Discuss EV Charger Installation - Cabling Query? in the Electric Vehicles Advice Forum area at ElectriciansForums.net

Welcome to ElectriciansForums.net - The American Electrical Advice Forum
Head straight to the main forums to chat by click here:   American Electrical Advice Forum

Hi,

We had a EV charger installed recently over the past day ie 32amp 7.2kw. In the fuse cupboard I’ve attached before and after photos.
I have a 100amp fuse for the house.

For the new EV board setup, should the 2 grey cables entering the EV board (10mm) be the same 25mm thickness as the other cables?

Would this cause any issues for me? Or is this against certain electrical standards?
Someone mentioned to me if I was to change the meter or DNO were to action any new improvements, that I’d have to get these 10mm cables changed before any work would be carried out in the future?

I have yet to settle on the work, so if there’s non standard work complete here due to this, I would be in a position to highlight and query the relevant electrical company. I would appreciate any advise?

Please excuse, as my knowledge in electrical stuff is non existent. It maybe that all is looks fine, and I’ve been given wrong advise.

Regards,
HY

View attachment 51231

View attachment 51232
As the others have said the 10mm tails are absolutely fine. They meet the existing regulations as the maximum demand they can ever be expected to need is 32A. They also meet the requirements for fault protection.

I realise you have mentioned a number of times that 'someone' has told you they need to be 25mm but they do not. They would need to be 25mm if they were supplying your main consumer unit (even then they may not need to be).

I would be more concerned with whether an earth rod has been installed for this install. The EO website makes no mention that their unit can be used with the earthing supply you have (i.e PME) and therefore you should have had an earth rod installed. In fact the following link by EO states clearly you should have an earth rod installed for use with their unit.

lastly, it's easy for us to make mistakes as we are not there. I would ask the electrician who installed it if he has installed an earth rod and if not then why? He would hopefully quote one of the 3 exceptions from BS7671 722.411.4.1 but I think this is unlikely.
 
As the others have said the 10mm tails are absolutely fine. They meet the existing regulations as the maximum demand they can ever be expected to need is 32A. They also meet the requirements for fault protection.

I realise you have mentioned a number of times that 'someone' has told you they need to be 25mm but they do not. They would need to be 25mm if they were supplying your main consumer unit (even then they may not need to be).

I would be more concerned with whether an earth rod has been installed for this install. The EO website makes no mention that their unit can be used with the earthing supply you have (i.e PME) and therefore you should have had an earth rod installed. In fact the following link by EO states clearly you should have an earth rod installed for use with their unit.

lastly, it's easy for us to make mistakes as we are not there. I would ask the electrician who installed it if he has installed an earth rod and if not then why? He would hopefully quote one of the 3 exceptions from BS7671 722.411.4.1 but I think this is unlikely.

I'm pretty certain there is no external earth rod installed for this.
As the unit has been installed for use internally; is this perhaps the reason why no earth rod was installed or required?
 
It's just that some "others" have specifically mentioned that tails need to be rated at 100AMP i.e. 25mm cabling; this was my initial concern?
So hence, I just wanted to clarify this?

Yes, lots of people get their regulations knowledge this way, by listening to 'others' who loudly proclaim their version or (mis) understanding of the rules as the truth.

There is a guide to the regulations which has a picture of a 'typical' domestic supply with 25mm tails feeding a single consumer unit which then supplies the whole installation. Many people fail to understand that this is just an example of a typical installation.
 
Yes, lots of people get their regulations knowledge this way, by listening to 'others' who loudly proclaim their version or (mis) understanding of the rules as the truth.

There is a guide to the regulations which has a picture of a 'typical' domestic supply with 25mm tails feeding a single consumer unit which then supplies the whole installation. Many people fail to understand that this is just an example of a typical installation.

This was one of the main reasons why I posted on here, as i'd be more confident in getting the truth than from others without an electrical background....and only knowing some knowledge which is rather dangerous. As I didn't know any better, thought this would be the best course of action.

However, it is interesting that a point was raised on the appropriate earthing? If my install was used outside, then I would no doubt want to ensure that a separate earthing rod was installed. As it is used internally, are we saying that we still need an earthing rod? or is that where the exception occurs which is why the installer did not quote or require this?
 
I'm pretty certain there is no external earth rod installed for this.
As the unit has been installed for use internally; is this perhaps the reason why no earth rod was installed or required?
Is it possible to charge the vehicle when it is parked outside? Will the charge lead reach? If so it must be TT

Or does the vehicle have to be parked fully in the garage for the lead to reach? If so pme is fine.
 
Is it possible to charge the vehicle when it is parked outside? Will the charge lead reach? If so it must be TT

Or does the vehicle have to be parked fully in the garage for the lead to reach? If so pme is fine.

Firstly, when I requested the install I obviously didnt know of these requirements on earthing etc.
I asked the installer that I wanted the charging unit internally within the garage and also stated on the given location of the unit. The unit sits next to the garage door from the inside.
When i use the charger i've always planned to use this internally - so car is fully parked inside.

However, to answer your question. It would be technically possible to charge the car outside provided that the car is reversed into the driveway and the garage door remains open.
I don't know if it would be possible to close the garage door and have the cabling routed outside to charge - as this might cause damage of the cabling?

Note that I don't actually have my car delivered yet, so I cant even charge it at this stage.
 
The whole instal looks to be to a very good standard. I think the installer has done well and despite my previous post I wouldn’t be too concerned.

