Xmas lights

picturevalve · Nov 19, 2024

Bought a set recently from a Bedfordshire supplier, although a Chinese firm.
Couldn't believe the "mains" cable and the fitted fuse.
Mains cable is flat 3mm x 0.6mm. Fuse is 13A!!!
Plug is one of those Chinese specials with reduced dimensions.
See pic.

littlespark · Nov 19, 2024

did you buy it like that? without the cover on the fuse?

I wonder if someone in the shop robbed the 3A fuse from it for something else

theres many products that come with 'low profile' moulded on plugs..... from reputable manufacturers... not just chinese cr*p.

"3mm x 0.6mm" doesnt sound right.... what does it say on the flex?

picturevalve · Nov 19, 2024

littlespark said:
did you buy it like that? without the cover on the fuse?

I wonder if someone in the shop robbed the 3A fuse from it for something else

theres many products that come with 'low profile' moulded on plugs..... from reputable manufacturers... not just chinese cr*p.

"3mm x 0.6mm" doesnt sound right.... what does it say on the flex?

No I removed the cover to show the fuse, the cable is unmarked and the dimensions are as quoted, nowhere near a standard 6A flat cable. The worst part is that these are supplied with a 13A fuse fitted. Since posting I've removed the cover off of the control unit and the "mains" cable conductors are both white, the ends soldered onto the cct. board and secured with a blob of hotmelt glue (or similar).

James · Nov 19, 2024

Well, it appears to be C E marked. the fuse may not be relevant if the device is protected against over current by its internal circuitry.

It is certainly a low quality product in my opinion and I would throw it in the bin.

littlespark · Nov 19, 2024

It doesnt need a 6A cable.... and TBH, a 3A fuse would probably be oversized for it anyway...
As mentioned, the internel circuitry will limit the load... but i dont think theres anything to worry about... as long as you dont plug it in with the cover off like that

picturevalve · Nov 19, 2024

littlespark said:
It doesnt need a 6A cable.... and TBH, a 3A fuse would probably be oversized for it anyway...
As mentioned, the internel circuitry will limit the load... but i dont think theres anything to worry about... as long as you dont plug it in with the cover off like that

I agree, it's entirely dangerous.
1. 13A fuse
2. Suspect cable.
3. No clamp on mains cable sheath.
4. Non-compliant plug body.
5. Sufficient isolation betwwen mains and led cabling?

I've had cause in the past to refer this type of thing to the standards body, they tried to fob me off and said go to Trading Standards. I had to read them their own regulations before they accepted the complaint.
Needless to say, I heard no more about it.

littlespark · Nov 19, 2024

1. 13A or 3A…. It’s only there for short circuit, not overload.

2. Why is it suspect? It’s 2 core, sheathed and looks sufficient size for the load. If it doesn’t have a polarity marked, then it doesn’t matter.

3. The glue is holding it as it is, but the removed cover will grip the flex if replaced properly

4. Why is it non compliant? Other products use the same plug shape.

5. The set glue creates the isolation. The cable cannot move.

cireland · Nov 20, 2024

This might sound silly,but bear with me. Have you tried taking out hte fuse and plugging them in?
'Big Clive' on his youtube channel has shown that the fuse is sometimes not in circuit.

snowhead · Nov 20, 2024

Agree with Littlespark,

Plus althought it's marked C E, that's not the E.U approval symbol, that's the China Export symbol.

On the true C E symbol both the C and E are formed from slightly more than half a circle.
In the above China Export symbol C and E are formed from half a circle.

However in almost all cases it's manufacturing companies that sign off the true CE approval and keep paperwork, the goods don't go to any independant lab for testing / checking so it's pointless relying on it being any safer with or without.

picturevalve · Nov 20, 2024

littlespark said:
1. 13A or 3A…. It’s only there for short circuit, not overload.

2. Why is it suspect? It’s 2 core, sheathed and looks sufficient size for the load. If it doesn’t have a polarity marked, then it doesn’t matter.

3. The glue is holding it as it is, but the removed cover will grip the flex if replaced properly

4. Why is it non compliant? Other products use the same plug shape.

5. The set glue creates the isolation. The cable cannot move.

BS1363/A specifies the plug dimensions. If the plug doesn't meet these requirements I would think it is non-compliant.

James · Nov 20, 2024

snowhead said:
Agree with Littlespark,

Plus althought it's marked C E, that's not the E.U approval symbol, that's the China Export symbol.
On the true C E symbol both the C and E are formed from slightly more than half a circle.
In the above China Export symbol C and E are formed from half a circle.

However in almost all cases it's manufacturing companies that sign off the true CE approval and keep paperwork, the goods don't go to any independant lab for testing / checking so it's pointless relying on it being any safer with or without.

