2011 pay rise

[flyingsausage]

Does anyone have anymore information on a pay rise for next year,I have read the 2011 Review on the Unite website but can't see anymore information there or know anyone that knows what is happening with the negotiations.You generally hear by this time in the year or get a ballot slip in

 

[ian.settle1]

Does anyone have anymore information on a pay rise for next year,I have read the 2011 Review on the Unite website but can't see anymore information there or know anyone that knows what is happening with the negotiations.You generally hear by this time in the year or get a ballot slip in

Your lucky you have a job at the moment if you read some of the postings on here some people have not had this years and some have even had a reduction.

 

[flyingsausage]

I wish I had a job then I could pay some off my bills

 

[mogga]

I know of at least one firm where last 2 wage rises havent gone through and they work overtime for single time only enhancement is time third for night shift

 

[flyingsausage]

I emailed thesjib today to ask about a pay rise and the reply was not to hold my breath

 

[Jimmy Boy]

While I genuinely welcome the minimum wage and it's yearly increases, odd how that hasn't been also frozen in line with the current financial crisis ?.
Whats a spark on the cards now ? ( I don't know ) 15-20 an hour ? Working in say Tesco's 5-7 an hour ? ( BTW that's not a dig my missis she does that and a good job she does as well ) so a very well qualified and responsible job is now only possibly double of a non skilled, just an observation not looking for arguments just opinions.

I might be down Wicks in the morning flogging boards to diyers lol

 

[flyingsausage]

The employers wanted to cancel the pay rise in January this year but the union held them to it so their getting their own back with not giving us one next year, what I'm thinking is they will do this for the next three years or so claiming the bad economic condition the country is in they can't afford to give us one.The approved rate is £14.35 an hour we are well under paid

 

[ian.settle1]

The employers wanted to cancel the pay rise in January this year but the union held them to it so their getting their own back with not giving us one next year, what I'm thinking is they will do this for the next three years or so claiming the bad economic condition the country is in they can't afford to give us one.The approved rate is £14.35 an hour we are well under paid

Opening up old wounds here but if it wasn't for the 5 week wonders in my opinion we would have been on lots more.

 

[supasparxs]

Opening up old wounds here but if it wasn't for the 5 week wonders in my opinion we would have been on lots more.

I totally agree,

 

[job76]

yep there is no pay rise this jan and only a 1% next year the ballto has gone in and most people got letters off unite union to tell them that the it was a no vote so now its back to the jib

 

[bugsy]

It's a case of supply and demand and thanfully due the governments policy on immigration and the become a sparky in 5 week tutors we are not in demand ( unless of course you specialise in a particular field )

 

[flyingsausage]

job76 the letter from the union clearly stated that the union members rejected the pay deal and that the employers were not interested in coming back to the table to talk about another offer.The pay rise offered was an insult to sparks when HVAC and the plumbers and pipefiters are getting a two year pay deal.So as it stands there is no pay rise,this suits the employers they can sit tight for the next two or three years and refuse to came to the table as it is saving them money.

 

[flyingsausage]

I know of at least one firm where last 2 wage rises havent gone through and they work overtime for single time only enhancement is time third for night shift

Sounds like you know sparks that work for the scumbags Forth Electrical Services, when I heard the rumor that they had went bust six weeks ago I was a very happy man at the thought of this bad lot were out the trade but it was just a rumor

 

[welshsparky82]

The JIB registered firm i am with are still paying us 2009 rates.. We all agreed back in 2009 to revert to 2008 rates due to the recession, and in january of 2010 we recieved our 2009 rates.
however this time around we havent recieved our 2010 rates.... and the funny thing is no one is willing to ask managment about this.

The recession and the lack of work out there, is making us all realise that our priorities rest with us being able to keep the jobs we are lucky to have... Unfortunatly it is a dog eat dog world out there when it comes to finding work.

I myself am grateful i am still in employment, regardless of the rate..

I also have the opinion that it is easier to find work when your in work. so i always keep my eyes open

 

[Phil Dumbrell]

Firms we work for have moved to pricework for for all subbies their way of hiding the fact that they have reduced our rates and guarantees them a profit as we take the loss if jobs overrun etc also 1 month payments take it or leave it I left it now working on agencies for less than going JIB rates its lose lose lose all round

 

[grantr37]

The agencies are all trying their luck now, as I said already I went to an interview which turned out to be 35 of us crammed into a room at a jobcentre, the Agency man scanned all our documents,had us fill in forms, got our bank details and even had the cheek to digital photograph all of us, then said (after advertising 14.50 an hour)"its like this, you will be doing sparky work, but on your contract you are a labourer,8 pounds an hour flat, no travel time or breaks, bring your own tools and PPE thats what the client wants.".....more like saying right I am going to charge sparky rates for you then pay you peanuts as I get 40% of the prfoits made in the year from my client accounts....and I'm going to fleece all of you..


