Has anyone got an apprentice

[oscar21]

If not, would you take one one?
for the second time and against my better wishes we have got one but my business partner always seems to have a family member that "wants to become an electrician". The first one was just hopeless and a wannabee gangster, only lasted a few months. This one started quite promising and has actually done a course at the local college although I'm not quite sure what his qualifications are but my god, his attention span is woeful and always on his phone every chance he gets away with. That woman from C4 summed it up perfectly when she said young people have the attention span of a tiktok video.

Personally I couldn't care less whether the younger generation learn anything or not, I don't see myself as some kind of Yoda who has to pass his knowledge on to future generations, its solely down to them if they want to learn anything or not so why do they have such an awful attitude to work, take today for eg, nearly an hour to 2nd fix a single twin socket (obviously been on his phone most of the time). We pay him £60 a day and to me its just money down the drain, in the time it takes to explain something to him I could have done it myself.

 

[littlespark]

Lazy apprentices have always been a thing… even before phones.

They’re only as good as the tradesman that’s teaching them… so if they have a habit of sitting in the van reading a paper, congregating at the wholesalers when there’s no need to go and generally dossing about…. Then the apprentice will pick up those habits….

Ok that’s talking about employees… it sounds like the OP is boss, so his work ethic will be more positive toward company.


You simply can’t expect a year one apprentice to be as quick to do a job compared with a guy with 20 years experience.


Taking on an apprentice is like any other employee… job interview. Tell them what you expect of them. Explain the “rules” concerning phones or other time wasting activity’s. (I’m thinking smokers here)
You could employ a time served guy who is just as lazy.


This could be some kids first job… and they need steered in the right direction… not just bawled at for being slow.

 

[James]

Rule 1
phone stays in the van whilst working on site.
you will get a bit of backchat about “what if it’s stolen, will you buy me a new one”

always shut that straight down with NO, it’s your responsibility if you are concerned, leave it at home.

Many sites i work at have a no phones allowed policy and I manage to survive for a few hours whilst working!

 

[DPG]

I think it's unfair to label all young people as lazy to be honest. Many will be keen to learn. And as above, a lot will depend on the attitude of the mentor as well.

 

[LeeH]

The country needs apprentices, there is such a skills shortage in engineering. We have 2 50k/y multi skilled jobs up for grabs and most applicants were terrible.

Had an interview yesterday at 1600 for 1 of the 3 short listed, and he didn’t show….

 

[Diddy]

Amazes me the amount of fully qualified adults who either can't be arsed to teach or just constantly moan about how ---- their apprentice is lol. With absolutely zero introspection. It's almost like saying "I have had 10 apprentices and they all turned out ---- at their jobs"...Sometimes it's the teacher's fault...infact most times it is. Again im no hero but I must have seen at least ten through their time and not one of them produced crap work nor were slower than average.
BTW not wanting to have an apprentice is fine....Just don't label all of them with the lazy tropes. Some of them will turn out better than any of us...thats just a basic fact of life.

 

[westward10]

I think "family member" may be the problem here.

 

[LukeD]

Kids from the age of 15 at school should be doing extra classes where they can get their hands dirty, mechanics, building, electrics etc etc . Real stuff not some daft 3 month course where a teacher teaches them only to change a fuse .Give the Kids a chance to see if they are into working in trades etc

 

[mainline]

Lol who brought these devils up in the first place or were they born like it? I have as mentioned above been "lucky" enough to have brought at least ten through their trade to completion. Among them they have all had growing up issues from 1st pint to first girl to preggers girl and drug use/issues. I didn't get them from some special place lol they were a very mixed bunch.
Earn respect, let them earn trust and respect, keep them motivated, show them that the day goes quicker and "can" end quicker if they find stuff to do if they have already been shown how. If they f-up rip it out do it again...If they show attitude then you simply enforce the rules of the work place. I had one lad who almost made it out the door...but he backed down when he saw that his belligerence was going to bugger up 3 years of his own hard work.
Give them stuff to do that will have them desperate to move on to the next more interesting stage....Or just keep moaning that "the youth of today......" I can assure you that every elder thought that of us as far back as we learned to moan lol.

I remember being shown how to wire a 2 way lighting circuit drawn on a black board he had the lamps wired in series.

