Routing of earth cables...

[Boberto]

I was told today by a jumped up know it all that I am right in saying that 230V wiring should not be run alongside LV cabling (CCTV, BT, CAT 5, intruder etc) BUT it is ok to route these communication/LV cables with earth wires (main earthing conductors). I know where he's coming from but I know its b0llo<ks. Although an Earth cable isn't a conductor that is carrying current in normal conditions it is there to carry a lot of current in the event of a fault so should still be treated like a mains cable in the eyes of the regs and segregating mains from LV!

Can somebeody tell me the reg in the Bible so I can knock this twerp down a peg or two tomorrow please and win a bacon and egg roll in the process!?

Cheers!

 

[Marvo]

Running them together won't have any effect on the electrical installation so I doubt there's may electrical regulations about it. The problem will be with the data system whether it be phones, computer network or alarms so it's more likely to be in their regulations I'd imagine.

Common sense would dictate you use split/partitioned trunking where possible and keep a separation distance of an inch or two wherever you can.

*Edit* In our local electrical regs you wouldn't be permitted to run the earth of a circuit in a different route to the live and neutral wires.

 

[Andy78]

528.1 deals with separation of band one and band two circuits. Band one being elv, up to 50v, band two being low voltage, 50v to 1000v.
You could argue that the bonding conductor is part of the low voltage system and should be classed as band two and therefore appropriately separated from band one.

you can email me that sandwich if you win.

 

[Boberto]

Thanks for the reply. I know the score with keeping the two apart. On houses you generally drill a set of holes through the joist for mains and another for tv, alarm and telecom. On the larger commercial jobs we've installed tray or basket parallel to each other with mains in the one and the other for the CAT 5s, coax and alarm etc.

What I am getting at is an Earth cable like the main bonding conductor to the gas or water (not a single) should still be grouped with the 230V wiring correct?

 

[High Tower]

Yes you are correct, a earth conductor is a mains rated cable in the event of a fault.

 

[kingeri]

I wouldn't go out of my way to route it with the data cables. Never had an instance where I've even considered it though.

 

[Boberto]

Thanking you Mr High Tower.

Can I have brown sauce on that roll please luv'?

 

[Marvo]

Ahhh I misunderstood your opening post, please ignore my comments.

 

[High Tower]

Well i dont have the BGB as its in the van and its cold!, but all cables within the same grouping or containment should be rated to the highest rating of the group, so cat 5's should be rated to 230v if ran with mains cable. so a earthing conductor would not affect any coms cables its still classed as a mains cable when operating under fault conditions.

 

[Boberto]

I have witnessed a lazy barsteward today zip tying a 10mm earth cable (run to the incoming gas mains) along a 12V cable powering a CCTV camera and a coax cable! I pointed out to him that it was wrong and got a right mouthful! No mechanical protection either on the outiside of a building! Since when did running a bit of tube become such hard work?!

 

[High Tower]

I have witnessed a lazy barsteward today zip tying a 10mm earth cable (run to the incoming gas mains) along a 12V cable powering a CCTV camera and a coax cable! I pointed out to him that it was wrong and got a right mouthful! No mechanical protection either on the outiside of a building! Since when did running a bit of tube become such hard work?!

It doesn't necessarily need mechanical protection when ran outside!

 

[onions1066]

I have witnessed a lazy barsteward today zip tying a 10mm earth cable (run to the incoming gas mains) along a 12V cable powering a CCTV camera and a coax cable! I pointed out to him that it was wrong and got a right mouthful! No mechanical protection either on the outiside of a building! Since when did running a bit of tube become such hard work?!

Since tie wraps were invented . It's one of my pet hates to see tie wrapped cables to other services

 

[Boberto]

Hmmm in my book it should be mechanically protected. It depends on the environment perhaps. I'm not talking a couple of meters of cable out of someones front door to a electrode. This was a 25m run across the outside of a building on the side of a alleyway!

 

[Andy78]

Hmmm in my book it should be mechanically protected. It depends on the environment perhaps. I'm not talking a couple of meters of cable out of someones front door to a electrode. This was a 25m run across the outside of a building on the side of a alleyway!

It is standard practice to run bonding cables outside with no protection and I see nothing wrong with it.
If it's in a public alleyway then it only requires mechanical protection when replacing it after the first time it gets pinched

 

[High Tower]

Ive pclipped a water bond 4m across the front of someones house before now, certainly not lost any sleep over it

 

[rickm]

I think its more about the rating of the cable . Not what voltage its carrying. Eg you could run a fp200 fire alarm cable with mains voltage cables because fp is rated up to 600v even though its only carrying 24v

 

[Robson689]

I think its more about the rating of the cable . Not what voltage its carrying. Eg you could run a fp200 fire alarm cable with mains voltage cables because fp is rated up to 600v even though its only carrying 24v

No you can't. Fire cables have to be separated from LV and ELV cables. Correct me if I'm wrong though (this is just what we were told at College).

 

[telectrix]

you are correct. 528.1, note 2,(refer to BS5266 and BS5839). and 560.7.1 and 560.7.7.