DIY enthusiasts and electrical work.

[Pete999]

Probably a well thought and commonly discussed subject. I know the Forum has a DIY section, and has a policy of not offering step by step advice on how to do various electrical work, a good policy in my book, and I think many, if not all Electricians would agree with.

However this policy does not deter many DIYers and people who think they are Electricians from asking questions in very suspicious ways on "how do I do this that or the other, or I have been to B&Q and bought this and that, how would you do so and so.

It's difficult at times to explain to these people, that it's a dangerous thing to try and help without being off hand, and sometimes, when they won't or can't understand why you are reluctant to help, why won't you help the Guy in B&Q sold me this stuff and said it was easy as he was an Electrician because he had done a meaningless course, and he is now qualified as an Electrician.

With all the hype of Part P etc, do you not think the problem lies with the Government, the CPSchemes or who, I do realist that the likes of B&Q, Srewfix etc are a Godsend on a weekend or Bank Holiday when someone calls you up with a problem, and these are just a couple of outlets whereby you can get materials at short notice.

Where do you think the answer lies? should there be a ban on outlets like the two I have mentioned from selling electrical installation products to the public, should these outlets Police the selling of these products to qualified people, restrict selling this gear to the Trade areas, it would be interesting to share your thoughts, without prejudice, and I do realise this subject has been through the mill many times, the main reason I posted is that I was at B&Q the other day getting my tool fix, and happened to pass through the Electrical bit, and being a nosy git, I got speaking to this Bloke who was after some cable and sockets to wire his new extension, and found the price the Sparky was quoting far to high and as it was only a couple sockets he would do it himself, so why was he asking advice? where or who dose the problem lie with? Sorry for the long winded ramble.

 

[Spoon]

IMO:
Should the likes of B&Q stop selling electrical goods? No, but they should be more informative about the goods they sell and what is needed from an electrical view. E.g. Certs and the likes.
How would they class a 'qualified person'? Am I one in their eyes?
Where would you stop? OK, don't cell CU's or breakers/RCD's. Should DIYers be messing with these? In most cases not.
The problem is that these shores just care about money. They would sell a CU to a 10 year old if they could. They have no morals or consideration for safety. Just profit....
Gas has always been classed as dangerous, but electricity..... well that's just red to red & black to black.....

 

[Octopus]

The problem is made bigger by the fact that the manufacturers sell a lot of their products at the same prices to the big sheds as they do to the "wholesalers" - this means our "margin" makes the pricing look higher than it may well be......

Big sheds are only interested in making a profit ......

Nothing is going to change and I won't change my attitude towards have a go hero's on here or matey whose electrician "is on holiday", or wants to "check" the size of cable he needs.

Part P is irrelevant IMHO

 

[Dillb]

I have used the DIY stores for materials sometimes when the wholesalers have closed or arent open at weekends so taking that away would make life a lot more difficult for myself and I am sure many others who would be affected.

The main problem is bad workmanship and people leaving dangerous situations etc, and with the lack of underfunding for those that "police" that sort of thing nothing is going to change, it was almost as though those that held the budget strings were hoping that Part p would sort the problem out itself, but as we all know it has done nothing of the sort.

 

[Midwest]

The problem is that these shores just care about money. They would sell a CU to a 10 year old if they could. They have no morals or consideration for safety. Just profit....
Gas has always been classed as dangerous, but electricity..... well that's just red to red & black to black.....

It can be done with a bit of public persuasion.

Like you can't buy Evo stick etc, unless your over 18, or sharp knives etc. Yet can still buy gas stuff over the counter.

I think the concept of the schemes was a good idea, except it was not applied appropriately, and there are too few prosecutions are people flouting the law, Part P Building Regs that is. There's the recent thread on 'DIY lighting in a garage' as an example.

The DIY sheds have done a good thing by bringing down prices of materials, but have done a bad thing, by suggestion that 'you can do the odd job'. I mean what DIY'er needs a 50m drum of cable?

 

[telectrix]

I mean what DIY'er needs a 50m drum of cable?

to allow for the 4 x 10m lengths he's cocked up.