 

[Intoelectrics]

Lol who brought these devils up in the first place or were they born like it? I have as mentioned above been "lucky" enough to have brought at least ten through their trade to completion. Among them they have all had growing up issues from 1st pint to first girl to preggers girl and drug use/issues. I didn't get them from some special place lol they were a very mixed bunch.
Earn respect, let them earn trust and respect, keep them motivated, show them that the day goes quicker and "can" end quicker if they find stuff to do if they have already been shown how. If they f-up rip it out do it again...If they show attitude then you simply enforce the rules of the work place. I had one lad who almost made it out the door...but he backed down when he saw that his belligerence was going to bugger up 3 years of his own hard work.
Give them stuff to do that will have them desperate to move on to the next more interesting stage....Or just keep moaning that "the youth of today......" I can assure you that every elder thought that of us as far back as we learned to moan lol.

I've had a mixed bag over the years, the more recent being the worst. I think it is a combination of poor education, by this I mean that discipline lacks and social attitudes. Many teenagers believe they are more entitled than they really are and when they hit the work life its a shock to the system. Social media doesn't help either, many think they deserve special treatment and that all good things should be handed to them without putting in the time, hard work and sacrifice.

As an example, the best apprentice we ever had came from a poor family where he was actually the main breadwinner and took responsibility taking care of his younger siblings. He learned very quickly that life is tough and the vast majority of us are not privileged, but have and continue to have to work hard to achieve and sometimes even just survive.

Obviously some are just decent kids wanting the chance, others are decent kids at heart but need some guidance or a reality check, some as always are and always will be just useless.

I honestly blame the current social and educational systems that are failing the young by being somewhat too soft, too lenient, too accepting... There is a lack of respect I'm not just talking about the sort we as elders might expect, I'm talking about a lack of respect for taking responsibility, letting go the expectation that they are entitled.

But, we should try and mentor as best we can and try and change their attitude, I'm sure many will come round in the end and they may look back as elders themselves and reflect on their own experiences as we do.

 

[Markyd]

Phone stays in the van or your gone

 

[Marvo]

Many years ago my business was registered with the government mentor/apprentice scheme. It was an absolute nightmare, the time dealing with the govt scheme red tape, the late and missing payments and the fact the scheme eventually went bankrupt meant the costs to the company snowballed far beyond what was anticipated. .............

..........The apprentices themselves were great, they put in the hours, were keen to learn and all progressed well. I still have contact with a couple of their families and teaching and watching them progress and develop as people as well as artisans was one of the most fulfilling things I've ever done but it was just in trying times unfortunately.

 

[Diddy]

@Marvo That is some serious bad luck on the apprentice's front. Also, the fact that the government funding didn't help is obviously a huge hindrance.

 

[nicebutdim]

Yeah, not bad luck...bad government unfortunately.

Think I might be missing something here. Three apprentices died or three apprenticeships?

 

[Diddy]

I kind of feel like adding.
I 1. Come from a poor --- family. Holidays in anything other than a 1 day bus trip just didn't happen...My dad was a steelworker until 1979.....
2. I also come from a "deprived" area.
So it kind of focussed my mind as to what trade did I want to get into, How was I going to ensure I was in the bunch to get a start.
I have helped electricians since I was 11 yo starting on council house renovations. I got to strip out the old...in return for the scrap. Every saturday @ 7.30am I was there...I can tell you now "we" were never richer than then.
Then at 16 I just wrote a bunch of letters and got 2 offers after tests/interviews. One from Scottish Power actually SSEB in them days. And the 2nd was a local SME upto 50 employees at the time and very varied work.
A great grounding in all the aspects was given to my by my eventual choice (The local contractors).
It wasn't all rosy though and there were some absolute arseholes in that firm, Bullies, People with ego's bigger than Elton John, Some were bitter and didn't like Catholics, others were bitter and didn't like protestants...My surname fits both...so because I NEVER got involved with either side I was often singled out for ----.
Small minds from a small town, But then I had some absolute gems of guys in that firm, Guys who had forgotten more than most know...those types If you meet them on a site my advice is stick to them like glue and try to soak up as much as you can.

