I
In_need_of_advice
Sorry for doing this as new members probably are a pain for doing this.
Recently I had a new bathroom installed in my house. I don't know any electricians in the area, but was given a number of a SELECT registered electrician. The plumber and joiner had already made a start on the bathroom before the electrician came along.
The job consisted of fitting 5 LED downlights, mounting a LED mirror above a sink cabinet which also has two LED strips that are activated by touching the side of the cabinet. The previous bathroom already had an electrical feed at the mirror and old style spot lights in the ceiling.
We didn't get a quote in advance from this electrician which was an error by ourselves. It's a father and son business.
The father and son visited my house one day and removed the old lights and left a temporary light hanging. They also took a feed to where the sink drawers would be. The walls were back at brickwork and easy access. The electrician is claiming 2x2=4 hour labour. The other tradesmen said they were barely there 1 hour.
The joiner then replaced the walls and covered them with splash panels. The roof was sagging a bit so the joiner also put a new frame around before fitting the PVC roof panels.
It was only the young guy who came back on his own weeks later. The other tradesmen had already informed me they thought he was an apprentice due to his skills. I also though he was, but his dad informs me we are all wrong.
The son openly admitted to us he struggled badly. He couldn't manage to mount the mirror on his own and didn't have a clue about how to wire the LED lights on the drawers. He was very open to us about this and told us it was a wasted day for him. He admitted he lost hours. That's ignoring his cigarette breaks and Facebook visits.
He had to come back weeks later to finish the job. It took him minutes to get the LED drawers working on return. The mirror was set far too high and with my assistance it took less than 10 minutes to move. It's only three screws.
When he was in the house and my other half asked him to swap 3 light switches (we supplied) and one of the lights had come loose in the ceiling right next to where he was working on the ladder. It took seconds to twist back in.
A few weeks later the bill arrived. It was for £850. No explanation for this amount. Just a labour cost and a materials cost. There was no email on the bill so I sent him a text. The reply was for 18 hours labour at £30, £100 for the 5 LED lights and £68 "other materials" all plus VAT.
The time spent in the house didn't amount to 18 hours and most of a day was lost as the son struggled so much. I asked if this work justified 18 hours labour? The dad refused to answer. I tried sending another message and got his email to ask for a response. Nothing for weeks.
He then offered a gesture of goodwill. A slight discount. I refused to see it as goodwill and asked for an explanation for the bill.
My complaint was the son took far too long to do simple jobs, didn't understand the instructions of the joiner where to drill the holes for the lights. He drilled lots of unrequired holes in the old plaster ceiling. That wasted time. The mirror and the drawers were a clear issue too. Also the hours charged for were incorrect.
He had also been smoking in the loft and never put the loft insulation back in place either.
I got a response today and it's a bit odd I'll say.
He has now reduced the amount of labour, but is now charging me 1.5 hours for travelling to make up for that. There is no mention of travel in the first two bills.
He won't admit his son struggled with the job, yet his son openly admitted this to the both of us.
He blames my partner for not sending him a photograph of the roof before the PVC panels were put up. The joiner left measurement and a picture from a phone isn't going to help much as you can't judge with that.
He says that the instructions for wiring the drawers were confusing and even the joiner and plumber couldn't understand them. I spoke to the plumber today and he said he didn't even look at the instructions. He's a plumber and not an electrician anyway. The plumber said the dad told him the drawers were easy to fit when he was there. It's only now they've become confusing.
The plumber also asked the cost to supply and fit the LED lights. The dad informed him £50 each.
In the dad's breakdown of each day's work there isn't much other than what I've said.
However it does include..
"Investigate and re-oreintate existing down light of stair half landing it had been poorly installed and was loose in ceiling". The young guy had the ladders out and the light was within reach. It's right next to the loft entrance where he was working. It was a case of push and twist it back in. It was literally seconds.
The father is now highlighting he had to move 2 hand luggage suitcases 6 feet across the loft. That would have also cost the grand total of about 30 seconds. It adds a lot of text to his job description, but it would have taken longer to type it than move the things.
Materials all excluding VAT.
1x Fuse only outlaw plate £3.31
1× Single surface box £1.30
1× Single F fin box 88p
1x deep single surface box £1.50
1× R.C.D spur unit £27.44
5× E8 downlights £100
5× E8 bezels £12.50
25mm 1m TTE cable £17.88
sundries, clips screws, connectors, sleeping etc £1.50
He refused to accept that there is a dispute and wants paid within 10 days or he will pursue the matter.
I've always been polite with the guy in an attempt to get a resolution. He just ignores me and today's letter is full of weak excuses and changed versions of events.
I'm not being unreasonable that £850 and 18 hours for the work is far, far too much?
