van advice

[growler]

im self employed and looking to upgrade my van. For tax reasons etc, can anyone give me any advice on the best way to get one ie leasing / buying. thanks.

 

[Guest55]

buying outright will give you the best tax return / allowance.

 

[Octopus]

Leasing MAY look attractive, but it'll never be yours, the monthly cost is set by mileage so if you go over you'll pay penalties, if you go under you'll have paid too much.

I'm with Biff, if you can go for a purchase, as new as possible, with a "life" of 4 years.

 

[Guest123]

I'll disagree with the above and say I will NEVER buy a van again.

My last 4 have all been VW on 3 year lease with a 75,000 mile allowance all servicing & breakdown cover included in the monthly cost. As I only have them for 3 years I dont have to worry about MOT's either.

Do the sums on depreciation of a new vehicle coupled with all running costs over say a 10 year period against leasing and there isn't much in it at all.

 

[telectrix]

now, i prefer to buy something older but tidy, under £1000 and run it till it falls apart. but that's probably coz i'm a tightarse.

 

[Octopus]

I'll disagree with the above and say I will NEVER buy a van again.

My last 4 have all been VW on 3 year lease with a 75,000 mile allowance all servicing & breakdown cover included in the monthly cost. As I only have them for 3 years I dont have to worry about MOT's either.

Do the sums on depreciation of a new vehicle coupled with all running costs over say a 10 year period against leasing and there isn't much in it at all.

But nobody suggested buying new did they?

Out of interest how did you do with your mileage?

 

[Cbigfoot]

it does depend on the lease agreement and its terms, I do not know the VW one but may look into it....

I did the figues on a ford lease and a transit came out nealry £4000 more expensive even when the loan intrest was factored in to buy one.

 

[Guest55]

But nobody suggested buying new did they?

Out of interest how did you do with your mileage?

good call.
i bet i get way better value for money buying a 3/4 year old van and running it over 4 years than with leasing over the same period.
what do you get at the end of your lease ? absolute squat.

 

[Guest123]

The OP is looking into leasing/buying, you cant compare buying 2nd hand to leasing a brand new one.

75,000 is just enough for me, I usually return them between 72-74.


If you're not in the market for new, you cant consider leasing.

 

[telectrix]

agree with biff. why buy something new that loses a couple of grand as soon as you drive it off the dealer's forecourt?

 

[Guest123]

what do you get at the end of your lease ?

Another new one.:waving:

 

[Silly Sausage]

now, i prefer to buy something older but tidy, under £1000 and run it till it falls apart. but that's probably coz i'm a tightarse.

Same here, take a hit to buy something decent and you're free from £xyz monthly payments.
You get depreciation relief, or whatever it's called, against you're tax bill (I think?!?)

 

[Guest55]

you may as well use taxi's to get to work.
;-)

 

[telectrix]

mine can't depreciate . it's worth more now than when i bought it 2 years ago.

 

[Silly Sausage]

All my vehicles end up in the scrapyard.
I think I've only sold on 2 or 3 in 30 years of driving.

 

[Guest123]

mine can't depreciate . it's worth more now than when i bought it 2 years ago.

Full tank of fuel now then has it???:dots:

 

[Silly Sausage]

Haha...or he just weighs it in.

 

[telectrix]

my last van but one was bought for £130. ran itr for 18 months, spent nowt but petrol and 2 tyres. MEB ( as it was then) reversed a wagon into it on site and creased the side panel. assessor said " beyond economical repair" and they gave me £450. bit of filler and an aerosol , fixed. 12 months later, sold for £250.

 

[Silly Sausage]

Should your name be...

Delectrix? :38:

 

[Anonomoose]

I was thinking about brand new but just cant bring myself to do it. the money lost driving off the forecourt is to much for me. leasing also cant get my head around. I know it works out simelar to buying new not having to worry about depreciation and stuff but the thought of not having anything at the end stops me doing it. In the end I got a 09 transit 44k miles. Not having to worry about scratches or dings is great.

 

[ExArmy]

buy something 5 years old with 100k on the clock. preferably a VW.

only lunatics lease vehicles. yes it's probably less hassle but you pay a lot for it, and you don't actually own anything. if someone reckons leasing is the way forward, are you currently renting your house, and do you hire out every pieice of equipment you need to do your job? it's less hassle, but you own NOTHING

 

[SYKRAPS]

I always buy on HP about a year old and keep them for 3 years then trade them in........accountants advice but I don't know why I just do as he tells me. Besides anything whats the point of owning anything if you are limited like me its a company asset not mine

 

[grantr37]

I was thinking about brand new but just cant bring myself to do it. the money lost driving off the forecourt is to much for me. leasing also cant get my head around. I know it works out simelar to buying new not having to worry about depreciation and stuff but the thought of not having anything at the end stops me doing it. In the end I got a 09 transit 44k miles. Not having to worry about scratches or dings is great.