View attachment 118729

My interpretation would be that the product has got a C E mark, not china export mark.
C E the left side of the E lines up with the theoretical tangent of the extended inner circle of the C

whereas the china export, the left side of the E lines up with the centre line of the C

Tom256 · Nov 20, 2024

James said:
My interpretation would be that the product has got a C E mark, not china export mark.
C E the left side of the E lines up with the theoretical tangent of the extended inner circle of the C

whereas the china export, the left side of the E lines up with the centre line of the C

BS 1363 plugs do not have a C E mark. The C E mark is a self certification that it meets relevant European standards the BS 1363 plug is for the UK market and must not be C E marked as National standards apply.
A C E mark on a BS 1363 plug regardless of type setting indicates = BIN. It is likely to be unsafe and should not be used.

Tom256 · Nov 21, 2024

Tom256 said:
BS 1363 plugs do not have a C E mark. The C E mark is a self certification that it meets relevant European standards the BS 1363 plug is for the UK market and must not be C E marked as National standards apply.
A C E mark on a BS 1363 plug regardless of type setting indicates = BIN. It is likely to be unsafe and should not be used.

From the picture (hard to tell) it also looks like the Earth Pin is sleeved which also indicates forgery and non-compliance with BS 1363 = Take it out of the Bin then throw it back in the BIN... but harder.

For reference see alsothe Code of Practice for In service inspection and testing of electrical equipment 5th edition section 10.14. for the correct markings that should be seen

The Uk Plugs and Socket (Safety) Regulations 1994 refer back to BS 1363 as required due to , for example, the use of circuits such as Socket ring circuits with 32 A / 30 A OCPD in the UK

littlespark · Nov 21, 2024

The UK plug has the BS mark on it… not CE

The light control box has the CE mark. Stick a different plug on it, and it can be sold in Europe.

The plug is fine

The control box is fine (or was until the sealed cover was taken off)

There is nothing wrong with this being sold in the UK.

cireland · Nov 21, 2024

Does it take the use of a tool to access the live connections?

littlespark · Nov 21, 2024

cireland said:
Does it take the use of a tool to access the live connections?

Looking at the picture on #3, I expect it was plastic clips that needed a screwdriver to prise open… maybe not secure now if bent.

Superglue would fix that

cireland · Nov 21, 2024

littlespark said:
Looking at the picture on #3, I expect it was plastic clips that needed a screwdriver to prise open… maybe not secure now if bent.

Superglue would fix that

That is not always the case with these type of lights.

Also, is the output at mains voltage? If so, is the outgoing cable double insulated?

picturevalve · Nov 21, 2024

cireland said:
That is not always the case with these type of lights.

Also, is the output at mains voltage? If so, is the outgoing cable double insulated?

Cover secured with plastic clips, not bent nor damaged by removal. I am surprised anyone on here would consider a blob of glue to be an effective mains lead clamp. As said above, sleeved earth pin another pointer to non-standard plug, not that it goes anywhere-only a 2 core "cable". A fault leading to a fault current of a few amps would make for some pretty fireworks with a 13A fuse in the plug, also.
Will check it out thoroughly shortly.

littlespark · Nov 21, 2024

Its a 2 core cable... .the earth pin of the plug isnt connected to anything... It could be a plastic pin.... it doesnt matter. Its there to open the shutters in the socket... nothing else.

Is there a double-insulated symbol on the controller anywhere? square within a square?

Tom256 · Nov 21, 2024

littlespark said:
The plug is fine

I beg to differ. A BS 1363 plug can have a solid plastic pin for use as an Insulated shutter opening device (ISOD) on devices where such is suitable. They can of course be solid brass* however, this plug is marked BS1363/A and a BS1363 plug cannot have a partial sleeved earth pin so an Earth pin part sleeved is ALWAYS counterfeit.
The plug is counterfeit but marked BS 1363 why would it not be, it's counterfeit anything goes, so what makes anyone feel ok saying the rest of this device is fine to use if the plug is simply changed?
Put what ever marks you like on it. Put 'BS 1363' on a plug that is not BS1363 compliant, mark it with anything you wish, mark it as double insulated and if it should be marked such what does that now tell you?

Most will buy and not give it a moments thought, I have seen these plugs come apart leaving the pin from the line conductor live in the socket after the plug was 'removed'.
I have seen fake BS 1362 fuses, who knows what they will take under fault. On some the fuse is for show and the cables are connected direct to the pins. As I said anything goes.

What is the specification on the cables insulation?

I could go on. This item is not fine and should not be trusted but just my thoughts you have yours.

My view... Destroy it or hand it to Trading Standards.

* Brass with the BS 1363 specification copper %