I give tjis background to explain why I am fairly "proud" of the apprentices I helped through. I swore I never be "that Ego"...Id never blame the apprentice and id never do anything I wouldn't do to an adult.
I have had my moments. I have had a couple of the lads try to be "cute" or try to just push that wee bit to far. But a quiet chat and the pointing out of the obvious "only one of us can win this debate and it's NOT you" Go and have a think and come back to me in half hour. That sort of thing. I was NEVER going to have an apprentice of mine being labelled for poor workmanship, They soon found out that I was fond of saying "Take it out and redo it the way I said/have shown you"....It soon kicks in. "When your done go tidy up...if everything is tidy then come and see me".
I saw it as my responsibility I suppose thinking that the good guys who took the time to teach me did the same for me. If they had all looked down their noses and thought "He aint my problem" then I probably would never have stuck it out....Even the keenest of us struggle at 6am on a dark freezing winter morning when the van picks you up to go and work in -3 doing galv tube all day.
Im glad I stuck with it though and I feel as if I gave enough back during my on site days when I had those apprentices.
It's quite funny as I have opted to do 3 days a week on average doing my own domestic work as I get older. The other option would have been go teach in college....That terrified me and I also don't think I could put up with the attitude of 10-20 "kids" all at once all trying to gain an inch or a laugh....shudder. So I stuck with this lol.

 

[ninemaverickbars]

Whilst I'm a DIYer when it comes to electrical, I own a company in the construction industry. I can tell you that you are not alone when it comes to demotivated apprentices. Whilst we're not builders outside of DIY, we do routinely supervise developments and over the last few years, we have repeatedly heard complaints from trades relating to labourers and apprentices and also the difficulty of hiring anyone for the long term.

I don't believe young people are inherently lazy. What I do believe, is that they are so well connected via social media, that the terrible wages in the UK come as a shock because they are able to continually compare UK wages to foreign countries and also, their career choice to that of "influencers" who seem to make a lot of money for nothing. If, as an apprentice, you're aware of an average sort of person who makes 5x what you do for prancing about in front of a camera, thats going to be slightly demotivating.

A very good builder, who we've worked with on smaller projects for decades, recently told me that his company will retire with him, simply because he cannot find anyone competent to take over. His son isn't interested and none of the lads he's set on are anywhere near the caliber of person he wanted to continue the firm that carries his name. We will feel the loss of this company ourselves and it's another nail in the coffin of our local trades, which are becoming like hens teeth.

I myself had an emergency with a CU a year or so ago, which presented as very serious, but turned out not to be. Young lad we found via work contacts came out within an hour. 10pm at night. He was brilliant, just brilliant. Maybe 23, he had charm, logic, knowledge and dilligence. He asked for £100 for 2 hours. I could see the uncertainty in his face when we asked what we owed. We gave him £125 and still felt we'd almost robbed him given the urgent nature of the job. Told him about my line of work and that I'd be in touch, which seemed well received. Texted him with details of an easy but bigger job (mid 4 figures) a couple of weeks later. He never replied, even after a follow up. Unbeknownst to him, he's missed out on enough work since then that he could easily have started his own firm from the proceeds and then some. I just can't understand it. Maybe I'm just terrible to work for?

 

[oscar21]

Its the serious lack of attention span that our apprentice has got that baffles me, let alone being a phone addict. I was talking to him about my extension and he asked what rooms it would have, so I said one extra bedroom, one new bathroom and turn the existing bathroom into an en-suite. He said cool how many bedrooms will it be when finished, then said so how many bathrooms will it be, then said will any of them be en-suite.

 

[westward10]

Its the serious lack of attention span that our apprentice has got that baffles me, let alone being a phone addict. I was talking to him about my extension and he asked what rooms it would have, so I said one extra bedroom, one new bathroom and turn the existing bathroom into an en-suite. He said cool how many bedrooms will it be when finished, then said so how many bathrooms will it be, then said will any of them be en-suite.

Sounds par for the course.

 

[westward10]

Few years back doing a lighting upgrade in some offices lad said what's happening I said, go up to the first and get all the fittings from the boxes and start flexing them up all the gear is up there I'll be with you in a bit. Twenty minutes later I go up no sign of him, I eventually find him up on the second floor looking for the gear, the best part he had to walk past all the gear on the first floor. He turned out okay.

 

[oscar21]

The other thing thats annoying is, one he just takes your tools without telling you or asking you, so you spend 10 minutes looking high and low for your hammer that you know you just put down near you, and when he is finished with a certain tool he just leaves it on the ground where he was working, obviously expecting mummy to tidy up after him. Crazy.

We are told we need to treat kids like adults to get respect but from where I'm looking it seems we have to treat adults (which is what they are) like kids if we want them to do anything.