not having to worry about scratches and dents is good, especially as on building site carparks your insurance (and any lease insurance) is pretty much useless, and there's Lorries, Diggers, cranes and all sorts going about.....like that mental labourer that they always let drive the telehandler forklift and ends up speeding around site....
I have seen an old banger passat, a brand new transit van and a brand new BMW car written off beyond repair in the last 10 years on building sites, 2 of them were on one site, and the old guy who owned the BMW (past retiring age but still welding and planning on packing it in within 2 - 3 years to go to his daughters in Australia to be with grand children) went outside the tea hut and fell down on his knees as his son had just bought him the car and matching private plate for cash......the insurance looked like it would be a problem....
park off site and the likelyhood is that some crook or another would break in to see what you've got inside....can't win, so always old second hand vans for work use...


when you lease a vehicle, is still belongs to a division of the manufacturer, they make the money they outlay back fast as they can build a van for £4,000 at the factory and lease it to you for that every year.....as opposed to selling it through 2 different greedy middle men/sales garages/transport companies for £12,000 and coming out with less for themselves whilst paying for the garage owners new merc.....they claim back for depreciation as well....then at the end of the agreement you can pay £5,000 odd to keep, which nobody wants to do....or they take it back, they will then charge you £700 for that scratch to get "re-sprayed" and for the forklift mark.....it ends up down at the nearest auction market selling for £1,500 minus the supposed respray....

 

[leo79]

I had a brand new Berlingo on Contract Hire for 3 years and vowed never to do it again.

At the end of the contract when the van was due to be sent back I had to pay to have 1st MOT carried out, full service, repair damaged under sill (which I knew about), repair dent in rear door etc.

All in it was going to cost me the best part of £2000 just to return the van, so I bit the bullet asked what they wanted for it and bought it off them. Not the best decision I've ever made but theres no way on earth I'm giving someone £2000 to take a van from me.

I'm looking at the moment for a new van and I'm buying outright this time.

Cheers

Leo

 

[drew35]

I just got a new van in April, pre reg off the internet £6000 cheaper than forecourt price. And now renting the outside as advertising space for £200 a month, has to be a new van up to three years. All done through an agency, they come to my house every month and put a new wrap on it, it protects the paint work, and over the three years that's £7200 earned, £9000+vat paid for the van.

And it has the new van smell... Hmmmm..... And no I never advertise my own business on my van.

 

[ExArmy]

I just got a new van in April, pre reg off the internet £6000 cheaper than forecourt price. And now renting the outside as advertising space for £200 a month, has to be a new van up to three years. All done through an agency, they come to my house every month and put a new wrap on it, it protects the paint work, and over the three years that's £7200 earned, £9000+vat paid for the van.

And it has the new van smell... Hmmmm..... And no I never advertise my own business on my van.

I didn't know you could do that, what sort of stuff are you advertising?

 

[ExArmy]

I always buy on HP about a year old and keep them for 3 years then trade them in........accountants advice but I don't know why I just do as he tells me. Besides anything whats the point of owning anything if you are limited like me its a company asset not mine

to be honest i never thought of that, so i'll retract my statement about lunatics. so what are the main differences between being a sole trader and limited from an accounting point of view?

 

[SYKRAPS]

The way it was explained to me was that if you are a limited company your personal assets are not linked to the limited business and therefore not at risk if you were to get into trouble financially as only assets of the limited company are at risk.

Also I think as a director you receive 10K income before class 2 NI is deductable but this may have changed and not 100% sure if this is still correct. I went limited in 2002 acting on advice from my accountant as I think many did that year.

 

[SYKRAPS]

I was also told by someone in the dim distant past that it was beneficial from a tax point of view to change your vehicle every year if you are a sole trader, not sure why maybe someone can enlighten me???

 

[Anonomoose]

The adverting thing sounds good just be worried you would drive a van with thrush creme or something on the side of your van

 

[alarm man]

it comes down to image too,the battered old van could say cowboy,the brand new one could say pro,thats not always the case,tho big companies spend thousands upon thousands to get the right image,vans,uniform,websites etc,and that sets the pace which everyone has to keep up to,a one man band can look and act like a big company with the right look,if that means a new stickered up van to set you apart its money well spent.

 

[1shortcircuit]

it comes down to image too,the battered old van could say cowboy,the brand new one could say pro,thats not always the case,tho big companies spend thousands upon thousands to get the right image,vans,uniform,websites etc,and that sets the pace which everyone has to keep up to,a one man band can look and act like a big company with the right look,if that means a new stickered up van to set you apart its money well spent.

See I always view trades with BRAND NEW vans as.... Charging too much lol

I am more than happy in my tidy looking Fiat Ducato that I purchased for the grand sum of £1625.50

REEEE-SULT.

It has a few dings in it but that doesn't bother me, the paint is good and comes up lovely after a good clean. The inside is like new still even with just over 100,000 on the clock.