 

[FatAlan]

Pete, key word you used is ‘Police’. That ain’t going to happen due to cost. It’s like the big phone and internet based companies, I believe that they should be made more accountable for facilitating the crime that takes place via their systems.. but that’s going OT.

 

[CableTies]

If John Doe wants to do a like-for-like replacement on a light switch or a socket outlet then let him fill his boots. CU's and entire new ccts is another matter entirely but since you can order basically anything you want online now with no system of checking who's buying what, I don't think theres ever going to be a way to prevent the weekend warriors from having a go at wiring their extension because they watched a video on youtube and dont understand the risks involved.

Maybe if buildings or contents insurance required up to date EICR?

 

[TJ Anderson]

I may be going against the grain here but I am genuinely not worried about what other people do including doing their own electrical work to whatever extent they chose to.

They are adults that operate cars, have candles in their homes and many other things that have risk and are frankly responsible for thier own actions.

There have always been people who have had a go at fixing their own stuff. It's just part of life. With internet forums they just have more people to ask. Never worth getting worked up about. Just my opinion though.

 

[Deleted member 105166]

Perhaps the big DIY sheds should address this in the packaging, by placing a warning notice on certain products. This could be good from their own diligence viewpoint too. Online is a different matter - at the end of the day anyone can source anything if they are sufficiently determined. But where do you stop? This is a few years old, but still interesting nonetheless - DIY accidents:
Top tools for causing accidents:
1 Knives and scalpels (20,000 accidents in the UK each year);
2 Saws (15,000);
3 Grinders (6,500);
4 Hammers (6,000);
5 Chisels (4,000);
6 Screwdrivers (3,500);
7 Power drills (3,000);
8, 9 &10 Axes, planes and welding equipment (2,000 each).

 

[littlespark]

I went to a large warehouse type DIY store last week, for my own DIY. (not the orange shed, the green one)
I came away with a tube of the silicon eater stuff... to clean off silicon.... a little plastic scraper to remove the now squidgy silicon, and a packet of assorted blades for my multitool.

Now..... which one of these products flagged up the "is the customer over 18?" for the till jockey?

The very sharp teethed blades for the power tool? um.. .no

The solvent based substance that I guess doesn't taste too good? Uhuh nope.

Yes it was the little plastic scraper that cost me 59p

That's the sense of the big shed management.

 

[Squid]

Maybe stop everyone doing home mechanics and plumbing as well....

 

[Octopus]

Now..... which one of these products flagged up the "is the customer over 18?" for the till jockey?

That's the sense of the big shed management.

Isn't it the law to restrict these sales to people over 18?

 

[solarsavings]

I'm dreading retiring

 

[Pete999]

I'm dreading retiring

Why cuz of my post?

 

[telectrix]

I'm dreading retiring

then don't . i haven't and doubt i will fully retire.

 

[telectrix]

Why cuz of my post?

think it's coz he'll get roped into DIY.

 

[solarsavings]

No Pete, It's because in a few years I'm going to be retired and as was pointed out by TWC, I already spend too long on forums as it is.
Anyway, I should be tucked up in bed with the day I've just had.

 

[The Ghost]

With online outlets for electrical accessories it would be impossible to ban sale of them just at the two big outlets and would be unfair trading restrictions. I think the statutes and such are sufficient but the will to prosecute is not there. It is almost impossible to find such infractions of the law. Maybe they should have a notice to the building control when people are buying stuff that could infringe the law if they are buying/fitting it?

 

[markc123]

Don’t have a problem with have-ago-hero’s myself. If they want to tinker with electrical work and potentially cause injury / extensive damage to persons or property - let them. Common sense tells you when you’re out of your depth, and if you’re still going to tinker you deserve a belt.

And, when they do cause stuff the proper electricians get the dosh for sorting situations out.

What I don’t agree with is how quick and easily
It is to become and electrician these days, so many people call themselves electricians and don’t even know how to lift a floor board. The scams have ALOT to answer for allowing such people into the industry.