EICR 10% tested, rubber cables and passed?

[mattyevz]

Hi Guys,
Went to a customers house on Friday to fit some new light fittings ... Only to find rubber cables with no earths.

when I informed the customer he explained that only recently it had an EICR and passed .

On further investigation I discovered that a 16th edition consumer unit had been installed and the wires were extended from rubber to pvc with chocs to reach the MCBS!

Not only that the socket circuit was fed from a single 2.5 rubber fed from a 32amp MCB!

A couple of days later the customer found the report and the "electrician " only done 10% testing and charged £450!

Who can he report this to and he now needs a Rewire after recently decorating !The problem is the EICR is the non-registered internet type

cheers guys

 

[Leesparkykent]

You can't really report it to no one, Maybe trading standards but that's about it.

 

[mattyevz]

Worst Iv seen how do these people sleep at night !

 

[Octopus]

You can't really report it to no one, Maybe trading standards but that's about it.

Trading Standards is the customers only port of call.

Unless people do report shoddy work, the culprits will always get away with it.

 

[GMES]

Are the Cowboys details on the cert if so I agree with the guys on trading standards being the only option.

 

[7029 dave]

Well that is an hard lesson for the customer, I would never extend onto old vir cables ( they never pass the visal IME), so an rewire it is.

 

[Leesparkykent]

Worst Iv seen how do these people sleep at night !

It is bad. The problem is when it comes to EICR's most electrical contractors are willing to do them because there is money involved but there main line of work maybe in installation and an installation electrician doesn't necessarily make a good inspector/tester. Don't get me wrong some are but EICR's are a whole different ball game from what they normally do so end up coding things wrong. Then you have the other side that do specialise in EICR's and just LIM or N/V everything lol.

From what you have mentioned though it looks like straight out fraud and they may as well robbed the money straight out the customers pocket for what the EICR they have produced will be worth. Boils your wee doesn't it that they can more than likely just get away with it!

 

[mattyevz]

I felt gutted , when I Told them it needed rewiring after only finished decorating. Especially when they just had a passed EICR !

 

[Knobhead]

What testing did you do to reach the conclusion the whole place needs rewiring?

 

[th_walking_dude]

I think it massively discredits the Part P schemes (not hard) when you need to be registered to change a shower but not carry out an EIRC. I spoke to someone the other day who paid £700 for a CU change but the "installer" didn't do any testing or notify the works as he hadn't "fitted the wires himself" other than trading standards they could take them to small claims court but they would probably only be liable for the £450.00 if that.

 

[mattyevz]

Who said about a full Rewire ?
Cooker circuit seems ok

 

[Knobhead]

Who said about a full Rewire ?
Cooker circuit seems ok

So you haven’t done any testing. That would be 100% less than the guy you’re calling.

How much are you aiming to extract from the customer for your expertise?

 

[mattyevz]

I wasn't there to do a £450 EICR or didn't you read that post properly either?

If your comfortable wiring to rubber cables then that up to you.

 

[davesparks]

I wasn't there to do a £450 EICR or didn't you read that post properly either?

If your comfortable wiring to rubber cables then that up to you.

But you did tell the client that they need a rewire without carrying out any testing!

Why are you not comfortable with rubber cables? I use quite a bit of it and can't say I've ever had much trouble with it, I think the last time I installed any was a couple of weeks ago. Granted old rubber twin/twin&earth needs thoroughly inspecting and testing to ensure it is fit for continued operation and on the balance of probability is unlikely to be, but that's no reason to write it off without confirming it.

 

[mattyevz]

So the single rubber cable on a 32amp feeding the house and kitchen sockets you would try and save and downgrade to 16 amp?

 

[Darkwood]

So the single rubber cable on a 32amp feeding the house and kitchen sockets you would try and save and downgrade to 16 amp?

Your playing dumb here ... this was not the point that is been made .. yes you are correct to bring this up as an issue but your post made it sound like the customer requires a rewire just because its wired in tough rubber....

You should have done a full test along with a visual that may expose any degrading of the rubber then adviced accordingly, yes advise that the wiring is old and due for rewire but don't say its needed just because its old.

 

[Knobhead]

I was about to comment about be being old and knackered but then thought, “I’m still safe to do what I do.”

So I’ll not make the comment.

 

[mattyevz]

But to thoroughly make sure it's fit for purpose would you not need to inspect joints and junction boxes under floors?

 

[Darkwood]

But to thoroughly make sure it's fit for purpose would you not need to inspect joints and junction boxes under floors?

Isn't that the case for any cable new or old... an inspection is designed to give an overall view/idea of the installation condition... it is not practical to start ripping flooring up etc

Approaching the customer afterwards and explaining the test are good and inspection shows no issues but at the next convenient time you recommend that they consider replacing the old tough rubber with modern pvc expressing its only a recommendation at this point and the existing shows no signs of breakdown of the cables, this way you have informed the customer of the condition of the electrics along with your recommendations and you haven't turned around and just said it needs a rewire because its tough rubber.

One way is to use your professional stance to fully inform your customer and leave them understanding they options they have.
The other way is to scare and bully your customer into a corner making them feel they have no alternative because their cabling is too old to use..again using your position but not in a professional manner.