I can see the agency being paid 20.00 per hour for you being there,paying you 8 pounds an hour, taking your Tax, National Insurance AND eployers national insurance off of you, then cooking the books with your expenses (when you try to claim a tax reduction) and keeping that as well..

then theres the fees for the Umbrella company-about 25 to 30 pounds a week (which the agency gets a % of as well for referring you)


And by LAW, the Agency is supposed to provide you with PPE including Steel toed boots, Hard Hat, a High vis vest, Gloves and safety Glasses.......they are supposed to be given money for this by the "Client" to buy it for you...what they do is tell you that you MUST buy/bring your own safety gear/ppe then they turn round to the comnpany and charge them 50 quid per worker for boots etc that are never issued and dont even exist...


so you get shafted on...

Rate of Pay

Expenses

Clothing and PPE, which the Agencies collect money for..

Double charged National Insurance

No Holiday pay

No sick pay

Sacked at the drop of a hat, with no reason given just because the gaffer has had a bad day or the man/woman at the agency doesnt like you for complaining about your treatment/rights...

Also when you are working and living in say, London, and the company says on Friday"next week on monday its Liverpool" see you there...they are as far as I know supposed to pay for fuel and Digs, but no company ever pays digs now and a lot of sparkies just suck it up and pay for it themselves to keep a job, this started about 3 years ago now and has a lot to do with agencies, people used to get their digs paid and a daily amount added to wages for food as it was an obligation for companies sending you away from home and your own house through no choice of your own, now its just tough luck...

I wonder if the Agencies are getting paid Digs and just keeping it as extra profit? I have never seen an agency worker driving an old car or wearing cheap clothes...

 

[flyingsausage]

The agencies are all trying their luck now, as I said already I went to an interview which turned out to be 35 of us crammed into a room at a jobcentre, the Agency man scanned all our documents,had us fill in forms, got our bank details and even had the cheek to digital photograph all of us, then said (after advertising 14.50 an hour)"its like this, you will be doing sparky work, but on your contract you are a labourer,8 pounds an hour flat, no travel time or breaks, bring your own tools and PPE thats what the client wants.".....more like saying right I am going to charge sparky rates for you then pay you peanuts as I get 40% of the prfoits made in the year from my client accounts....and I'm going to fleece all of you..


I can see the agency being paid 20.00 per hour for you being there,paying you 8 pounds an hour, taking your Tax, National Insurance AND eployers national insurance off of you, then cooking the books with your expenses (when you try to claim a tax reduction) and keeping that as well..

then theres the fees for the Umbrella company-about 25 to 30 pounds a week (which the agency gets a % of as well for referring you)


And by LAW, the Agency is supposed to provide you with PPE including Steel toed boots, Hard Hat, a High vis vest, Gloves and safety Glasses.......they are supposed to be given money for this by the "Client" to buy it for you...what they do is tell you that you MUST buy/bring your own safety gear/ppe then they turn round to the comnpany and charge them 50 quid per worker for boots etc that are never issued and dont even exist...


so you get shafted on...

Rate of Pay

Expenses

Clothing and PPE, which the Agencies collect money for..

Double charged National Insurance

No Holiday pay

No sick pay

Sacked at the drop of a hat, with no reason given just because the gaffer has had a bad day or the man/woman at the agency doesnt like you for complaining about your treatment/rights...

Also when you are working and living in say, London, and the company says on Friday"next week on monday its Liverpool" see you there...they are as far as I know supposed to pay for fuel and Digs, but no company ever pays digs now and a lot of sparkies just suck it up and pay for it themselves to keep a job, this started about 3 years ago now and has a lot to do with agencies, people used to get their digs paid and a daily amount added to wages for food as it was an obligation for companies sending you away from home and your own house through no choice of your own, now its just tough luck...

I wonder if the Agencies are getting paid Digs and just keeping it as extra profit? I have never seen an agency worker driving an old car or wearing cheap clothes...