What can I do in this situation? Thanks.
Recently I had a new bathroom installed in my house. I don't know any electricians in the area, but was given a number of a SELECT registered electrician. The plumber and joiner had already made a start on the bathroom before the electrician came along.
The job consisted of fitting 5 LED downlights, mounting a LED mirror above a sink cabinet which also has two LED strips that are activated by touching the side of the cabinet. The previous bathroom already had an electrical feed at the mirror and old style spot lights in the ceiling.
We didn't get a quote in advance from this electrician which was an error by ourselves. It's a father and son business.
The father and son visited my house one day and removed the old lights and left a temporary light hanging. They also took a feed to where the sink drawers would be. The walls were back at brickwork and easy access. The electrician is claiming 2x2=4 hour labour. The other tradesmen said they were barely there 1 hour.
The joiner then replaced the walls and covered them with splash panels. The roof was sagging a bit so the joiner also put a new frame around before fitting the PVC roof panels.
It was only the young guy who came back on his own weeks later. The other tradesmen had already informed me they thought he was an apprentice due to his skills. I also though he was, but his dad informs me we are all wrong.
The son openly admitted to us he struggled badly. He couldn't manage to mount the mirror on his own and didn't have a clue about how to wire the LED lights on the drawers. He was very open to us about this and told us it was a wasted day for him. He admitted he lost hours. That's ignoring his cigarette breaks and Facebook visits.
He had to come back weeks later to finish the job. It took him minutes to get the LED drawers working on return. The mirror was set far too high and with my assistance it took less than 10 minutes to move. It's only three screws.
When he was in the house and my other half asked him to swap 3 light switches (we supplied) and one of the lights had come loose in the ceiling right next to where he was working on the ladder. It took seconds to twist back in.
A few weeks later the bill arrived. It was for £850. No explanation for this amount. Just a labour cost and a materials cost. There was no email on the bill so I sent him a text. The reply was for 18 hours labour at £30, £100 for the 5 LED lights and £68 "other materials" all plus VAT.
The time spent in the house didn't amount to 18 hours and most of a day was lost as the son struggled so much. I asked if this work justified 18 hours labour? The dad refused to answer. I tried sending another message and got his email to ask for a response. Nothing for weeks.
He then offered a gesture of goodwill. A slight discount. I refused to see it as goodwill and asked for an explanation for the bill.
My complaint was the son took far too long to do simple jobs, didn't understand the instructions of the joiner where to drill the holes for the lights. He drilled lots of unrequired holes in the old plaster ceiling. That wasted time. The mirror and the drawers were a clear issue too. Also the hours charged for were incorrect.
He had also been smoking in the loft and never put the loft insulation back in place either.
I got a response today and it's a bit odd I'll say.
He has now reduced the amount of labour, but is now charging me 1.5 hours for travelling to make up for that. There is no mention of travel in the first two bills.
He won't admit his son struggled with the job, yet his son openly admitted this to the both of us.
He blames my partner for not sending him a photograph of the roof before the PVC panels were put up. The joiner left measurement and a picture from a phone isn't going to help much as you can't judge with that.
He says that the instructions for wiring the drawers were confusing and even the joiner and plumber couldn't understand them. I spoke to the plumber today and he said he didn't even look at the instructions. He's a plumber and not an electrician anyway. The plumber said the dad told him the drawers were easy to fit when he was there. It's only now they've become confusing.
The plumber also asked the cost to supply and fit the LED lights. The dad informed him £50 each.
In the dad's breakdown of each day's work there isn't much other than what I've said.
However it does include..
"Investigate and re-oreintate existing down light of stair half landing it had been poorly installed and was loose in ceiling". The young guy had the ladders out and the light was within reach. It's right next to the loft entrance where he was working. It was a case of push and twist it back in. It was literally seconds.
The father is now highlighting he had to move 2 hand luggage suitcases 6 feet across the loft. That would have also cost the grand total of about 30 seconds. It adds a lot of text to his job description, but it would have taken longer to type it than move the things.
Materials all excluding VAT.
1x Fuse only outlaw plate £3.31
1× Single surface box £1.30
1× Single F fin box 88p
1x deep single surface box £1.50
1× R.C.D spur unit £27.44
5× E8 downlights £100
5× E8 bezels £12.50
25mm 1m TTE cable £17.88
sundries, clips screws, connectors, sleeping etc £1.50
He refused to accept that there is a dispute and wants paid within 10 days or he will pursue the matter.
I've always been polite with the guy in an attempt to get a resolution. He just ignores me and today's letter is full of weak excuses and changed versions of events.
I'm not being unreasonable that £850 and 18 hours for the work is far, far too much?
What can I do in this situation? Thanks.