I couldn't buy new, I wouldn't sleep at night with worry about getting a scratch. Even driving past and making contact with trees is enough to scratch the paint enough to pick up slight scratches

I had a rusty old Transit when I first started out, I used to park at the top of the street in the hope that the client did not spot me arriving lol That van did say cowboy so it had to go

 

[grantr37]

Buying or even renting a new van will make household punters and even small businesses think you have too much financial success and think about price haggling and heel dragging (like a dog going to the vet dragging its behind) and will also make you a shiny looking target for thieving types....oh look a nice new van I bet it has nice new kit inside......smash....grab...
I had a friend who kept his stuff in a nice shiny van and he got broken into and cleaned out....he taped a binbag over the window and said he would go to autoglass on friday (payday) , this was on wednesday night.......on thursday night somebody came along and torched his van right right outside his window at the B&B digs...the alarm didn't even go off, first he knew was the lady manager knocking his door.

If I was using a van for everyday use I would get something in quite good condition (but cheap and quite old)and either clear out my tools every night in storage boxes, or keep it in a Garage/big shed... for going out to do maintenance on Banks, Big supermarket/shop customers/ offices at companies etc then a good thing to do is go to enterprise rent-a-car or somewhere similar and rent a clean new minivan like a white Astra van or a Toyota or something (you can get them without the big green enterprise logo) and use that....this means that you can have something that is really clean and shiny (which they will think better of) and it will be small and maneuverable enough to get into all kinds of carparks and side lanes that a big van like a Ford transit or a Mercedes would be a bit too big for...you can also get magnetic temporary easy peel signs that you can put on with a Logo etc, but you don't need those unless you really want as all big/corporate companies care about is that they look shiny....you don't have to worry very much about damage or scrapes as long as you are not on the corporate customers fancy office/shop site on bin day....bin lorry drivers will just clatter the van, and bin men will just drag a wheelie bin right against it, you won't get anywhere complaining either as its council and they can get away with anything...
I have been on corporate office sites in the city centre where they have told people (via a warning from the Agency office)to bring a shiny new van or preferably a nice car or forget about parking on site, as they were worried that an old van anywhere within visual range would make them look bad, its a corporate thing where everything has to look "perfect" for vain passers by who may well be customers or even rivals....
when we arrived onsite at 6Am on the first day, the security guy gave us a pincode for the gate to use the onsite multi storey carpark, some people came 2 and 3 to a car and a few brought their own vans etc.....at about 8:30 Am a security desk woman appeared and said "who has such n such a van?" and told the man that the front desk security manager wanted to see him.....he went down and they told him to get his van out of the indoor carpark as it "looked bad" and they didn't want it sitting there rusting away next to mercs and BMW'S....he took it out and drove it down the road but refused to "get it away" and parked it about 150 yards down the road on a pay n display road where we could see it from the floor we were working on (7th floor) he was getting paranoid about it sitting there (so would I) as it had a lot of tools inside and was going up to the window every 5 minutes and looking at it, as well as running off on tea breaks to drive it around the block and back again and pay another £4 odd each time for a fresh voucher (2 hour limit) well he was looking between breaks (about an hour after buying a 2 hour ticket) and saw it going onto the back of a lorry, so he ran out and the "parking attendant" complete with a shoulder cam and a big man attitude told him that it was getting towed because "a CCTV operator seen what you did, you drove it around the block and took it back again and you are not allowed to do that"...... so I think for those kinds of vain customers who don't want an old van seen outside for image reasons,it is better to rent a clean new van for a day or two, they pay quite well but if you look scruffy you are out the door, these guys even had a dress code for workwear....

renting a van for this also means that you can take just the one toolbox or whatever you need for that day and take it inside the customer site with you, leaving the hire van empty...

 

[Guest123]

buy something 5 years old with 100k on the clock. preferably a VW.

only lunatics lease vehicles. yes it's probably less hassle but you pay a lot for it, and you don't actually own anything. if someone reckons leasing is the way forward, are you currently renting your house, and do you hire out every pieice of equipment you need to do your job? it's less hassle, but you own NOTHING

You really need to look into the 'business' side of being a spark before coming out with foolish statements like that again.

 

[Bubblecraft]

I started out with a Mk5 SWB Mid roof transit bought for £500. 4 months later I sold it for £600 & upgraded to a Mk6 MWB Mid roof transit with side rack which cost me £1200. A year later, I sold it for £1200 & bought a Mk7 EX LWB (Jumbo) High Roof for £7k. Still have it now & love it to bits. In the 2 years I've had it, it has required more than any of my older vans but with the things I've done like new rear springs, discs n pads all round, ECU update etc in the long run, they won't need done again anytime soon & I plan to hold onto it for a while longer.
On the down side though, I got tanned a few days after Xmas last year & they took all power tools & my ICE. The Mk7 transits have a security flaw which are easy to enter without the need to smash glass, cut looms, pry open doors etc. The worst is, they can even be driven off. They haven't got by the Mk6 security yet so that's still smash n grab so my advice would be simple. If you are interested in a transit, a Mk6 has better security than a Mk7 but better security can be added. The Mk7 can come 6 speed which works out better on fuel. The Mk7 is fully computerised which can be a pro & a con.

So its buying from me. Depending on the size of your company, it's really your choice what you wish to do.

 

[Spudnik]

Must admit, I am looking to change my van.

Haven't got a clue what to get or how to buy it.

 

[Octopus]

Must admit, I am looking to change my van.

Haven't got a clue what to get or how to buy it.

Lots of "constructive" advice on this thread!! lol