I agree with every word you say Grant.Working for an agency means you are getting ripped off.You should be getting an extra £1.50 above the rate to take into account holiday pay.
I have had a few bad experiences with some agencies not getting paid,getting pumped with no notice etc and I have to learn from this.And I now advoid certain ones.
I have been noticing in certain weeks different agencies advertising the same job and the rates varying from £13 to £16 an hour between the agencies.You can tell from this which ones are just legal crooks.It is better to stick to the bigger national or international ones as you are at least going to get the approved rate.
On the subject off the PPE you are classed as self employed if you get paid through an umbrella company and would have to supply your own.Last year I was working agency and asked the company I was working for a new pair off overalls and the gaffers face was a picture as he had no intention of getting me any.It would have just taken him a couple of minutes on the phone to order me up some.
Another point is all the different courses and tickets for different jobs now.I missed out one two jobs last week,one was as I didn't have a one day first aid certificate and another which was advertising for COmpex sparks but wanted the dust part as well as the gas.And this week I missed out on a job for water treatment as I do not have a confined spaces ticket.
I spent hours on the phone yesterday asking for a company or agency (scumbags) to put me through the PTS for railway work and drew a blank at getting anyone to put me through it.The nearest I got was one company would sponser me if I paid for it myself £252 and I need a medical and drugs and alchol test £120 before I do the course £372 just to try to get a chance of a job and the ticket only lasts for two or three years I think.There is a growing industry in training men up when will it stop as no company wants to pay for anything.
For my two cents worth thefuture is bleak or the working man in the electrical trade the hundreds of times I send out a cv and apply for jobs and get no response back makes me wonder is it worth it.You do feel worthless after a while on the dole and wonder if you will ever work again.The short term attitude with most companies now is shocking in the least the amount off sparks leaving the trade must be huge.And you like to think that there will be a shortage of sparks in the future but it won't happen with all the labourers doing installation work now.
If I was ten years younger I would be looking to leave this country for somewhere better

 

[Apollo]

I must say its not just agencies that rip off the average sparky.

I sub'd out a very large piece of work this year as I was Project managing the Job and speaking to the guys on the ground and listening to them moan and whine about their pay, knowing full well what I was paying the firm for each employee...

I told them, and they were not supprised!!! Just "took it on the chin" so to speak!!!

I suppose it depends how high up the food chain you are as to what you earn????

 

[grantr37]

well I have been told I need a 3 day first aid course for about a dozen or so jobs now, I asked a few companies about it and the cheapest I have been offered was 375pounds plus vat (about 500 pounds) also I have had the PTS (Personal Track Safety course) problem, I was allowed to work on the railway in 2007 without one as it suited Network-R, now I cant get work on the rail and the Agencies speak to me like floor scum when I ask about Rail jobs because I don't have a PTS card.....if you want to rewire a grocery shop in a train station now they demand a PTS card...this is valid for 1 year nowadays as far as I know, I have asked about with various different companies and they have either told me that they don't do it, or that it will cost about 1000pounds for a 1 day course and that I have to be already working for a Rail maintenance company or train operator...so cant be allowed to do it..
As well as this the agencies quite often ask for an access to substations certificate if their advert says that it will be working on a low voltage switch room......and for an Authorisation card from a power company (which you only get if you work for them books in) to do meter installations....its quite funny because I have met a Council office worker who left and got a Job at S-SE because his big sister was going with a manager there, he did a 2 week basic course for which he was sent to their head office, then he was straight out on the tools with a company van and a plastic arc flash visor changing meters in houses and businesses...and doing homers..

The Agencies dont care how you pay for the Tickets/safety passes/3 day courses all they do is say to their customer (mug) that another mug (us) "is fully trained and qualified to their highest standards" I wouldnt be surprised if they tell them that they trained you themselves or paid for it for you in their patter....

Agencies get paid more for a worker with a first Aid certificate, and dont pass it on, I think the law actually says that a first aider is supposed to get an extra 1 pound 50 an hour, the HSE and Government made it a requirement to try and encourage people to do a first aid with small wage rise incentives to boost site health and safety........all that happens is that somebody else pockets it and doesnt crack a light...

I watched a sparky come on site once who had done some kind of advanced first aid course(something like 2 weeks with an oil rig or something) he never got paid any extra and was told several times to his face that the only reason he was there was his first aid certificate as he was the only one on site and they had to have him there......then I watched him get pumped (paid off) when an agency supplied a European with a 1 day first aid ticket that they had done themselves (on 7 pounds an hour) I watched him getting some verbal from the contracts manager, told to fill in his time sheet then at 12:30 on a Tuesday it was shoved into the Fax machine in front of him at the reception girls front desk (manager- "I hope you dont have any of our tools in your car"-) right away you go, and good luck with your future jobs......shuffles off into car park sulking and gone...

 

[flyingsausage]

Just read this thread and reminded of how I hate the lying agency scum.