I did the EV charge course and the one thing that seemed contradictory was the placement internally of a charge point. If it’s parked inside on a pme the charge point should be pme if it’s parked outside it should be TT.

What happens if it’s both as yours is?
In theory changing the whole of the installation to TT which is way over the top. I don’t like that solution at all.

For this reason and other points I won’t go into I don’t install these units until a better safety system has been designed and built into the units.
 
The whole instal looks to be to a very good standard. I think the installer has done well and despite my previous post I wouldn’t be too concerned.

I did the EV charge course and the one thing that seemed contradictory was the placement internally of a charge point. If it’s parked inside on a pme the charge point should be pme if it’s parked outside it should be TT.

What happens if it’s both as yours is?
In theory changing the whole of the installation to TT which is way over the top. I don’t like that solution at all.

For this reason and other points I won’t go into I don’t install these units until a better safety system has been designed and built into the units.

To be fair with the installer, it was me that stated that location. As the car charge port is located on the rear left side of the car. So naturally the best place was to have the charger where I've stated. As my car will be parked inside all of the time, this was the deciding factor of having the unit inside the garage.
But at the sametime, i thought the location I've picked gives me some flexibility if I wanted to use this to charge the car outside. However, at the time I was not aware of the earthing requirements until now. So unlikely to use it outside and remain to charge indoors.

Is there a large cost to install an earthing rod for this application?
Also, curiously what are the risks if the unit is using PME and one was to charge outside?

Thanks
 
I'm pretty certain there is no external earth rod installed for this.
As the unit has been installed for use internally; is this perhaps the reason why no earth rod was installed or required?
This is a good point. Section 722 only says PME earthing shall not be used if the charge point is located externally OR if it is located internally and is used to charge a vehicle located outdoors.
If you only ever intend to charge the car in the garage then I guess this is ok.
I’d be interested in others thoughts on this?
 
I agree it's location is a bone of contention but then again wherever it's location like any other socket on a ground floor level it could be used out of doors.
 
This is a good point. Section 722 only says PME earthing shall not be used if the charge point is located externally OR if it is located internally and is used to charge a vehicle located outdoors.
If you only ever intend to charge the car in the garage then I guess this is ok.
I’d be interested in others thoughts on this?

Would like to know too now! Does it still mean charging the car outside from the inside unit is still a no-no?

Again, what are the risks in doing so?
 
I agree it's location is a bone of contention but then again wherever it's location like any other socket on a ground floor level it could be used out of doors.

I do this all the time, for the lawnmower....as I don't have an external socket - use an internal socket connected to an extension reel.
 
Would like to know too now! Does it still mean charging the car outside from the inside unit is still a no-no?

Again, what are the risks in doing so?
It does mean charging the vehicle outside is a 'no no'. I 'think' it also means the vehicle should not even be capable of being charged outside if PME is used.
Here is an article that you will find interesting and it explains the risks associated with using PME earthing.
 

Attachments

  • EV charhing and PME.pdf
    287.8 KB · Views: 26
if the prohibition of PME for EV chargers is to eliminate risk if the supply N is lost (as with metalclad caravans) the I can't see any reason to differentiate between inside or outside. a fault occuring would have a similar result, in or out. then, i have not done any research on EV so my knowledge is limited.
 
This is a good point. Section 722 only says PME earthing shall not be used if the charge point is located externally OR if it is located internally and is used to charge a vehicle located outdoors.
If you only ever intend to charge the car in the garage then I guess this is ok.
I’d be interested in others thoughts on this?

I've never looked in any detail at the EV chargers regulations as ive never needed to yet. My thoughts are only based on my logic and what i've seen on the forum.

I assume the desire to connect the chargers to a TT earthing system relates to the car being connected to the installation earth whilst charging and thus becoming live during a PEN failure when connected to PME.
So if the car is inside then it becomes a big piece of exposed earthed metal whilst charging, so if it was connected to a TT system whilst the rest of the installation is connected to PME then the car would be an extraneous part to the installation introducing a dangerous earth potential.
 
As long as the installer made you aware that the car must only be charged inside then it's all good. Maybe a sticker stating this on the charger itself as a reminder would have been a good idea too.
 
As long as the installer made you aware that the car must only be charged inside then it's all good. Maybe a sticker stating this on the charger itself as a reminder would have been a good idea too.

Actually, when the installation team of 2 were out here. I did query about the cabling size to see if there was any possibility in charging the car outside, with the garaged closed (concerned that the cabling would not accommodate?). Installer didn't say or point out this concern; instead is was actually suggesting that my cabling could potentially fit through the side gap in the garage to allow outside charging! So makes you wonder eh?
 

Reply to EV Charger Installation - Cabling Query? in the Electric Vehicles Advice Forum area at ElectriciansForums.net

OFFICIAL SPONSORS

Electrical Goods - Electrical Tools - Brand Names Electrician Courses Green Electrical Goods PCB Way Electrical Goods - Electrical Tools - Brand Names Pushfit Wire Connectors Electric Underfloor Heating Electrician Courses
These Official Forum Sponsors May Provide Discounts to Regular Forum Members - If you would like to sponsor us then CLICK HERE and post a thread with who you are, and we'll send you some stats etc
This website was designed, optimised and is hosted by Untold Media. Operating under the name Untold Media since 2001.
Back
Top
AdBlock Detected

We get it, advertisements are annoying!

Sure, ad-blocking software does a great job at blocking ads, but it also blocks useful features of our website. For the best site experience please disable your AdBlocker.

I've Disabled AdBlock