpc's between terminals is only required with a hi-integrity earthing circuit. eg. with computers. check your eggs regs. and come back with a reason for your comment.

 

[Stuey]

if you're referring to my last post/pic., then you're talking bolloX. separating the cpc's between terminals is only required with a hi-integrity earthing circuit. eg. with computers. check your eggs regs. and come back with a reason for your comment.

My reason is common sense most electronic devices use switchmode transformers which filter to earth .The regs state " which can be reasonably be expected to exceed 10ma " .Well it's your choice mate .But considering socket outlets come with two terminals !
It appears you have over reacted to a quite Justified statement .It wasn't meant as an insult to your work sorry if you took it that way . 543.7.2 ( 18 )

 

[Midwest]

I've wanted to know how putting the RFC cpc's in separate earth terminals, assist in high integrity earthing, if someone could help me out.

 

[Kojak]

Call building control at your local council, tell them whats happend and ask how to enforce your consumer rights.

 

[telectrix]

I've wanted to know how putting the RFC cpc's in separate earth terminals, assist in high integrity earthing, if someone could help me out.

ssssimplees it's in case 1 falls out due to incompetent installation.

 

[telectrix]

My reason is common sense most electronic devices use switchmode transformers which filter to earth .The regs state " which can be reasonably be expected to exceed 10ma " .Well it's your choice mate .But considering socket outlets come with two terminals !
It appears you have over reacted to a quite Justified statement .It wasn't meant as an insult to your work sorry if you took it that way . 543.7.2 ( 18 )

no offence taken, but you should research as to why the cpcs should be separated betweed 2 terminals.

 

[Stuey]

I've wanted to know how putting the RFC cpc's in separate earth terminals, assist in high integrity earthing, if someone could help me out.

no offence taken, but you should research as to why the cpcs should be separated betweed 2 terminals.

Again no offence meant .But I have .This has become more of an issue in domestic Installations with the popularity in Led lighting and other newer electronic devices now using filtered PSU's . The main point is safety due to possible earth current transfer from device to device either resulting in capacitor induced shock or even fire . As someone else has stated this can result from a bad connection either by a high resistance connection, mechanical damage or possible capacitor failure within the device itself .

 

[AJshep]

There is no need to seperate earth terminals on a Domestic install. You are right Stuey in what you say but lets not take things to the extreme.
This sounds like regurgitated carp from some college lecturer.
Switching PSUs are a slight problem we are all aware DC equipment has a higher earth leakage but how many does the average house have ?
Do you know how this installation is used by looking at a picture ? This install could be a elderly couple house, not a hackers house with multiple USB sockets and PSUs plugged in.
Led lighting is not usually applicable to either as this on the lighting circuit.

Lets not jump in and insult someones work, leave all this rubbish to the Facebook groups

 

[richy3333]

I hope this isn't one of yours ! Ring main Earths are one cable per terminal not two as in your picture

It’s not a fudging ring main!

 

[John Arnold]

What a terrible installation. Massive holes made for sockets really bad looks like they used an angle grinder to cut those and damaged the skirting board to. Height of consumer unit far too low eye level please. Where is the covering protection over the wiring?telectrix so right mate. That loose wire has no screw markings on it I guess it was not secured?You have my sympathy I hope they come back and correct their faults and give you your certificate( do not hold your breath).

 

[holychihuahua]

I have seen that type of plug burn before. When a plug on a small fan heater gets stood on and brocken any plug to hand is fitted on the heater as a replacement. The trouble is the replacement plug is not the same grade of plastic as the original and melts. That burn damage is on the builder or plasterer not the electrican.

 

[Astris]

Interesting to note the various comments from working electricians ... not a consistent set of comments. I think the polite ones are valid and illustrate that there is room for interpretation. One man's masterpiece is another man's pile of ****!
Are the metal boxes earthed?
Sharing or not sharing earth terminals on a ring cpc is something of a red herring in this context. I think that the reason that high integrity earths are run separately is because computer and other similar equipment (including switched mode PSUs) use filters to meet RFI specifications (to control imported and exported RF noise). They employ filters that connect reactive components (capacitors and inductors) between line conductors and the cpc and this can induce RF currents in the cpc cable linking the equipment to the system ground point. If we really care about controlling RF noise, we should avoid the use of any ring circuits at all and have one system ground point to which all cpcs are connected directly to the ground point in a star network.

 

[telectrix]

the purpose of separating the cpc's into separate terminals is in case 1 becomes loose or snapped, you'll still have earthing (protective and functional) to equipment .

 

[Astris]

the purpose of separating the cpc's into separate terminals is in case 1 becomes loose or snapped, you'll still have earthing (protective and functional) to equipment .

Yes, I understand what you are saying and don't dispute the point. If you think about it, one or two terminals can suffer the same fate.

I was trying to explain why problems can occur with RCD protection on modern equipment (e.g. computers with switched mode PSUs drawing several amps at 230V) - by design, current will flow through the cpc and unbalance the RCD. Not everybody understands that.

 

[telectrix]

agree with some leakage on IT eqwuipment, but each item should typically have a leakage current of 3 - 4 mA. this will only upset a RCD if too many items are on 1 RCD.

 

[AJshep]

Yes, I understand what you are saying and don't dispute the point. If you think about it, one or two terminals can suffer the same fate.

I was trying to explain why problems can occur with RCD protection on modern equipment (e.g. computers with switched mode PSUs drawing several amps at 230V) - by design, current will flow through the cpc and unbalance the RCD. Not everybody understands that.

I think this is maybe what Stuey was getting at when he stated 543.7.2 but this is a separate issue. We generally work through the regs book and earth leakage is mentioned previously in 531.3.2 , we should select the correct type of RCD for the installation as per 531.3.4

You are right in what you say, this is becoming more of an issue.
But on the other hand this is different issue to putting two CPC of a Domestic RFC in the same terminal, especially where most of the switching PSUs will most likely be small types like phone chargers which are mostly double insulated phone chargers.

 

[Pete999]

We are talking about high integrity earthing are we not? I'll wait for an answer before I carry on, if that's OK.

 

[Astris]

We are talking about high integrity earthing are we not? I'll wait for an answer before I carry on, if that's OK.

Probably should continue under a new thread?

 

[Astris]

But on the other hand this is different issue to putting two CPC of a Domestic RFC in the same terminal, especially where most of the switching PSUs will most likely be small types like phone chargers which are mostly double insulated phone chargers.

Yes, I agree.

Would you consider a domestic installation as unlikely to need consideration for high integrity earthing unless there is a specific reason (e.g. medical equipment)?

 

[Pete999]

Yes, I agree.

Would you consider a domestic installation as unlikely to need consideration for high integrity earthing unless there is a specific reason (e.g. medical equipment)?

No not unless the copulative earth leakage current exceeded 10mA Regulation 543.7.1

 

[DPG]

Copulative leakage. Brill

 

[Pete999]

Copulative leakage. Brill

For that read cumulative, predictive text, my foot sorry all for the gaff.

 

[ruston]

Copulative leakage. Brill

I have an answer for that but I have never had a warning so far.