consultation of new tenant pack for scotland

[oldtimer]

I wrote to the consultation committee and apparently I have been asked to fill in a respondant form ? so I wrote this below and then added more comments to my reply also below so have a read and tell me what you think.Also just to add if this is made law then the wording a Landlord must get a PAT testing or EICR or a EVIR from a registered contractor is essentially a closed shop.

Dear Sir or Madam
Ihave read through your consultation pack and would like to highlight a section in it that I have listed below you may want your legal team to look at with regards to the “approved contractor” definition as I wouldpoint out that there are 2 electrical “Scheme providers” in Scotland Select and NICEIC .

My understanding of the European Act of freetrade is that no individual should be forced to join an organisation against his or her will and that they should not be excluded or discriminated from conducting and running their business because they are not a member of an organisation. I would also point out that there is currently no legal requirement to register with either of the 2 organisations named above.

I would also point out that if the consultation of this paper has included the view and recommendations of the 2 Scheme providers named above then would this not be a conflict ofinterest for these 2 organisations as they would financially benefit from any enforcement from a new Scottish act or law.

My understanding is that if an individual has all the legal qualifications and the necessary insurance cover plus they are registered with HMRC then in the eyes of the law they have a legal right to trade

A couple of other points Portable ApplianceTesting or as it is put PAT does not exist under the current code of practice.The correct legal term is In-Service Inspection and Testing of ElectricalEquipment as this encompasses fixed electrical equipment within a dwelling so a definition of what equipment is to be tested will have tobe produced as a built in electric oven is a fixed appliance and not a portable one. Also what is the definition of a “current electrical safety certificate” does this mean an EICR Electrical Inspection Condition Report i.e.the replacement for the Periodic Inspection Report or is this a supplementary test on top of an EICR and if so what are the specifications or limitations asgetting a full EICR for a property every time there is a change of occupancy isin my view going to financially impact the rental industry that in turn means extra cost for the tenant.


2.2 Electrical Safety
Your landlord must make sure electrical wiring and electrical appliances in your
property are safe to use. Responsible landlordswill carry out Portable Appliance
Testing (PAT) on appliances and have acurrent electrical safety certificate from an
approvedc ontractor




Hi Graeme

I have completed the document and saved it as a pdf see attached. Also I was not sure as an individual or Group/organisation as I am a self employed electrician who specialises in residential repair and maintenance.



Also I am not writing because Ihave an axe to grind with the scheme providers it is just that my turnover and business model is too small for me to afford the fees although I am concerned with the position that they are in as over the last year we have seen big changes with regards to electrical rules and regulations but the problem is the cost of having to keep up with regards to documentation and technical manuals as mall business has to get.



My main concern is they have replaced the Periodic Inspection Report with a Electrical Installation Condition Report and that fine as this is documented under the BS 7671 but some scheme providers have certification software and on it they have a EVIR a Electrical Visual Inspection Report which sounds fine until you realise this is not in the BS7671 regulation so this will cause a lot of confusion as it is really just a cut down version of the EICR.



I understand that there are costs to landlords i.e. getting a EICR every time you “change occupancy” is a very expensive task for the landlord and the tenant as they will have to pay this so in my view I would say if a properties electrical installation is in good condition then there should be an EICR every 5 years with a EVIR on a change of occupancy.



Also is the EVIR a legal document as it is not in BS7671 ? plus there will be a lot of confusion becausea EICR is a thorough check of the property and a EVIR is just a visual and if you can bear with me on this to do a proper EICR takes between 4-6 hours yet big companies who are registered with scheme providers are completing 4-6 a daywhich means that individual has taken 2 hours to do an EICR that does not add up as it is not getting policed .



Anyway thanks for your time

 

[Des 56]

If the consultation is as all encompassing as the one they are having in England,then your fine words and concern will count for zilch unfortunately

I did notice that you made mention of speedy EICRs, but you did not make concern to them with regard competency of people doing these EICRs,
The big roll EICRs present the biggest farce facing controls in England Scotland and Wales

Good luck and well done with your representation (my own letter to our Welsh lot was a complete and utter waste of time and effort on my part)

 

[oldtimer]

Yes I tend to agree I now realise that i could have been more detailed but it was a rush job

Also sorry for the layout as when you copy and paste the system joins some of the words do I think I have sorted it

 

[BigBreakfast]

I find it concerning too Old Timer.

We should not be forced down the route of signing up to schemes just to service landlords. Our qualifications and experience should be what counts.

Also if this goes through, then not only will the small competent sparky be out of pocket but also the landlords too, as they will be forced to pay big bucks for shoddy, speedy inspections, in a lot of cases.

 

[oldtimer]

I know I sound pompus when I say that my business model cannot afford to join a schemie but you have put it over to them who run their lives via powerpoint presentations and as I have said before I do not do a job big enough to get inspected as the majority of my work is repairs ie lights not working,faulty switch or socket ,replace a light fitting sort a immersion or storage heater and because I am not VAT registered ie my turnover is no were near £76k a year I feel that I am in a niche market that is cost effective for the letting agent/landlord or customer because the bigger businesses charge a lot more and they can leave a job for weeks where I am sorting 95% of jobs within 1-2 days and this means a lot to the letting agent /landlord who has a tenant complaining. One example would be a I was called out to a "Atlantic" megaflow type system where Atlantic UK went bust and the tank needed a new housing tube fitted for the ceramic element but after doing all te leg work and supplying the letting agents plumber (from Glasgow) they are getting a new tube next week ie 2 weeks after the tenant reported the problem.

So the message that I am trying to get over is dont squeeze the wee guy out as it has been proven that they can supply a good service because as I am trying to tell the consultation people that when you legislate it will be the hard pressed tenant picking up the tab so that you can have an extra layer of what you think is protection but is really a just a way of reducing standards ie 4-6 EICRs a day

So this is the message that I am trying to

 

[a12jpm]

Good letter old timer.

Im in the same boat sort of. I refuse to sign up to a scam provider also, don't see any real benefit for me, just them. All councils/landlords seem happy with my work being signed off apart from Perth and Kinross who will only accept a cert from a scam member. Normally copy of my qualifications and a calibration certificate is enough for Stirling,clacks, Falkirk etc. building control depts.

If you don't object can I use some of your wording from your letter as I'm in "conversation" with p&k council about it is at the moment.

Cheers.

 

[baldelectrician]

Good letter old timer.

Im in the same boat sort of. I refuse to sign up to a scam provider also, don't see any real benefit for me, just them. All councils/landlords seem happy with my work being signed off apart from Perth and Kinross who will only accept a cert from a scam member. Normally copy of my qualifications and a calibration certificate is enough for Stirling,clacks, Falkirk etc. building control depts.

If you don't object can I use some of your wording from your letter as I'm in "conversation" with p&k council about it is at the moment.

Cheers.

That's my point- I see landlord checks done by handymen.
If you are in a scheme or can prove compotence that should be fine- that's the way most building controls work in my area

Things need tightened up but it's the landlords that need to buck their ideas up

Look at it this way chaps;
5% of landlord properties are checked properly in Scotland at present.
That's 95 % to be done- plenty of work to go round

As far as being too small to be in a scheme - my turnover is below £35K and I find being in SELECT beneficial- it more than pays for itself