Issueing "danger notices"

[Octopus]

So who does these and why?

This has been passed to me for my comments by a customer:

The "issue" is lack of end to end continuity of one of the socket circuits - I don't think this is a sensible use of a danger notice.

Do you?

 

[SJD]

The "Dangerous Condition" is "N/A", therefore there is no reason given, it is not even filled out correctly.

But I agree, lack of end-to-end continuity is not a sensible reason.

 

[westward10]

I have rarely issued one of these, it is not very often you come across something which warrants immediate attention and in this case certainly not.

 

[sevuk]

Dangerous condition: n/a

Customer has lived with it for four years...

This guy needs a lesson in report writing. Sounds like the beginning of a really boring novella.

 

[Andy78]

I issue danger notices sometimes, I did one last week.
I usually reserve them for issues that would attract a C1 on an inspection where no immediate rectification is possible for whatever reason.

Just looked and I have 12 danger notifications in my files. 11 of them are for access to live parts less than IP2X without the use of a tool or key, and one is for a lack of main earth to a property where the customer was insistent I could crack on and install the wall lights he wanted. I issued that one to provoke a bit of thought.

The one in the OP should never have been a danger notice.

 

[freddo]

I don't use them often, I think I have issued 4 in the last 11 years.

 

[The Ghost]

The last time I used one of them is when the cut-out was hanging off the wall, water had penetrated the consumer units, wiring was burnt out, verdigree on terminals, old cloth covered tails soaking wet, IR readings of <1 Mohm, Consumer units rotted away (old wylex), exposed live parts, main fuse had blown (replaced by DNO), no lighting, difficult access (cellar with no stairs)...need I go on?

 

[snowhead]

The last time I used one of them is when the cut-out was hanging off the wall, water had penetrated the consumer units, wiring was burnt out, verdigree on terminals, old cloth covered tails soaking wet, IR readings of <1 Mohm, Consumer units rotted away (old wylex), exposed live parts, main fuse had blown (replaced by DNO), no lighting, difficult access (cellar with no stairs)...need I go on?

Nothing too serious then.

 

[Des 56]

Am I right in thinking firstly that these notices need to be signed by the customer ?
I personally see no situation where these notices serve any purpose,I suspect they probably would not be acceptable for any legal proceedings

I honestly see no purpose at all in issuing these notices

 

[freddo]

I think they are mostly just a quick way of informing the customer in writing, the customer signs to say they have been informed. Any fires, shocks, deaths etc. after that then it's the customers fault.

 

[kingeri]

I have never done one but I have put my concerns in writing to awkward customers before, kind of the same thing really I suppose.

 

[Dave OCD]

I'd always try to deal with anything really dodgy there and then.

 

[Risteard]

Very seldom.

In the past year or so two that I can think of.

One Electrical Danger Notification for exposed live parts at a DB that they were adamant that they would rectify themselves. (Once the Danger Notification came through the door I had another phonecall asking what they needed to do to rectify it - which proved my belief that they had no sense of urgency about it before.)

And one Notice of Potential Hazard (the equivalent notice in the south of Ireland) when the incoming neutral tail was switched through the MCB for the immersion heater and the entire return path for the installation was through the Main Protective Conductor (which was also undersized) to the DSO's PEN conductor. It was established that this had been done to bypass the ESB meter. Although a rented premises, there was a distinct lack of urgency in addressing it.

 

[1Justin]

I do one now and then. The last was for "Potential danger" in a rented property on TT without up-front RCD and ~ 100 Ohm Ra. It was the nicest way I could put it since the tenants were running about oblivious. Without it I suspect nothing would have happened. (Maybe it still hasn't).

 

[7029 dave]

They are ok, for bringing unsafe situations for the attention to the client, cover --- so to speak.

 

[Risteard]

They are ok, for bringing unsafe situations for the attention to the client, cover --- so to speak.

"Rectum protectum."

 

[dmxtothemax]

QUOTE - [ I honestly see no purpose at all in issuing these notices ].
what about avoiding legal liability issue's ?
If your concerned about a certain danger
you advise the customer, customer says no
for what ever reason, maybe no money ?
If you issue a notice, then the ball is in there court
should something happen down the track.
sound logical to me
Have I missed some thing ?

 

[baldelectrician]

The last time I used one of them is when the cut-out was hanging off the wall, water had penetrated the consumer units, wiring was burnt out, verdigree on terminals, old cloth covered tails soaking wet, IR readings of <1 Mohm, Consumer units rotted away (old wylex), exposed live parts, main fuse had blown (replaced by DNO), no lighting, difficult access (cellar with no stairs)...need I go on?

Up here the DNO (Scottish Power) would refuse to reconnect the supply without a certificate from an electrician saying the install was tested and OK.

 

[baldelectrician]

I use these occasionally (2/3 in past year). I may use more than most as I do a lot of inspection and testing for 'skint' landlords.
It covers my back and places the liability on the client / landlord where there are exposed live parts.

Was at one on Friday to connect a cooker where the consumer unit had blanks missing - new tenants from down south who were unaware that the landlord had to install mains smoke detectors (not done) and provide a satisfactory electrical cert (also not done)

 

[The Ghost]

Up here the DNO (Scottish Power)

Well down here (south) it is required to have a cert from electrician the installation is Kosher as well, no difference really. They do this by terms and conditions on their connection notice date.